Defense let us down!
 

[LEFT]The offense looked great today, but the defense was just terrible. Please don't blame Betts for the loss, if the defense could've held up to its end of the bargain we would have won big![/LEFT]

Re: Defense let us down!
 

And if Betts could have *held on* to his end of the bargain, we win.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=cpayne5;263329]And if Betts could have *held on* to his end of the bargain, we win.[/quote]

True, but we had a two touchdown lead in the 3rd Quarter, the defense played like crap, and let the Rams get right back into it. It should've never come down to that Betts play.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

And if the Defense could have made more than 2 stops the entire 2nd half maybe we could have won. 500+ total yards give me a break.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

Yeah, the D played poorly, but guess what? They do that every single week now. I'm tired of Betts getting a pass on 2! fumbles that cost them games this season. The first one was against Tampa that would have put them ahead. Don't blame Betts? If he holds on, they win the f*ckin game! If the D stands up they win, too, yes. However, we could also make the case that if the coaching staff calls heads on the coin toss the Skins win the game. Ladell lost the football game with that fumble. Period. If he holds on to the football we don't put the D in that position. So, I don't wanna hear, don't blame Betts cause it shouldn't have come down to that. It shouldn't have come down to the D needing to get a stop. All he had to do was not fumble, but what does he do for the 6th time this season? Fumble the damn ball! What does he do on the second potential fourth quarter go ahead drive? Fumble! Tell me about how much better than Portis he is now...

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=jdlea;263341]Yeah, the D played poorly, but guess what? They do that every single week now. I'm tired of Betts getting a pass on 2! fumbles that cost them games this season. The first one was against Tampa that would have put them ahead. Don't blame Betts? If he holds on, they win the f*ckin game! If the D stands up they win, too, yes. However, we could also make the case that if the coaching staff calls heads on the coin toss the Skins win the game. Ladell lost the football game with that fumble. Period. If he holds on to the football we don't put the D in that position. So, I don't wanna hear, don't blame Betts cause it shouldn't have come down to that. It shouldn't have come down to the D needing to get a stop. All he had to do was not fumble, but what does he do for the 6th time this season? Fumble the damn ball! What does he do on the second potential fourth quarter go ahead drive? Fumble! Tell me about how much better than Portis he is now...[/quote]

No debating with you who's starting for us at RB next season. Yeah, Portis probably wouldn't have done that, but I still think Betts looks great and our defense just plain sucks.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

I unquestionably put more of the blame on the defense than Betts. The defense was pathetic. But, as good as Betts was playing, he has an uncanny knack for fumbling when it really hurts.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=ncskinsfanec;263348]No debating with you who's starting for us at RB next season. Yeah, Portis probably wouldn't have done that, but I still think Betts looks great and our defense just plain sucks.[/QUOTE]

There's no doubt the D is garbage, but they've been garbage all year. They shouldn't have been in that position. All he has to do is NOT fumble. His strengths are: 1. running to daylight 2. Going down when the first defender touches him and 3. Fumbling the football.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=jdlea;263341]Yeah, the D played poorly, but guess what? They do that every single week now. I'm tired of Betts getting a pass on 2! fumbles that cost them games this season. The first one was against Tampa that would have put them ahead. Don't blame Betts? If he holds on, they win the f*ckin game! If the D stands up they win, too, yes. However, we could also make the case that if the coaching staff calls heads on the coin toss the Skins win the game. Ladell lost the football game with that fumble. Period. If he holds on to the football we don't put the D in that position. So, I don't wanna hear, don't blame Betts cause it shouldn't have come down to that. It shouldn't have come down to the D needing to get a stop. All he had to do was not fumble, but what does he do for the 6th time this season? Fumble the damn ball! What does he do on the second potential fourth quarter go ahead drive? Fumble! Tell me about how much better than Portis he is now...[/quote]

You do realize were a 5-10 team right? Why do people keep venting like were a playoff team, we had no shot at the playoffs and we lost to a team that does. Ladell had one bad play and it may have happen to cost us the game, but i dont agree with you there, Ladell did more too win this game than he did too lose, he should never had been in that position to begin with, the defense continues too give games away, and for some reason Al Saunders doesnt understand that a 2 TD lead doesnt mean the games over, dont put this on Ladell because your pissed off, look at all the good things he has done.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=jdlea;263350]There's no doubt the D is garbage, but they've been garbage all year. They shouldn't have been in that position. All he has to do is NOT fumble. His strengths are: 1. running to daylight 2. Going down when the first defender touches him and 3. Fumbling the football.[/quote]

No, the offense shouldn't have had to been in the position to have to come back and win the game for us. We had a stinkin 14 point lead midway through the 3rd quarter with our offense rolling, and then the defense gives up that long touchdown to Jackson on third down, and then another one shortly thereafter. If the defense could've made some stops, we would've won big. I mean whoever heard of Marc Bulger making a thirty yard run, ridiculous!

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=GiantsSuck703;263352]You do realize were a 5-10 team right? Why do people keep venting like were a playoff team, we had no shot at the playoffs and we lost to a team that does. Ladell had one bad play and it may have happen to cost us the game, but i dont agree with you there, Ladell did more too win this game than he did too lose, he should never had been in that position to begin with, the defense continues too give games away, and for some reason Al Saunders doesnt understand that a 2 TD lead doesnt mean the games over, dont put this on Ladell because your pissed off, look at all the good things he has done.[/quote]

Well said!

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=jdlea;263350]There's no doubt the D is garbage, but they've been garbage all year. They shouldn't have been in that position. All he has to do is NOT fumble. His strengths are: 1. running to daylight 2. Going down when the first defender touches him and 3. Fumbling the football.[/quote]

How many times has he fumbled this year? I believe its twice. You honestly have to stop with this "Betts lost us the game crap". He gave us a 2 TD lead and your still bitching about him losing the game for us, sometimes I wonder if people just bitch for the sake of bitching, because im sure you were arguing with friends last week about how good Ladell is, just shut up already!

Re: Defense let us down!
 

First of all, a big reason I'm pissed is because of all the beer I've been drinking. Second, the D is doing exactly what I expect them to do, namely, be a sorry excuse for an NFL defense. That's what they've done all year, so it's hard for me to get pissed about the D doing what they always do. The offense should realize the D sucks and try to outscore other teams. That's about all they can do. Take on the Colts philosophy or something, I don't know. I'm really pissed at Betts because people act like he's some kind of savior when in his 5 100 yard games I think they've had 2 wins and he went on to fumble this one away. We can run around in circles talking about stops and TD's, so I'm not gonna go there, but if he doesn't fumble they win. Period. Like I said in another thread, if the Skins call heads then they probably win. The D is bad, I concede that, for the 1000000th time this season. That just makes me put more owness on the O to step up and not put them in positions like Ladell did today.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

We would've probably been blown out if it wasn't for Betts! Get off his back already!

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=GiantsSuck703;263356]How many times has he fumbled this year? I believe its twice. You honestly have to stop with this "Betts lost us the game crap". He gave us a 2 TD lead and your still bitching about him losing the game for us, sometimes I wonder if people just bitch for the sake of bitching, because im sure you were arguing with friends last week about how good Ladell is, just shut up already![/QUOTE]

No, I never argued about the greatness of Ladell Betts, so read the site and get your facts straight! No, he's fumbled 6 goddamn times this season! What are you even talking about? Why don't you look up some stats before you decide to try to attack someone. And you know what? Clinton scores a TD on that play because he has breakaway speed...

Whatever, you guys are all right! 6 fumbles in one season where you've started upwards of 6 games should be totally excusable, especially considering 2 of them cost you a chance to win a football game. And if they don't, all of a sudden, they're 7 - 8 with a shot, albeit unlikely, of sliding into the playoffs, however undeserved it may be. So don't act like it didn't mean anything.

I've been consistent with my skepticism of Betts all year. How about you look that up before you try to accuse me of changing my tune.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

Ladell Betts, in limited action this season, is tied with JP Losman (a guy who is more prone to fumble because he gets blindsided and touches the football more) for second most fumbles this season. He only trails Andrew Walter (another QB in the same boat as Losman). Wow, kinda puts that into perspective...

Re: Defense let us down!
 

I am forced to agree...lets be serious for a second...defensively we are a joke...Although Andre Carter is looking like a real player...however, anyone who can't stop this mindboggling support of Betts needs to look at their football knowledge...I dont know how many of you played Division I Football but I have (which is probably why I dont post a lot here because I thinkthat there are only a few of you I read who regularly make any football sense). Betts has cost us another game...first, if I had the holes he had I could run for 1000, not one of those 1000 yards goes to him it is his offensive line...when have you ever seen Betts put a move on someone. Second, he is the most fragile runner I've ever seen who goes down at the slightest bit of contact. Third, he can't pass block to save his butt. Fourth, can all of that "should we move portis crap" if he was healthy with the way the offensive line was playing he'd have 3, 000 yards. Fifth, if we were smart we would have traded Betts butt and tried like hell to sign a beast in Duckett; for real, who gives a crap if Betts can catch out of the backfield if someone ain't open with the damn recievers we have everyone should be cut...we shouldn't NEED a pass catching back!!! Betts should have beed traded!!!!

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=jdlea;263361]No, I never argued about the greatness of Ladell Betts, so read the site and get your facts straight! No, he's fumbled 6 goddamn times this season! What are you even talking about? Why don't you look up some stats before you decide to try to attack someone. And you know what? Clinton scores a TD on that play because he has breakaway speed...

Whatever, you guys are all right! 6 fumbles in one season where you've started upwards of 6 games should be totally excusable, especially considering 2 of them cost you a chance to win a football game. And if they don't, all of a sudden, they're 7 - 8 with a shot, albeit unlikely, of sliding into the playoffs, however undeserved it may be. So don't act like it didn't mean anything.

I've been consistent with my skepticism of Betts all year. How about you look that up before you try to accuse me of changing my tune.[/quote]

I honestly cant believe you think its ok for the defense too suck but not OK for Betts too have a mistake, it happens, even the great ones fumbled, the guy has racked up over 1,000 yards in half a season, Im not pushing for Betts to start over Portis and never will, but stop putting the loss on a guy that rushed for 129 yards and 2 TD, not to mention that was his fifth straight 100 yard game

I dont know if you know this or not, but the D gave up over 600 yards today, damn betts only if you could have scored five more TDs you wouldnt suck so much, and only if Randle El was psychic, he should have known it would have been heads, please just stop talking, your really making your self look worse and worse each time

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=Skins4Eva;263371]I am forced to agree...lets be serious for a second...defensively we are a joke...Although Andre Carter is looking like a real player...however, anyone who can't stop this mindboggling support of Betts needs to look at their football knowledge...I dont know how many of you played Division I Football but I have (which is probably why I dont post a lot here because I thinkthat there are only a few of you I read who regularly make any football sense). Betts has cost us another game...first, if I had the holes he had I could run for 1000, not one of those 1000 yards goes to him it is his offensive line...when have you ever seen Betts put a move on someone. Second, he is the most fragile runner I've ever seen who goes down at the slightest bit of contact. Third, he can't pass block to save his butt. Fourth, can all of that "should we move portis crap" if he was healthy with the way the offensive line was playing he'd have 3, 000 yards. Fifth, if we were smart we would have traded Betts butt and tried like hell to sign a beast in Duckett; for real, who gives a crap if Betts can catch out of the backfield if someone ain't open with the damn recievers we have everyone should be cut...we shouldn't NEED a pass catching back!!! Betts should have beed traded!!!![/quote]


Well since you played Division 1 football and you think you have more Knowledge than anyone else, tell me how its Betts fault when your defense gives up over 600 yards of offense and 37 points?

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=Skins4Eva;263371]I am forced to agree...lets be serious for a second...defensively we are a joke...Although Andre Carter is looking like a real player...however, anyone who can't stop this mindboggling support of Betts needs to look at their football knowledge...I dont know how many of you played Division I Football but I have (which is probably why I dont post a lot here because I thinkthat there are only a few of you I read who regularly make any football sense). Betts has cost us another game...first, if I had the holes he had I could run for 1000, not one of those 1000 yards goes to him it is his offensive line...when have you ever seen Betts put a move on someone. Second, he is the most fragile runner I've ever seen who goes down at the slightest bit of contact. Third, he can't pass block to save his butt. Fourth, can all of that "should we move portis crap" if he was healthy with the way the offensive line was playing he'd have 3, 000 yards. Fifth, if we were smart we would have traded Betts butt and tried like hell to sign a beast in Duckett; for real, who gives a crap if Betts can catch out of the backfield if someone ain't open with the damn recievers we have everyone should be cut...we shouldn't NEED a pass catching back!!! Betts should have beed traded!!!![/quote]

Are you serious "trade Betts and sign a beast like Duckett" amazing, your football knowledge is a little overblown, maybe you shouldnt post anymore after rediculous comments like that, maybe you did play Div. 1 football but your head definately got knocked around one to many times!

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=GiantsSuck703;263373]I honestly cant believe you think its ok for the defense too suck but not OK for Betts too have a mistake, it happens, even the great ones fumbled, the guy has racked up over 1,000 yards in half a season, Im not pushing for Betts to start over Portis and never will, but stop putting the loss on a guy that rushed for 129 yards and 2 TD, not to mention that was his fifth straight 100 yard game

I dont know if you know this or not, but the D gave up over 600 yards today, damn betts only if you could have scored five more TDs you wouldnt suck so much, and only if Randle El was psychic, he should have known it would have been heads, please just stop talking, your really making your self look worse and worse each time[/QUOTE]


Really?! By bringing up stats, I make myself look worse...for the 1000001st time, I have never said it was "okay" for the d to suck. However, they do, the quicker that's acknowledged the better the team will be. Ya know why the Colts always score so many points? Cause they don't play defense! Does anyone think the Skins shouldn't take this approach?

As for making 1 mistake...how about 6? 6 goddamn fumbles! How about addressing that. In limited action. I don't give a damn how many yards he has when he fumbles away a chance to win. I'd just as pissed if it had been Clinton. 25 yards of his total came on 1 run, what goddamn good did they do? They gave the Rams a shot at the win. Skins4Eva is right, most of you don't make any sense...

Re: Defense let us down!
 

Portis will be the starter again next season anyway. So don't feel like you need to defend him. Portis' stats and contributions speak for themselves. He got hurt the first game of preseason and was never really himself in the games he did play. Portis will start next year and Betts will provide a good change of pace. Don't worry about Betts replacing Portis as starter because it isn't going to happen.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=jdlea;263376]Really?! By bringing up stats, I make myself look worse...for the 1000001st time, I have never said it was "okay" for the d to suck. However, they do, the quicker that's acknowledged the better the team will be. Ya know why the Colts always score so many points? Cause they don't play defense! Does anyone think the Skins shouldn't take this approach?

As for making 1 mistake...how about 6? 6 goddamn fumbles! How about addressing that. In limited action. I don't give a damn how many yards he has when he fumbles away a chance to win. I'd just as pissed if it had been Clinton. 25 yards of his total came on 1 run, what goddamn good did they do? They gave the Rams a shot at the win. Skins4Eva is right, most of you don't make any sense...[/quote]

Please stop, Ladell fumbled, it happens, the D gave up over 600 yards and 37 points, what is it that your not getting, Your making an excuse for this D, they gave the game away long before Betts fumbled, the D sucks and has cost us games all year, thats why were 5-10, your football knowledge is terrible, and if you want too talk about how the Colts have adjusted just look at that score today against the Texans!

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=ncskinsfanec;263379]Portis will be the starter again next season anyway. So don't feel like you need to defend him. Portis' stats and contributions speak for themselves. He got hurt the first game of preseason and was never really himself in the games he did play. Portis will start next year and Betts will provide a good change of pace. Don't worry about Betts replacing Portis as starter because it isn't going to happen.[/QUOTE]

My reason for making those comments isn't so much what's been said in this thread, but it's directed at the large community of people on this board who have contended that Portis should be traded to make way for the older, more injury prone, fumble machine that is Ladell Betts.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=ncskinsfanec;263379]Portis will be the starter again next season anyway. So don't feel like you need to defend him. Portis' stats and contributions speak for themselves. He got hurt the first game of preseason and was never really himself in the games he did play. Portis will start next year and Betts will provide a good change of pace. Don't worry about Betts replacing Portis as starter because it isn't going to happen.[/quote]

Atleast some one in here is reasonable, this is all im trying to say also, but he keeps putting the loss sqaurely on the shoulders of betts and its truely infuriating.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=jdlea;263383]My reason for making those comments isn't so much what's been said in this thread, but it's directed at the large community of people on this board who have contended that Portis should be traded to make way for the older, more injury prone, fumble machine that is Ladell Betts.[/quote]

I have never once asked for Portis to be traded, and honestly i feel the Front Office should jump on this situation they have with Betts and trade him for picks, I am a huge Portis fan and feel he is the starter until he cant run anymore!

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=GiantsSuck703;263382]Please stop, Ladell fumbled, it happens, the D gave up over 600 yards and 37 points, what is it that your not getting, Your making an excuse for this D, they gave the game away long before Betts fumbled, the D sucks and has cost us games all year, thats why were 5-10, your football knowledge is terrible, and if you want too talk about how the Colts have adjusted just look at that score today against the Texans![/QUOTE]

It happens? How about the fact that he's the tied for the second most fumbles in the National Football League?! Why have you failed to address that fact? All you say is "the D gave up 37 points." They gave up 37 points to an offense who can hang 37 points on anyone any given week. Especially the worst pass defense (as far as TDs are concerned) in the NFL. My football knowledge is terrible? No, I'm distracting by my incessant slurping of Ladell Betts. A guy who is as prone to fumble as bad Quarterbacks!

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=GiantsSuck703;263385]I have never once asked for Portis to be traded, and honestly i feel the Front Office should jump on this situation they have with Betts and trade him for picks, I am a huge Portis fan and feel he is the starter until he cant run anymore![/QUOTE]

Dude, I never said you did...if you read the post, I said it had nothing to do with what had been said in this thread...and, btw, sometimes there is only one "o" in the word "too."

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=GiantsSuck703;263384]Atleast some one in here is reasonable, this is all im trying to say also, but he keeps putting the loss sqaurely on the shoulders of betts and its truely infuriating.[/QUOTE]

Never once have I not acknowledged that the D didn't help blow that game. However, the offense got the football with a chance to win and then Ladell Betts put the Skins in a position to lose the football game. "If the d made a stop..." Ever hear of momentum. Kind of a big deal in football...especially for a home team. You kinda get it when you should have lost, but somehow came up with a gift fumble from the supposed superstar running back. That helps you win a game. Especially when there are about 2 mins left.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=jdlea;263386]It happens? How about the fact that he's the tied for the second most fumbles in the National Football League?! Why have you failed to address that fact? All you say is "the D gave up 37 points." They gave up 37 points to an offense who can hang 37 points on anyone any given week. Especially the worst pass defense (as far as TDs are concerned) in the NFL. My football knowledge is terrible? No, I'm distracting by my incessant slurping of Ladell Betts. A guy who is as prone to fumble as bad Quarterbacks![/quote]

Hes a goddamn back up, hes paid like a backup, how many times has he fumbled since hes been the primary back?

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[quote=jdlea;263388]Never once have I not acknowledged that the D didn't help blow that game. However, the offense got the football with a chance to win and then Ladell Betts put the Skins in a position to lose the football game. "If the d made a stop..." Ever hear of momentum. Kind of a big deal in football...especially for a home team. You kinda get it when you should have lost, but somehow came up with a gift fumble from the supposed superstar running back. That helps you win a game. Especially when there are about 2 mins left.[/quote]

Why are you acting like Ladell fumbled and gave the rams great field position, they went down the field like it was practice, the D gave the game away, plain and simple.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=GiantsSuck703;263389]Hes a goddamn back up, hes paid like a backup, how many times has he fumbled since hes been the primary back?[/QUOTE]

Oh...that makes it okay? He has less chance to fumble and still becomes the second most prominent fumbler in the NFL, but who gives a shit if he fumbles all the time...

5 times he has fumbled as the primary back this season!

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=GiantsSuck703;263390]Why are you acting like Ladell fumbled and gave the rams great field position, they went down the field like it was practice, the D gave the game away, plain and simple.[/QUOTE]

If he dosent fumlbe, we can run out the clock, kick a feild goal , and enjoy christmas. No one is letting the D off the hook, but you cant give that fumble up. PLAIN AND SIMPLE>

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=jdlea;263391]Oh...that makes it okay? He has less chance to fumble and still becomes the second most prominent fumbler in the NFL, but who gives a shit if he fumbles all the time...

5 times he has fumbled as the primary back this season![/QUOTE]

EXACTLY.

HES IN THE NATIONAL FOOTBALL LEAUGE. He's not a backup on a JV High School Team. If its ok for our backups to turn the ball over, than we mine as well not even watch the skins on sundays.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=GiantsSuck703;263390]Why are you acting like Ladell fumbled and gave the rams great field position, they went down the field like it was practice, the D gave the game away, plain and simple.[/QUOTE]

Why are you acting like I said stuff I never came close to implying? Do you understand what momentum can do for a football team? Especially at home? And my football knowledge is weak even though I've done nothing but quote stats while you just say "the D sucks..." No shit, I've agreed with that statement over and over and fuckin over again! Yes, they're terrible, but you get a chance to win and then blow that chance on a fumble that pee wee football players are taught to protect against and he's not at fault by any stretch? I've acknowledged the D should have gotten a stop, however, it's pretty damn difficult to stop an offense like St. Louis's at home, with the crowd behind them because they have the football when they should have just lost the game...do you not agree?

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=cpayne5;263329]And if Betts could have *held on* to his end of the bargain, we win.[/QUOTE]

Not necessarily. The Rams were moving on us at will after Springs went out.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=Gmanc711;263392]If he dosent fumlbe, we can run out the clock, kick a feild goal , and enjoy christmas. No one is letting the D off the hook, but you cant give that fumble up. PLAIN AND SIMPLE>[/QUOTE]

I agree that we can't be giving up fumbles, but none of this should really be debatable considering the fact that we were up about two touchdowns in the third quarter.

Our weak secondary is what really let us down. Even with the fumble, we had opportunities but couldn't convert.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

the fumble by betts was huge. i'm not sure i can say it lost the game. it's kind of a weird situation, i mean, the defense is so piss poor that the offensive players need to play a perfect game. just like the game two weeks ago against the eagles, if campbell does'nt throw those picks, then the skins win. if betts does'nt fumble, the skins probably win but if the defense was anywhere close to obove average, the skins win both of those games regardless of the turnovers.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

We'd be in the playoffs if the Defense was at least half way decent. Frustrating season, but I think things are still headed in the right direction.

Re: Defense let us down!
 

[QUOTE=wolfeskins;263425]the fumble by betts was huge. i'm not sure i can say it lost the game. it's kind of a weird situation, i mean, the defense is so piss poor that the offensive players need to play a perfect game. just like the game two weeks ago against the eagles, if campbell does'nt throw those picks, then the skins win. if betts does'nt fumble, the skins probably win but if the defense was anywhere close to obove average, the skins win both of those games regardless of the turnovers.[/QUOTE]

That's a point I agree with 100%. However, I would assert that you know that the D is bad, so why wouldn't you play as close to perfect as possible? You know the D can't pick you up. Also, the D got you the football with a chance to win the ballgame and you proceeded to give them the ball right back. That's what gets me about this one. Everyone blames the D, it's hard to get a stop after they feel as though they've snatched victory from the jaws of defeat.