If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

Let's suppose that Joe Gibbs decided not to return as head coach next year and instead just moved into a front office role.

Who would you want to be the Redskins Head Coach in 2008?

Let me make this 100% clear. This is not a "Joe Must Go" thread. And I don't want to discuss on this thread whether or not he should return as head coach. That is not what this thread is about.

If you can't abide by that, be advised there will be a zero tolerance policy.

So...tell us, [U]assuming Gibbs didn't come back[/U], who should be the head coach in 2008?

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

I would like to see B. Cowher and his new staff. At this point I feel we have the players( at least most of them), I think we need a new captain of this ship, a proven winner!

Please god not G. Williams

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

I'd say Cowher. Gregg Williams is a great coordinator but as struggled as a head coach. Saunders has never been a head coach. Cowher was phenomenal in Pittsburgh, and has tons of experience. I would take him in a second (ASSUMING Gibbs leaves of course). I would certainly hope we could retain Williams as def coordinator regardless.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

First, Joe must stay. I'm angry as hell at that unsportsmanlike call, and it was 100% his fault. But this team would have been worthless under nearly anyone else after this week, and that's gotta count for something.

Gregg Williams has shown the same kind of leadership. He is viewed as a leader by players on both sides of the ball (remember that Santana Moss went to Williams to explain his fumble weeks ago, not to Gibbs). This team has gone through events that should galvanize them, it's the wrong time to bring new faces to the fold.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[QUOTE=GMScud;387596]I'd say Cowher. Gregg Williams is a great coordinator but as struggled as a head coach. Saunders has never been a head coach. Cowher was phenomenal in Pittsburgh, and has tons of experience. I would take him in a second (ASSUMING Gibbs leaves of course). I would certainly hope we could retain Williams as def coordinator regardless.[/QUOTE]

Saunders was a head coach in San Diego years ago.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[QUOTE=GMScud;387596]I'd say Cowher. Gregg Williams is a great coordinator but as struggled as a head coach. Saunders has never been a head coach. Cowher was phenomenal in Pittsburgh, and has tons of experience. I would take him in a second (ASSUMING Gibbs leaves of course). I would certainly hope we could retain Williams as def coordinator regardless.[/QUOTE]

But if you're Cowher why do you come back to be a head coach unless you have absolute complete control? I mean, I'm assuming that Gibbs wouldn't go away entirely. He'd still be the President.

So here you are, Bill Cowher, a proven coach and you're probably getting paid a boatload of money by Snyder. But, at this point in your career don't you want more than just to be head coach? Don't you want something more?

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

i gotta go with GW. He's been around here long enough do deserve the shot and has had the only part of the team that's been dominant. Our ST's has been consistantly good, though...

I do hope gibbs returns, but if he decides not to, I think bringing in an outsider will only set us back 2 years, in which case the same people calling for JG's head will be calling for the new coach's head.


I don't even know if cowher would take the job. we're in cap hell and don't have a history of longevity or tolerance with our coaches...

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

I say someone from this site, since we seem to have so many geniuses who would never make a mistake during the draft or free agency, so many people are expert Madden players, etc.

In all seriousness, I want Gibbs back. If Gibbs decides to retire, don't expect a great 2008 season as new head coaches often struggle in their first season with a new team. And expect to see JC regress, or not progress, if we replace Saunders and force him to learn a new system.

If we had to get someone else, I'd probably go with Cowher since I like the guy, he likes smash-mouth football and great defenses, and he is a proven winner. That said, several teams will likely be after him and he supposedly wanted to stay out of football until 2009. He could be saying that he doesn't want to return to football in 2008 to gain leverage in contract negotiations, but who knows.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

Russ Grimm...most people that seem to know what they are talking about feel Grimm is ready, I think it would be nice to go for a brand new guy (coaching wise) with a new attitude and system. Wade Phillips has proven in Dallas that it is possible for a new coach to turn it around from one year to the next so long as you have the talent and I think the 'skins still have the talent...

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

I can find problems with everyone you specifically mentioned.

With Cowher, we're getting a conservative, defensive oriented coach who won't be aggressive offensively. A problem that many have with our offense right now. Plus, he has nothing to prove, and will come here only because of the Golden Parachute.

With Russ Grimm, it harkens back to the notion that this team is grasping at every person they can find from the Glory Years in the hopes that they will lead us back there. It's like writing checks from an account that has long been closed.

And with Saunders and Williams, we'd be going back to the route of choosing coordinators who haven't proven they can take the next step as a head coach.

So, of those arguments against, Russ Grimm is the one I object to least.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

Oops. I said Other but I MEANT Cowher. I just like the guy. He's emotional, he's just that kinda controlling powerhouse kinda guy. I'm kinda eh, middle of the road, about the cupcake , not yelling stuff. Cowher was just all over his players, or at least he made it look like it. I dunno about you, but if a guy yells at me, I'm definitely getting my act together.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

Well lets look at the two canidates in our organization first...Saunders I think is hell no. I dont really know what to say about his stay here...but it's sucked. It's def. not his fault, but I just don't think he really earned any consideration here (again, thats prob some on him, some on Gibbs and their style clashes).

Now Gregg Williams is tough, yeah he had a tough stint as head coach before...well so did Bill Belicheck, and Wade Phillips first run was not so great. Its not like he's been the head coach for five teams and sucked with them all. He had a bad team in Buffalo, so I honestly wouldnt care and actually would accept him as head coach...

Now if not Gregg, I really dont want another "big name" guy coming in. I think if we did bring a big name in, Cowher is probaboly the safest bet because the guy can coach football, but I'd rather have Grimm come in and take over. He would be hungry, he knows the orginization, and he can coach offense (which is our real problem right now)...my biggest wonder is that if Williams isnt our next head coach, is there any chance we can get him to stay as our D-Coordinator.

Roughly put, I'm all for a new coach. I'm not a Gibbs "hater", in fact I really like Joe Gibbs the person and love what he's done for this orginazation even though I didn't get to enjoy any of it..and I can certianly understand why people are loyal to him. But to me, you are what your record says you are, and we've sucked, we've given away 4th quarter lead after 4th quarter lead, and I'm just sick of it. I'll say this...if we were "gauranteed" to win the Super Bowl next year, theres no person I'd like to see as our head coach that leads us there than Joe Gibbs. I really realy want him to succeed. I've just seen the same mistakes too many times and just want a change in the organization.

My first choice would be Russ Grimm, but Gregg Williams is right there too. I'd rank Cowher third. Honestly, I dont know who else I'd really want here outside of one of those three. I really dont think Cowher has any real interest in coming back to coach.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

I would want to see Bill Cower come online, I feel we are a player or two away from having a dominant team with the right kind of motivating coach. I feel Bill can fill that void. He has a great history of finding talent in the draft as well. If not Bill.....well I would rather see Russ Grimm come home than to give either of our coordinators a shot at HC.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

I hate to say it but it is coming soon, Coach will step down.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;387601]But if you're Cowher why do you come back to be a head coach unless you have absolute complete control? I mean, I'm assuming that Gibbs wouldn't go away entirely. He'd still be the President.

So here you are, Bill Cowher, a proven coach and you're probably getting paid a boatload of money by Snyder. But, at this point in your career don't you want more than just to be head coach? Don't you want something more?[/quote]

Overall head coaches who act as GMs haven't had a ton of success in the league. Cowher was never a GM or team prez in Pittsburgh and had a great run there. If ain't broke, why try to fix it? I understand the idea of trying to set higher goals and achieve more, but I think he may be setting himself up for failure if he wants complete control.

Wouldn't it seem a little silly to hire another retired coach with a Super Bowl ring(s) who had never been a personnel man before and expect him to excel in both roles?

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[QUOTE=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;387604]I say someone from this site, since we seem to have so many geniuses who would never make a mistake during the draft or free agency, so many people are expert Madden players, etc.

In all seriousness, I want Gibbs back. If Gibbs decides to retire, don't expect a great 2008 season as new head coaches often struggle in their first season with a new team. And expect to see JC regress, or not progress, if we replace Saunders and force him to learn a new system.

If we had to get someone else, I'd probably go with Cowher since I like the guy, he likes smash-mouth football and great defenses, and he is a proven winner. That said, several teams will likely be after him and he supposedly wanted to stay out of football until 2009. He could be saying that he doesn't want to return to football in 2008 to gain leverage in contract negotiations, but who knows.[/QUOTE]

Someone from this site was going to be a poll option, but that would have totally skewed the results.

You know what's funny about your compliments of Cowher, smash-mouth, great defense, proven winner....hmm, who does that sound like? :)

So if you (not you, but the collective you) complain about the current coach what will you say about Cowher?

Up until recently I would have said I'd love for it to be Grimm. I wish he'd been on our staff the past few years.

However, in recent days I think I've come to the conclusion that while I don't know how good a head coach he'll be Gregg Williams should be the next coach. I know he rubs a lot of people the wrong way at Redskins Park, but for the most part he at least has their respect. And most importantly, he has Gibbs' support.

And the team could benefit from continuity. People hate to hear it, but it's true...we are so close.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

As for other candidates, I've always liked Bruce Arians

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;387612]Someone from this site was going to be a poll option, but that would have totally skewed the results.

You know what's funny about your compliments of Cowher, smash-mouth, great defense, proven winner....hmm, who does that sound like? :)

So if you (not you, but the collective you) complain about the current coach what will you say about Cowher?

Up until recently I would have said I'd love for it to be Grimm. I wish he'd been on our staff the past few years.

However, in recent days I think I've come to the conclusion that while I don't know how good a head coach he'll be Gregg Williams should be the next coach. I know he rubs a lot of people the wrong way at Redskins Park, but for the most part he at least has their respect. And most importantly, he has Gibbs' support.

And the team could benefit from continuity. People hate to hear it, but it's true...we are so close.[/quote]

I'm not sure about Grimm either. No head coaching experience, and he's spent a lot of his time with Cowher anyway, so he's molded in that style as well. So if we say Grimm, why not just say Cowher?

I agree to an extent with the continuity. I think if Gibbs does step down he will stay on as team prez, in which case I would be surprised if it wasn't G.Williams.

If Snyder goes after Cowher people may say, "here we go again, Danny looking for the big name, super expensive big splash." That said, I still think Cowher would do well.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

I gota go with GW. He is going to bring continuity with this team and he already has a rapport with the players

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

I think GW should be the next coach! When this happens the Redskins insure that the team will not have to learn a new offense, or learn a new defense...just learn to close out games that have eluded us for the past 7 or so years.

Coach Gibbs will and will always be the savior of D.C. and will continue to fight for the organization but in another capacity other than coach

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;387612]You know what's funny about your compliments of Cowher, smash-mouth, great defense, proven winner....hmm, who does that sound like? :)[/QUOTE]

I noticed the irony when I wrote it. Pretty funny huh.

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;387612]Up until recently I would have said I'd love for it to be Grimm. I wish he'd been on our staff the past few years.[/QUOTE]

I obviously have a lot of love for Grimm. But, I don't know what he's like as a coach. I've heard good things, but not enough to make me feel very confident in him. I haven't heard anything bad, but I haven't heard that much.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[quote=mredskins;387594]I would like to see B. Cowher and his new staff. At this point I feel we have the players( at least most of them), I think we need a new captain of this ship, a proven winner!

Please god not G. Williams[/quote]


Are you a Jerkoff??? Why not Gregg Williams??? What do you know that we dont? I doubt you know shit!!! Go Home!!! Gregg Williams knows how to ride this ship out! He has proven it with a great defense over the years!

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

I would prefer either Grimm or Mike Singletary.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[QUOTE=He Hate Me;387621]Are you a Jerkoff??? Why not Gregg Williams??? What do you know that we dont? I doubt you know shit!!! Go Home!!! Gregg Williams knows how to ride this ship out! He has proven it with a great defense over the years![/QUOTE]

We hate you!

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

I voted 'Other'. I would like to see an unknown take the reins, much like Gibbs and Cowher did. We need a gutsy, innovative guy that will stay up all night trying to figure out the best way to win each week. Also, one who isn't worried about current player relationships. This will allow the new coach to bench or get rid of any player regardless of who it is. I want a guy who makes every member of the team from the coaching staff to the players afraid for their jobs.

Bottom line: If "he's" hungry, then I want him coaching the team.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[QUOTE=jamf;387624]I would prefer either Grimm or Mike Singletary.[/QUOTE]

Mike Singletary, nice choice. I thought I heard he was a head coaching candidate at some college though.

Baylor maybe?

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[QUOTE=He Hate Me;387621]Are you a Jerkoff??? Why not Gregg Williams??? What do you know that we dont? I doubt you know shit!!! Go Home!!! Gregg Williams knows how to ride this ship out! He has proven it with a great defense over the years![/QUOTE]

Did you really need to insult a fellow member?

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[QUOTE=GMScud;387615]I'm not sure about Grimm either. No head coaching experience, and he's spent a lot of his time with Cowher anyway, so he's molded in that style as well. So if we say Grimm, why not just say Cowher?

I agree to an extent with the continuity. I think if Gibbs does step down he will stay on as team prez, in which case I would be surprised if it wasn't G.Williams.

If Snyder goes after Cowher people may say, "here we go again, Danny looking for the big name, super expensive big splash." That said, I still think Cowher would do well.[/QUOTE]

Great points about Grimm.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[QUOTE=He Hate Me;387621]Are you a Jerkoff??? Why not Gregg Williams??? What do you know that we dont? I doubt you know shit!!! Go Home!!! Gregg Williams knows how to ride this ship out! He has proven it with a great defense over the years![/QUOTE]

Your next post better be an apology

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

It hard to say who be be a better head coach, without know knowing how they would assemble their staff. For instance If Cower took the Job, he'd probably call the defense, but who would be his OC? If Grimm or Cower took the job GWill would more than likely be gone. I believe that if Gibbs leaves and GWill does not get the job, we give him another Million from the Snyd. Its a tough call, but some level of change may be required.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;387630]Mike Singletary, nice choice. I thought I heard he was a head coaching candidate at some college though.

Baylor maybe?[/quote]I had never thought of Singletary, but he's universally respected. I do want to see Gregg Williams get his shot here. He remained loyal to Gibbs when he could have left for a head coaching job after his first year here.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

Based on the question, I would have to answer Gregg Williams. This was clearly a 5 year plan that they set up in 2004, and we still have to see the final year play out. So you don't want great upheaval in the coaching staff. Promote GW to head coach, promote Blache to defensive coordinator, and let Saunders work with the offense.

But that's only if Gibbs steps aside this offseason. Gibbs is our best option to coach going forward. If he doesn't want to be on the field next year, by promoting Gregg Williams and Blache and leaving the offense in tact, you essentially keep this team the way Gibbs builds it. If Gibbs stays next year, things dont get better, and then he walks away, then I think it's time to clean house as far as the coordinators go.

We haven't been especially good with the coaching this year. Certainly it hasn't been historically bad enough to cost us any games, but the room for improvement is there, and arguably necessary.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

Williams, of course, better start doing his CURRENT job better. We really aren't that far away on either side of the ball, but our coverage is just too damn soft. For big plays to happen when we play so damn soft the whole entire game is totally inexcusable.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

I'd be up for g williams so long as saunders agreed to stay on (continuity) will full control of all things offense...(I do not believe that gibbs isn't responsible for a lot of the "sitting on the lead" style of play)...just my opinion.

But I wouldn't cry over cower at all...

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

Cowher's not a good coaching option...he's too tough on his players. The performance of his teams tends to decline as the season progresses. His own QB from his lone super bowl victory really doesn't like the way he coaches. Doubt Campbell would either.

No way in hell that anyone can argue that Cowher is better than Gibbs. That would just be an insane thing to say.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[QUOTE=GTripp0012;387656]Based on the question, I would have to answer Gregg Williams. This was clearly a 5 year plan that they set up in 2004, and we still have to see the final year play out. So you don't want great upheaval in the coaching staff. Promote GW to head coach, promote Blache to defensive coordinator, and let Saunders work with the offense.

But that's only if Gibbs steps aside this offseason. Gibbs is our best option to coach going forward. If he doesn't want to be on the field next year, by promoting Gregg Williams and Blache and leaving the offense in tact, you essentially keep this team the way Gibbs builds it. If Gibbs stays next year, things dont get better, and then he walks away, then I think it's time to clean house as far as the coordinators go.

We haven't been especially good with the coaching this year. Certainly it hasn't been historically bad enough to cost us any games, but the room for improvement is there, and arguably necessary.[/QUOTE]

Technically Blache is the defensive coordinator already.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;387661]Williams, of course, better start doing his CURRENT job better. We really aren't that far away on either side of the ball, but our coverage is just too damn soft. For big plays to happen when we play so damn soft the whole entire game is totally inexcusable.[/quote]Unfortunately, Gibbs/Saunders tend to move away from plays/formations that are working, resulting in the flat 2nd half offensive performances that have led to defeat. Buffalo defended the run great all day, and Cooley/Moss were tearing them up. They had no answer for 3 and 4 receiver sets. Somehow, we got away from what was working against this D as soon as we went up 16-5. This has been a recurring theme all season. To hell with balance if the opposing defense demonstrates zero ability to stop a part of our game plan. Keep attacking that weakness until the cows come home.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[QUOTE=GTripp0012;387661]Williams, of course, better start doing his CURRENT job better. We really aren't that far away on either side of the ball, but our coverage is just too damn soft. For big plays to happen when we play so damn soft the whole entire game is totally inexcusable.[/QUOTE]

In my opinion, the defense is doing a pretty decent job. Are they doing enough to compensate for the offense's shortcomings? No. Are they stopping opponents from making plays in some key situations? No. But, they're doing a decent job, particularly when you consider that Sean passed away, Rogers in on IR, and Springs and Smoot have been playing with injuries or missing games.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;387681]In my opinion, the defense is doing a pretty decent job. Are they doing enough to compensate for the offense's shortcomings? No. Are they stopping opponents from making plays in some key situations? No. But, they're doing a decent job, particularly when you consider that Sean passed away, Rogers in on IR, and Springs and Smoot have been playing with injuries or missing games.[/quote]I thought they played pretty well today. But his philosophy with his safety play just won't work. It's too easy for a team to hang around when a first down can be had at will. Use the safeties, get them up in the box at times and play football. Playing the way GW wants to play only works when you can eliminate big plays entirely. We only gave up one today, but that was one too many. Play more aggressively and you force more punts and turnovers. Then you can give up a big play every once in awhile and it won't totally cripple your team.

Two big plays, I'm sorry. I forgot how when given every possible defensive advantage, our guys still couldn't defend a deep in route from Josh Reed. It's only, you know, the only place the Bills can go with the football at that point. We can't excuse that. He made bad calls against the Cards and got lucky there, bad calls against Philly the first time, and a great individual play saved us there, gave up huge plays vs. Dallas and Philly (2nd time), and doesn't ever account for the QB in pass coverage.

Gregg Williams may not have a lot of help, but he's doing a bad job, and it's becoming a trend. Either he swallows his pride and makes adjustments or we get someone who can.

Re: If Not Joe, Then Who?
 

Greg WIlliams is my first choice, he's fiery and I think we need that. I wouldn't be against bringing Grimm back either.