What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

If we do trade the 6th pick in the draft here is the chart of what to expect to in return. As an example I have seen some say we trade down number 6 to 10, With that we would get the 10th pick plus we should expect no lower than pick #60 in the draft (2nd round pick) because the difference between the 2 picks is worth 300 points and this is the value of pick #60.

[url=http://www.sportznutz.com/nfl/draft/draft_point_value_chart.htm]NFL Draft Point Value Chart[/url]

So anything lower than the 60th pick would not be in the Redskins favor for the trade scenario above (so getting a 3rd round pick for trading from #6 to #10 would not be a good deal for the Skins) - we would need to have a 2nd round pick to do a deal like this.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

good post bill. Regardless of the chart, I think moving to #10 & a 3rd would be a steal, plus we pay a llittle less for the signing bonus of the 10 pick.
There are a lot of quality guys coming out early. That's good news for us, as many of the teams before us will pick qb's or wr's, which we don't need. Even trading down to 10, we should have the choice of a few good DE's,CBs &DTs.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[quote=Bill B;269689]If we do trade the 6th pick in the draft here is the chart of what to expect to in return. As an example I have seen some say we trade down number 6 to 10, With that we would get the 10th pick plus we should expect no lower than pick #60 in the draft (2nd round pick) because the difference between the 2 picks is worth 300 points and this is the value of pick #60.

[URL="http://www.sportznutz.com/nfl/draft/draft_point_value_chart.htm"]NFL Draft Point Value Chart[/URL]

So anything lower than the 60th pick would not be in the Redskins favor for the trade scenario above (so getting a 3rd round pick for trading from #6 to #10 would not be a good deal for the Skins) - we would need to have a 2nd round pick to do a deal like this.[/quote]

Good piece of information to refer to. Though we should note that teams are not total sticklers to the point values. The Redskins, if trading down to 10, would likely accept a high 3rd rounder (such as the Falcons' 10th in the 3rd round) because the point values would be pretty close.

A team's motivation to trade down is always based around what player it thinks it can draft. The point values are great for general reference, but if the Redskins think they have a gem that would be there in the mid-high third round, they'd gladly accept the trade down.

The point values are approximations, and ultimately, the actual value a team gets out of a draft day trade depends upon what the players turn out like.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

You can throw out the point system if you have a player still there that another team really wants as in the JC deal. If a team gives us a call with an interest of trading picks then we know that there is a player that they want and they think another team behind us may want. Thats when we can demand more for the trade. If we go searching because we can trade down and still get our target player then the deal falls to the other team. Its just how the cards fall.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

Previous 3rd round picks...

2006 -- no pick
2005 -- no pick
2004 -- Chris Cooley (trade up)
2003 -- Derrick Dockery
2002 -- Cliff Russell, Rashad Bauman
2001 -- no pick
2000 -- Lloyd Harrison

There's some good value there, a couple of hits, though Cooley was a 2-for-1 deal. Russell, Bauman, and Harrison were the misses under this front office.

Our problems in the third round though, are a lack of third round picks.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

worth 1 million dollars

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

There is absolutely no reason to trade down from #6 without getting a second round pick IMO. We might have to move to #12 0r #13 to do it but I would rather keep the pick if we are talking about a third round pick.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[quote=wilsowilso;269732]There is absolutely no reason to trade down from #6 without getting a second round pick IMO. We might have to move to #12 0r #13 to do it but I would rather keep the pick if we are talking about a third round pick.[/quote]
You never know what another FO might give up if they're enamored with a player still available at our spot. Mike Ditka gave us all of the Saints draft choices (including #7 overall) just to move up to #5 overall to draft Ricky Williams. The beauty of that trade is that Casserly selected the player we wanted anyway - Champ Bailey. Trading down is a no brainer IF we still get the guy we wanted at our original slot.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

If alan branch is available we have to take him at 6

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[quote=SouperMeister;269738]You never know what another FO might give up if they're enamored with a player still available at our spot. Mike Ditka gave us all of the Saints draft choices (including #7 overall) just to move up to #5 overall to draft Ricky Williams. The beauty of that trade is that Casserly selected the player we wanted anyway - Champ Bailey. Trading down is a no brainer IF we still get the guy we wanted at our original slot.[/quote]


I just hope we get another sucker to take the bait like Ditka did. Unfortunately the Detriot Lions pick ahead of us at number 2 so take Matt Millen off the board

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[quote=diehardskin2982;269740]If alan branch is available we have to take him at 6[/quote]

But lets say the Cleveland Browns who desperately need a nost tackle for their 3-4 defense come to you and offer a lot of picks -- I know Branch would help us but if a deal like the Saints for Ricky Williams comes along you got to take it.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[quote=SouperMeister;269738]You never know what another FO might give up if they're enamored with a player still available at our spot. Mike Ditka gave us all of the Saints draft choices (including #7 overall) just to move up to #5 overall to draft Ricky Williams. The beauty of that trade is that Casserly selected the player we wanted anyway - Champ Bailey. Trading down is a no brainer IF we still get the guy we wanted at our original slot.[/quote]

Actually Ditka gave us the 12th overall pick, and the rest of his draft, to slide up to number 5. We then traded a good portion of what Ditka gave us, and the #12, to the Bears so we could slide up and take Champ Bailey at #7. The Bears then took Cade McCown at #12 (LOL).

But that little history lesson is neither here nor there in this discussion. Point being, yeah if someone really loves a certain player, they just might throw the world at you.

Best thing we can hope for is Calvin Johnson falls to us. I doubt that would happen, but if it did, I'd imagine a team or two would be willing to offer us the moon.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

The best thing for me is I do not really follow college football so who ever they pick seems good to me. Now yes I do know who the Vicks, Bush's, Youngs, but after those type names I have no clue.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

I would be very happy to trade all the way down to the Jets' 26th pick. The trade chart suggests that if we traded down from thr 6th pick to the 26th pick, we would also get the Jets 2 second picks. I would much prefer to have 3 picks in the first two rounds than one very high pick. I think this is a very plausible trade scenario if Oklahoma running back Adrian Peterson declares for the draft. Peterson would likely be available with the 6th pick and the Jets need a back in a big way.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[QUOTE=Bill B;269743]But lets say the Cleveland Browns who desperately need a nost tackle for their 3-4 defense come to you and offer a lot of picks -- I know Branch would help us but if a deal like the Saints for Ricky Williams comes along you got to take it.[/QUOTE]

1st ~deals like that come once in a lifetime and everyone knows this pick has to count for the skins. secondly browns pick before us so.... But i see ur point
I think teams would move up for a chance at Calvin branch and if that was to occur it would be with the likes of Atlanta

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

That #6 pick becomes valuable when other teams become desperate. Hopefully this year the Skins get lucky and some team team wants a certain player bad enough.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

Jarvis Moss just declared he will enter the draft (DE Florida). This guy has had some injuries but has overcome and has become a dominant force in college football. Maybe we do take a trade down and snag him in the late to mid 1st round and pick up a 3rd/4th pick??

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

if we move up would denver still have rights to our pick?

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

Does anyone remember getting trade offers back in '04 when we used the #5 pick on Sean Taylor?

You'd think people would have been banging down the doors for the chance at him or Kellen Winslow Jr. but it never happened.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

This is why the 'skins suck at the draft: They have no patience.

We are so desperate to have someone who impacts us NOW, that we don't see the benifit of taking in a full crop of players who will help us down the road. Generally speaking, first rounders, esecially earlier selections, can be plugged into the starting lineup right away. The reason that teams who build through the draft have success is more because of the later round picks who turn out to be future stars. These players cost very little compared to free agent/high draft pick ups. The only problem is you have to wait. You will not usually get an immediate impact. It's funny, when I read most 'skins fan's posts they seem to echo that, "Who do we need NOW?", mentality. The real advantage to trading down from #6 is that it would give us more chances at cheap, bang-for-the-buck starters and depth/role players who fill out our roster and support our star players. As far as I can see, the Redskins always have their fare share of stars but lack overall quality. That has been the consistant fatal flaw of the team along with no one at quarterback and constant coaching changes. Having an old coach who NEEDS to win NOW, and an owner who desperately WANTS to win NOW only serves to compound this trait which, in turn, ensures our continued struggles.

One must only look across town to the MCI center to see how a team is built through the draft. The Capitals have an embarasment of riches when it comes to organizational depth, but they are not winning, yet. You will see, in a few years as their young stars gain experience, they will be in position to add an important piece or two through free agency and compete year after year for the Stanley Cup. It takes an incredible amount of patience, however. Patience is a trait the Redskins sorely lack.

With that said, what the Redskins as an organization SHOULD do is trade Portis, (Only because of salary and milage, not age or skill. In fact, if the plan is to win NOW, you MUST have a can't miss talent at RB, QB or WR.), and get rid of as many pricey veterans as humanly possible. They should then trade down from their high pick as many times as they can get good lower round value in return while keeping at least two first day selections. Then they should suffer through a couple of down years with a nucleus that includes Cambell, Betts, Cooley and Taylor and slowly aquire a deep and well built foundation. Then, when the salary cap is under control they should SLOWLY add pieces until they have a team that can contend year in and year out.

That, of course, is assuming they believe Cambell is the answer for the future at QB. Not some decent guy but THE piece to build the team around. If after the last two years of watching him everday, they have come to the conclusion that he is in fact NOT the long term solution, you can trade him in the near future while his value is still somewhat high and draft whichever QB in this or next years drafts that fits the Franchise QB mold. None of this makes sense unless you have the QB position solidified. If Campbell is not the answer, trading down only makes sense if this years draft doesn't have the QB you want or a WR who you will eventually play with that QB. If THE QB is there, you do whatever you can to get him. For almost any other type of player you WAIT to see if he falls to you and you have a draft down contingency if he doesn't.

What the Redskins WILL do is draft high, go for the top free agents, and field a team of overpaid millionares who will lack the cohesion to win consistently. But who knows? Maybe we'll get lucky and win it all. That's why being a 'Skins fan is so fun, kind of like betting on green in roulette.

(I know I'm going to get burned for this out of place rant and I'm kind of chuckling to myself imagining the responses, if anyone even takes the time.)

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

You'd think by now Redskin nation would have grown tired of the idea that there's any one draft pick or free gent out there who can turn the team around just like that. What I'd love to see is for the team to trade this pick down and pick up a handful of lower round choices. They won't do it, but I can still hope.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[quote=TenandSix:Unacceptable;269802]This is why the 'skins suck at the draft: They have no patience. [/quote]

I agree with much of what you said. Building through the draft is what we need to return to. Trading away over half our picks has hurt us.

What I think many fans and people at Redskins park hold on to is the memory of Lavar and Samuals being picked in the first round, making an impact, and becoming probowl coggs. Who have we picked up outside of the first round who impacts us? Cooley, definetely, Golston, maybe.

The one player that they should look to to understand your point is Dockery. He was not a high pick, and has been able to make an impact in the last couple of years.

Trading Portis should be evaluated, but I'm not sure I'd go there. I think he comes back next year big for us. He is a player who plays hard and cares about winning even after the big payday.

Also, drafting QB's is like drafting WR's out of college. Hit or miss, 30% chance of success. I don't think you trade much to go after guys like that. Think about the Rivers for Manning trade. Just take the best available guy who you think would fit.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[quote=Beemnseven;269787]Does anyone remember getting trade offers back in '04 when we used the #5 pick on Sean Taylor?

You'd think people would have been banging down the doors for the chance at him or Kellen Winslow Jr. but it never happened.[/quote]
how do you know this? people may have come calling, but maybe the offers just werent good enough

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

Damn, i'm pretty bored w/ this offseason and its Jan. So hear goes...

Seeing that the skins have several holes to fill on D and some depth issues could the skins load up on draft picks this year by trading down several times.

We have the 6th overall pick. I would imagine we could probably get a middle round 1st (lets say 15-20) and a 3rd potentially. So for our 15th overall we could get a late 1st rounder/early 2nd rounder and a 3rd or 4th rounder. This would turn our only high draft pick into a late first round and two 3rd round draft picks. We could then always trade up w/ our two 3rds to get another 2nd round.

In summary we could have a late first rounder and 2 third round draft picks or a late first round and second round pick.

Either way a late first round could be used on Buster Davis, lb from Florida State, Patrick Willis (mlb) or Paul Pozl. sp?, Penn St. & have 1 or 2 picks left over.

Thought of trading down a couple of times to accumulate more picks or staying w/ the 6th.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

Or Blades from Pitt as a late first or early 2nd, who is highly regarded.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[quote=redsk1;272810]We have the 6th overall pick. I would imagine we could probably get a middle round 1st (lets say 15-20) and a 3rd potentially. So for our 15th overall we could get a late 1st rounder/early 2nd rounder and a 3rd or 4th rounder. This would turn our only high draft pick into a late first round and two 3rd round draft picks. We could then always trade up w/ our two 3rds to get another 2nd round.

In summary we could have a late first rounder and 2 third round draft picks or a late first round and second round pick.[/quote]

Man you need to get your hands on a draft value chart. The #6 pick can get us more than you are asking for if we trade back late in the first round. The best breakdown I've seen with regards to the value chart and the points system is trading back to the Jets pick which is late in the first round which would land us both of their second rounders in return. It's very very close with regards to that point value system that most of the war rooms use so much. Except for our dysfunctional war room of course. They have big problems following the value chart.

What I'm saying is the #6 pick has a pretty high value. If we trade back we really need the full value.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

Yea, I'm kinda throwing these things out b/c i'm too lazy to use that value chart. You are right too about our warroom too.

So we would have 3 picks, a late 1st and 2nds. A very good lb and 2 good cb's, maybe a DE. Depends alot on what FA we'll go after. However i think i would take the 3 or 4 high picks. Thoughts....

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

Alright, i checked out the value chart, very cool. We should be able to get some big time value back if we choose to do so.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[QUOTE=redsk1;272810]...or Paul Pozl. sp?, Penn St.[/QUOTE]

I don't think Pozl is considered a first or even second rounder right now. Kiper says he seriosuly struggles in coverage and has been getting over powered at the senior bowl.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[quote=diehardskin2982;269753]1st ~deals like that come once in a lifetime and everyone knows this pick has to count for the skins. secondly browns pick before us so.... But i see ur point
I think teams would move up for a chance at Calvin branch and if that was to occur it would be with the likes of Atlanta[/quote]
you might be a prophet. lelie just opted for free agency. so Atlanta might be in the market for a wide receiver

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[quote=wilsowilso;269732]There is absolutely no reason to trade down from #6 without getting a second round pick IMO. We might have to move to #12 0r #13 to do it but I would rather keep the pick if we are talking about a third round pick.[/quote]


Exactly. No way should we trade the 6th pick and not get a 1st and 2nd. we could trade down towards the middle to end of the 1st round and get a 2nd. the 6th pick is a very very good pick in the draft.

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[quote=dmek25;272975]you might be a prophet. lelie just opted for free agency. so Atlanta might be in the market for a wide receiver[/quote]

Would Atlanta consider giving us anything for Brandon Llyod?

Re: What the 6th Pick is worth.....
 

[quote=#56fanatic;272976]Exactly. No way should we trade the 6th pick and not get a 1st and 2nd. we could trade down towards the middle to end of the 1st round and get a 2nd. the 6th pick is a very very good pick in the draft.[/quote]

No question. Using the chart a 6th pick is worth a later 1st & 2 seconds. We need depth and can still get good value in the first two rounds.