What's wrong With this Team?
 

What's wrong with this team now is we forgotten who we are as a team and as fans! Team isn't about getting the beat free agents or the next great college star in the draft! It's about getting parts that fit that makes a team! I just watched the NFL networks America"s Game About the 82 Redskins. What we have lost is the sighted is it's not about getting a team of all star together but getting players that fit what we wanted to do. There is no substitute for hard work and throwing money at what you wanted isn't going to make it happen. What we need to get back to is look for players that fit what we wanted to do. As coaches find what we wanted to do. As a Owner look at what has worked and throw off what hasn't!

Another thing that hit me watching that show we will never be the Cowboys and would never wanted to be. The media is never going to love the Redskins! I like it like that ..... us against the world and that's the kind of owner,coaches,players and fans we all need to be! So when they say bad things about us.... who gives a shit!

So what do we need to do in free agentcy and the draft? Find players that fit what we need to make it work. If one is a so called star so be it. If one is a rejected from some other team so be it. What ever it takes! We as a team need to get back to what makes us great Redskins and that is us against the world mentality.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[quote=RedskinPete;290563]What's wrong with this team now is we forgotten who we are as a team and as fans! Team isn't about getting the beat free agents or the next great college star in the draft! It's about getting parts that fit that makes a team! I just watched the NFL networks America"s Game About the 82 Redskins. What we have lost is the sighted is it's not about getting a team of all star together but getting players that fit what we wanted to do. There is no substitute for hard work and throwing money at what you wanted isn't going to make it happen. What we need to get back to is look for players that fit what we wanted to do. As coaches find what we wanted to do. As a Owner look at what has worked and throw off what hasn't!

Another thing that hit me watching that show we will never be the Cowboys and would never wanted to be. The media is never going to love the Redskins! I like it like that ..... us against the world and that's the kind of owner,coaches,players and fans we all need to be! So when they say bad things about us.... who gives a shit!

So what do we need to do in free agentcy and the draft? Find players that fit what we need to make it work. If one is a so called star so be it. If one is a rejected from some other team so be it. What ever it takes! We as a team need to get back to what makes us great Redskins and that is us against the world mentality.[/quote]

Wouldn't this offseason fit into the approach that you mentioned?

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[quote=Grim21Reaper;290605]Wouldn't this offseason fit into the approach that you mentioned?[/quote]

He's on the west coast...he gets the news later than we do. :)

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Duh!

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

you

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[quote=RedskinPete;290563]What's wrong with this team now is we forgotten who we are as a team and as fans! Team isn't about getting the beat free agents or the next great college star in the draft! It's about getting parts that fit that makes a team! I just watched the NFL networks America"s Game About the 82 Redskins. What we have lost is the sighted is it's not about getting a team of all star together but getting players that fit what we wanted to do. There is no substitute for hard work and throwing money at what you wanted isn't going to make it happen. What we need to get back to is look for players that fit what we wanted to do. As coaches find what we wanted to do. As a Owner look at what has worked and throw off what hasn't!

Another thing that hit me watching that show we will never be the Cowboys and would never wanted to be. The media is never going to love the Redskins! I like it like that ..... us against the world and that's the kind of owner,coaches,players and fans we all need to be! So when they say bad things about us.... who gives a shit!

So what do we need to do in free agentcy and the draft? Find players that fit what we need to make it work. If one is a so called star so be it. If one is a rejected from some other team so be it. What ever it takes! We as a team need to get back to what makes us great Redskins and that is us against the world mentality.[/quote]

That program you just watched stated that in the beginning of his first season, Gibbs adjusted his game planning to fit the personell he had. That would contradict your idea that the old school skins found the pieces to fit the puzzle. It showes that Gibbs then (and he can now, too) made the puzzle fit the pieces.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

welcome rev. and whats wrong is the mods have way too much power around here:)

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

So anyway i must have read posts like this atleast 1,000,000 times before and the answers are akways the same

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[quote=Redskin;290878]So anyway i must have read posts like this atleast 1,000,000 times before and the answers are akways the same[/quote]

Too much can not be made of Gibbs' absurd addiction to Brunell. It profoundly hindered the development of the offense. Gibbs' attempted fixes of the offense's lameness, which he refused to attribute to Brunell, led to a neglect of the defense, which now must be attended to. A second element has been Williams' apparent belief that his system, not superior players, was the cause of his success. This, consequently caused a loss of fine players, as well as a failure to pick up good ones.
There's nothing inherently wrong with FA policy, so forget that nonsense. The fault lies in how we implemented that policy, which essentially has consisted of bringing too many bad FA's in and letting too many good FA's go.
It all goes back to Gibbs. Sorry, but it does.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

sorry for bringing back a dead thread and nothing i am going to write has not been written here before i am sure but i agree with redskins pete, the FO has done a horrible job of figuring out how to win football games . .

back when we had brad johnson at qb ('98?) things were building realtively well we just needed a kicker to make a few more kicks; since brad has left and spurrier came in it has been a non-stop carousel at QB which is IMO the very most important postion to have a return starter . .with the whole gators qb crew, the non-development (got creamed rookie year) then mishandling (when primed to give best shoot gets usurped by boonnel) of ramsey our team has never really had a shoot at consistent winning . . . i think campbell is going to right many wrongs on our offense but i probaly thought the same thing when ramsey was returning for his 2nd year . .

ps what portis adds to our offense over betts is not worth 10 mill a year, does his contract reach 15 mill at some point? this is the last year portis' contract stays earthly unless the skins can do some serious magic

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

oh plz!

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[QUOTE=RedskinPete;290563]What's wrong with this team now is we forgotten who we are as a team and as fans! Team isn't about getting the beat free agents or the next great college star in the draft! It's about getting parts that fit that makes a team! I just watched the NFL networks America"s Game About the 82 Redskins. What we have lost is the sighted is it's not about getting a team of all star together but getting players that fit what we wanted to do. There is no substitute for hard work and throwing money at what you wanted isn't going to make it happen. What we need to get back to is look for players that fit what we wanted to do. As coaches find what we wanted to do. As a Owner look at what has worked and throw off what hasn't!

Another thing that hit me watching that show we will never be the Cowboys and would never wanted to be. The media is never going to love the Redskins! I like it like that ..... us against the world and that's the kind of owner,coaches,players and fans we all need to be! So when they say bad things about us.... who gives a shit!

So what do we need to do in free agentcy and the draft? Find players that fit what we need to make it work. If one is a so called star so be it. If one is a rejected from some other team so be it. What ever it takes! We as a team need to get back to what makes us great Redskins and that is us against the world mentality.[/QUOTE]


Continue to look on the brightside RedskinPete, and remember that all sickness is not death. Things will get better if we can get our defense back in the top ten we will win our share of games. Even as bad as we played last year, there were still some moments when we resembled a team.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

I think we were real close to establishing a legitimate perennial (sp?) playoff team with both Turner and Schottenheimer but I guess the guy signing the checks didn't feel that they could get us to the top. Dan Snyder doesn't seem to be a guy who settles for mediocrity or second place. He's willing to break it all down again and again until all of the puzzle pieces form the complete picture. His methods are pretty aggresive. He doesn't seem to be one who wants to let the current situation play itself out. What's wrong with this team? Dan Snyder wants to be #1 and is stopping at nothing to get his team there.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Starts at the top. The owner sucks. Guy spends good money on everything but a GM.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

that's deep man

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;295186]Starts at the top. The owner sucks. Guy spends good money on everything but a GM.[/quote]


funny i was thinking the same exact thing. If you take a look at the successful franchises in this league they all have one common denominator....most have a real gm. Not an owner and his "yes" man making personnel decisions like they are throwing darts at pictures of players they want.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

True....so true..
I agree with the owner statement, however the owners not the guy, running, throwing or catching the ball, and he's damn sure not making any tackles. Anyone that on the field is supposed to have a shot at doing something great. Now that we have a season with one offensive scheme under our belt we need to play another one.....no changes, no big named players...just do it and see if it will work. They have been trying to judge a scheme off of one season and that's just not right.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[quote=hagams;295211]True....so true..
I agree with the owner statement, however the owners not the guy, running, throwing or catching the ball, and he's damn sure not making any tackles. Anyone that on the field is supposed to have a shot at doing something great. Now that we have a season with one offensive scheme under our belt we need to play another one.....no changes, no big named players...just do it and see if it will work. They have been trying to judge a scheme off of one season and that's just not right.[/quote]

But the bigger question glaring us in the face is do we have the personnel to run the offense that saunders brought with him? I am starting to lean towards "NO" we dont. If you look at the last 6 games of the season that wasnt your typical saunders offense. I think gibbs finally got to him and made him devise a "redskin" gameplan which focused around betts running the ball early and often. We need to get back to smashmouth football. We have two stud running backs and decent o-line who loves to run block. I think the best solution is to run the ball until you cant run no more and lets see where we are at the end of next season. Add in a defense who can make plays and i think we will be right in the thick of things next season come december.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[QUOTE=over the mountain;295169]sorry for bringing back a dead thread and nothing i am going to write has not been written here before i am sure but i agree with redskins pete, the FO has done a horrible job of figuring out how to win football games . .

back when we had brad johnson at qb ('98?) things were building realtively well we just needed a kicker to make a few more kicks; since brad has left and spurrier came in it has been a non-stop carousel at QB which is IMO the very most important postion to have a return starter . .with the whole gators qb crew, the non-development (got creamed rookie year) then mishandling (when primed to give best shoot gets usurped by boonnel) of ramsey our team has never really had a shoot at consistent winning . . . i think campbell is going to right many wrongs on our offense but i probaly thought the same thing when ramsey was returning for his 2nd year . .

ps what portis adds to our offense over betts is not worth 10 mill a year, does his contract reach 15 mill at some point? this is the last year portis' contract stays earthly unless the skins can do some serious magic[/QUOTE]


Nice post, word of warning OVM, you can't take shots at Brunell, Portis, or Gibbs, it's a site rule. And the name Ramsey has been stricken, so let it be written, so let it be done.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Those are only the most discussed topics on this site, but yeah we don't allow that

:doh:

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

oh let me think.....D-FENCE? ole ya and we haven't won a superbowl in 15 years, that's about it

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

that is pretty good assumption although we are doing those things you said we need to do

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Someone said earlier on that Danny Boy would not settle for second place. Good thing because usually under his reign the team has been finishing in fourth place.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Yeah nothing too much can be said about team chemistry Pete. My uncle is Earle Bruce the ex OSU football coach from the 80's. His first team in 1979 was 2 points away from a national title and ended up 9-3 the following year, with virtually all the big names back. He said the 1979 team just gelled well while the 80' squad was just a bit off sync. The difference was that in 1979 he had some "second tier" players that were able to contribute in a big way.
I have to also agree with 724 Skinsfan, in that with Marty we had something good going. Even with Norv we were competitive for the most part. IF I could pick between my monniker(Gus) and JC I would pick Gus in a heartbeat. I pushed a lot for JC to start last year in the Wash Post forums, but I am not sure he will get us to the promised land. Gus made guys like Westbrook and Leslie Shephard look like all pros at times. Still miss those shootouts with Plummer and the Cards!!! Damn those were fun days.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Call me crazy, but i think were going to turn things around this year in a big way. Jason Campbell really looked amazing at times, and he was never rattled, hes a true leader. Our defense was killed by injuries and that lead to the embarrasing stats other teams were running up against us. With everybody back, plus the additions of Smoot, Fletcher and Macklin, we not only added depth but we added leadership as well. Im excited about this season, we stayed away from highly paid free agents, and we didnt give into the bears rediculous demands for Lance Briggs. Hail to the Redskins

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Snyder thinks he's doing everything right since tickets are still being bought...

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72;295323]Those are only the most discussed topics on this site, but yeah we don't allow that

:doh:[/QUOTE]

Is it possible to get it codified so that mentioning any of those topics gets some kind of ban? Maybe something in the area of 3 months? Otherwise it is going to be 2025 and we are still going to be getting manifestos like this.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[quote=Crazyhorse1;290881]Too much can not be made of Gibbs' absurd addiction to Brunell. It profoundly hindered the development of the offense. Gibbs' attempted fixes of the offense's lameness, which he refused to attribute to Brunell, led to a neglect of the defense, which now must be attended to. A second element has been Williams' apparent belief that his system, not superior players, was the cause of his success. This, consequently caused a loss of fine players, as well as a failure to pick up good ones.
There's nothing inherently wrong with FA policy, so forget that nonsense. The fault lies in how we implemented that policy, which essentially has consisted of bringing too many bad FA's in and letting too many good FA's go.
It all goes back to Gibbs. Sorry, but it does.[/quote]

It is the system, not the players. You're very misguided in listening to Adam Archuleta. Gregg Williams defense was always superior, he went to a Super Bowl with the Titans with an amazing defense, turned around, went to Buffalo, and had another amazing defense. Williams landed here in Washington with mostly players that were already here, and had the 3rd ranked defense. So it is the system, the other part is the will of the players to accept that.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

All of this talk about what's wrong with our team has got to end. There are at least 20 teams in the NFL that have to ask themselves that same question every year. Its not just us. Competition in the NFL is great. The Saints beat every team in the NFC East excecpt us. But, we were the only NFC East team that didn't make the Playoffs.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;295363]Yeah nothing too much can be said about team chemistry Pete. My uncle is Earle Bruce the ex OSU football coach from the 80's. His first team in 1979 was 2 points away from a national title and ended up 9-3 the following year, with virtually all the big names back. He said the 1979 team just gelled well while the 80' squad was just a bit off sync. The difference was that in 1979 he had some "second tier" players that were able to contribute in a big way.[/quote]Not to completely discredit your uncle's evaluation because he was there and I wasn't, but couldn't a two win swing be completely a function of luck and scheduling? Maybe there were some legit reasons why the 80 Buckeyes weren't any better than the 79 team, but perhaps the 80 team just got beat twice by an inferrior team who outplayed them on that day.

Losing happens. Chemistry is the result of losing/winning, not the cause of it.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Our team is not that bad at all. [URL="http://www.profootballhof.com/assets/default/W-L_Start_of_2007_Final.pdf"]

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[quote=atomicnixon;295410]It is the system, not the players. You're very misguided in listening to Adam Archuleta. Gregg Williams defense was always superior, he went to a Super Bowl with the Titans with an amazing defense, turned around, went to Buffalo, and had another amazing defense. Williams landed here in Washington with mostly players that were already here, and had the 3rd ranked defense. So it is the system, the other part is the will of the players to accept that.[/quote]This is some strong, solid evidence for a point I generally disagree with; that a system can take an inferior team and better them substacially, or take a great team and worsen them substancially.

So how would I address this inconsistency in my argument?

Well, the Washington sample is easy. Grilliams had a bunch of players in the prime of their careers in '04. He lost some talent to free agency, and some of the returning players regressed in 2005, yet the defense was able to upkeep its top 10 status due to good fortune and timely turnovers. IN 2006, he lost even more talent to FA and injuries and many players in the front seven greatly regressed. Really nothing Williams could have called would have mattered. I would at least have made Carlos Rogers start pressing more often...but that wouldn't have changed a whole lot.

But you cite additional evidence for his Tennessee and Buffalo tenures that I would have to somehow discredit to support my assumption. I don't know much about the defensive roster makeup of those two teams. I know who the stars were, but that doesn't help all that much. What I can do, at the very least, is see how good these defenses were under Williams.

Buffalo was a very poor defense in Williams' first two years as HC there, but improved to be one of the league's best in his third. This is a complete inverse of the Washington sample. Very similarly, his super bowl year in Tennessee, his unit ranked in the bottom half of the league. The next year, it rose to second.

If scheme/coaching was responsible for the success of Williams' teams and also responsible for the failure of his teams, it doesn't make sense that his first DC stint and his HC stint produced defensive rosters that bettered every year he was in power, while Washington worsened. A much more plausible answer was that while Gregg Williams has a track record for sqeezing the most possible production out of little talent, consistently outcoaching your opponents isn't possible. Eventually, even the most ignorant of opponents will outscheme you. The one constant in successful sustained defense is great production from your defensive players.

So that's where I'm coming from. You find a coach that could have gotten this 2006 defense to play decently, and I'll lead the campaign to get him inducted into Canton tomorrow.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[QUOTE=angryssg;295413]All of this talk about what's wrong with our team has got to end. There are at least 20 teams in the NFL that have to ask themselves that same question every year. Its not just us. Competition in the NFL is great. The Saints beat every team in the NFC East excecpt us. But, we were the only NFC East team that didn't make the Playoffs.[/QUOTE]

I absolutely agree. Problems abound for all teams, not just the Redskins.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Well, so much of this thread can be true, but the only way we'll be able to tell for sure is when the season starts. But for now getting the QB ready menatlly and physically, putting a solid D-line together, and building the teams relationship should be our top priority's. Danny just needs to stay out of the off-season unless he's signing checks for players that are needed, not wanted. This year, as I said before should be better just because they've played together for a season, and now they get to perform what they've learned. If that don't work, fire everyone minus your impact player, and build around them.(again)

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

[quote=RedskinPete;290563]What's wrong with this team now is we forgotten who we are as a team and as fans! Team isn't about getting the beat free agents or the next great college star in the draft! It's about getting parts that fit that makes a team! I just watched the NFL networks America"s Game About the 82 Redskins. What we have lost is the sighted is it's not about getting a team of all star together but getting players that fit what we wanted to do. There is no substitute for hard work and throwing money at what you wanted isn't going to make it happen. What we need to get back to is look for players that fit what we wanted to do. As coaches find what we wanted to do. As a Owner look at what has worked and throw off what hasn't!

Another thing that hit me watching that show we will never be the Cowboys and would never wanted to be. The media is never going to love the Redskins! I like it like that ..... us against the world and that's the kind of owner,coaches,players and fans we all need to be! So when they say bad things about us.... who gives a shit!

So what do we need to do in free agentcy and the draft? Find players that fit what we need to make it work. If one is a so called star so be it. If one is a rejected from some other team so be it. What ever it takes! We as a team need to get back to what makes us great Redskins and that is us against the world mentality.[/quote]
I didn't know that everyone hated the skins as you mentioned. One thing you forgot is back in the 80's there was know cap it only took Gibbs to convenes Cook to open up his check book to obtain a player. So if they made a mistake on a player they could get rid of them only costing cook money and not impacting a cap as it does now days. It would be interesting to see how we compared to other teams back then on spending.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Someone said earlier that it starts at the top with the owner and trickles down. I couldn't agree more and I think that b/c the owner is so hands on it puts added pressure on the coaching staff (in a town like Washington where there is already a tremendous amount of pressure). The coaches can't focus on building a team over a couple of years cuz danny boy wants to win NOW and he might go out and decide to get the next hot college coach to "solve" the problems. This in turn trickles down to the players who have no type of job security b/c a) the salary cap is so tight year in year out that they could be casualties at any point if they don't perform & b) the owner could just bring in a big name free agent to take their spot during the next offseason. With all this added pressure on the players and coaching staff along with the yearly roster overhauls nobody can really vibe with each other and there is no continuity. When is the last time we had the same coach and clear starting QB in consecutive years. I can think of two times in the last 10 years...Norv Turner and Brad Johnson...and Gibb's and Brunell. I don't think its surprising that those were also the only two times we have been to the playoffs in that span. Don't get me wrong i don't think either of those situations was optimal but even their mediocre talent succeeded with a little rhythm

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Skins last three years were a team from the 80s playing against teams from the present. Behind in gameplan, behind in personell, behind in passing game, behind in defensive athleticism but ahead in character and coaching loyalty. If we could just combined the two, we could have a team. Right now things are not looking good, especially since it's quite apparent that good ole Dan Snyder has not learned anything since he took over the team years ago. I'm starting to think that maybe he's not stupid, just greedy

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

i used to fancy myself a pessimist around here, now I feel like a blind optimist. This is a team that is one year away from being discussed as a superbowl contender. If we can shore up the defense, there is no reason to believe that our offense won't improve markedly as well. We have so many weapons, plus we are entering the second year in Saunder's system. Moreover, we have improved more than any other team in our division, particularly on defense. SKINS rule!

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Sure enough dj, Gibbs will go out as a back-to-back SuperBowl winner and restore our franchise to its proper resting place among the NFL's elite.

Pessimism to me is ssuch a worthless trait to have for one's behavior. I have yet to find a pessimist who's a happy person and fun to be around. I say go for restrained optimism.

Re: What's wrong With this Team?
 

Losing does happen, but it sure does help if you get good contributions from as many players as possible now doesn't it. Just look at our overhyped receiving corp. Only Moss and Randle El can truly say they positively contributed, while Patten and Lloyd were practically non existent. Look at any sport NBA, NHL, and NFL. Every title team usually had an unsung hero or two(or 3) that stepped up his game when it counted to get his team to the promised land. In 2005 when we could have made a serious run Mark's arm became a noodle, and we had no offense. Team chemistry and the will to win are of the utmost importance in a champion.