Solidarity
 

I think this needs to be said.

I am, without a doubt, one of Dan Snyder's strongest critics for the way he has handled this coaching search. I can't understand letting Al Saunders and Gregg Williams walk after the progress they've made with us.

But I can't wait to see what the new staff has in store. I can't wait to see what Jim Zorn can do with Jason Campbell. I can't wait to see Blache continue what we've got going on defense. I can't wait to see a new head coach take charge and lead the team.

Seems strange to get excited about moves I don't really agree with. But it's the fan in me talking. No matter what happens with this team, no matter how retarded it may seem, I'm always going to love them. And I always want to see them succeed even more than I did the year before. That's loyalty. We all feel it, because we're all real fans.

We're divided on this site as to whether these moves make sense. But come September we'll all be united again by our love for the 'Skins and our insatiable desire to see them succeed. So I say thanks and good luck to Joe Gibbs, Gregg Williams, and Al Saunders. I won't forget them, especially Gibbs. But now I'm looking forward to forming new memories. I think we all are, no matter what we think of Danny.

It's the one thing that binds us all together. So here's to 2008, and cheers to whoever's in charge.

Hail.

Re: Solidarity
 

i hear you. zorn is a genius and campbell will improve dramatically and become and elite qb.

also laron landry will be a pro bowler next year mark my words

Re: Solidarity
 

I agree completely.

We all have opinions, but we all will be extremely excited come August to see what the new group can do!

Re: Solidarity
 

it may sound rude... but i think starting over is a good move based on we really didnt go anywhere with gibbs and co.... i know we made the post season 2 of the four years but both years it took streaks fo wins to get us there and we put everything in the season and spoil in the playoffs. another look at it would be that we go 6-10, 10-6, 5-11, and we made the playoffs as a 9-7 team last... 9-7 doesnt deserve to go in the playoffs IMO. we may have been on a upswing but that was four seasons and 2 of the four we were poop and the other 2 we were just average team in a very very weak nfc. so anyway, i think change was needed if gibbs left. but i only like the change move if shit head snyder sticks with it and not another mid season fire or changing it all up after 1 or 2 seasons again!!

Re: Solidarity
 

chances are the massive staffing changes and huge dropoff in coaching talent is going to result in another 6-10 type season.

we've actually got good team talent right now, but our OL and LBs are starting to get old.

winning teams have stability. we don't.

Re: Solidarity
 

The funny thing is once the schedule comes out there's going to be a slew of 12-4 or 11-5 predictions from some of the same people who are decrying this process..

Re: Solidarity
 

[quote=Paintrain;413559]The funny thing is once the schedule comes out there's going to be a slew of 12-4 or 11-5 predictions from some of the same people who are decrying this process..[/quote]Of course. No one actually thinks the Redskins are any worse off next year, it's just the thing to say right now.

90% of this sight will pick us to be in the playoffs next year.

Re: Solidarity
 

You don't have to tell me about loyalty. I've been a fan since 1971, moved to California in 1982 and have watched just about every game played in that span of 25 years (I might have missed 5 in total) I've made every excuse in the book not to miss games, lost old girlfriends over this team, had a lot of shit talked by 49ers fans, whom I hate. That's why it pisses me off when Snyder screws around whether it's good or bad. I guess you can say I bleed burgundy and gold. Can any of you guys top that?

Re: Solidarity
 

Good thread Schneed10. I think we have all done our share of bitching and now its time to move on and get ready for another season. Regardless of who the HC will be, I am going to support this team 110%.

Re: Solidarity
 

I just plain don't like jim fassel. I'll have a real hard time getting up for any offseason activity with him at the helm. I can't say that I'm fond of Cerrato either. If I were snyder I'd have thrown millions of dollars at AJ smith to come in and be the Sr. Pres. of football operations. I think he's the best GM in the biz.

If we give a new up and comer a chance, I'm okay with that... even though Im incredibly loyal by nature and it kills me that GW didn't get a shot.

Also, I can't get over the whole "smear campaign" crap. It seems to me that snyder has done many many things in order to get the public to back his bad decisions throughout the years, and even recently buying several media outlets that he controls himself and allowing them exclusive access to the team. He's already reputed as one of the worst owners in the league, and I can honestly say if I were a coach, I would't work for him. Not a chance after seeing some of the things that went on before gibbs came back... and now that he's gone it just feels to me like he went right back to the same old bs. Maybe I'm wrong, but it sure looks that way.

I'm not at all saying I won't be a skins fan, I will be until I die... but I am less than enthused at the way things are going down right now.

Re: Solidarity
 

[QUOTE=SFREDSKIN;413567]You don't have to tell me about loyalty. I've been a fan since 1971, moved to California in 1982 and have watched just about every game played in that span of 25 years (I might have missed 5 in total) I've made every excuse in the book not to miss games, lost old girlfriends over this team, had a lot of shit talked by 49ers fans, whom I hate. That's why it pisses me off when Snyder screws around whether it's good or bad. I guess you can say I bleed burgundy and gold. Can any of you guys top that?[/QUOTE]

This isn't some sort of competition, so you don't have to go thumping your chest about your fanhood.

Re: Solidarity
 

[QUOTE=Redskins_P;413571]Good thread Schneed10. I think we have all done our share of bitching and now its time to move on and get ready for another season. Regardless of who the HC will be, I am going to support this team 110%.[/QUOTE]

It's too bad we have to wait so many months just to see these guys back on the field again.

Re: Solidarity
 

any of you guys hyped what kind of superstars laron landry and JC will turn into???

Re: Solidarity
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;413575]This isn't some sort of competition, so you don't have to go thumping your chest about your fanhood.[/QUOTE]

I'm just expressing my feelings of all the crap I've been through, I'm sure there might be other fans that have endured more. I've you seen this it also pains you of what a proud franchise this once was and what a joke or embarrassment it has become. Capish?

Re: Solidarity
 

First off I agree with the OP and I hope the Skins prove me wrong next year but I got a couple thoughts....

[QUOTE=skinsfanzg18;413546]i hear you. zorn is a genius and campbell will improve dramatically and become and elite qb.

also laron landry will be a pro bowler next year mark my words[/QUOTE]

Well I agree with Landry but how is Zorn a genius? Hes been a QB coach for 7 years in Seattle not the Offensive Coordinator. I hope your right but im not crowning him as a genius just yet.

[QUOTE=Paintrain;413559]The funny thing is once the schedule comes out there's going to be a slew of 12-4 or 11-5 predictions from some of the same people who are decrying this process..[/QUOTE]

I see this team as a 6-10 team right now and this will not change. When a coaching staff has as many changes as we will have it will show on the field early in the first couple months of the season. This years team could click later on in the year but the NFC East is strong and we have just lost our whole teams identity in a period of less than a month. I dont care who we bring in in FA or the draft this team easily is worst off than any team in our division. Alot of people around here dont understand the importance of coaching. Come September people will realize what happens when you lose your HOF Head Coach, and 2 of the best coordinators in the game.

Re: Solidarity
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;413567]You don't have to tell me about loyalty. I've been a fan since 1971, moved to California in 1982 and have watched just about every game played in that span of 25 years (I might have missed 5 in total) I've made every excuse in the book not to miss games, lost old girlfriends over this team, had a lot of shit talked by 49ers fans, whom I hate. That's why it pisses me off when Snyder screws around whether it's good or bad. I guess you can say I bleed burgundy and gold. Can any of you guys top that?[/quote]

the day I was born my mom was wearing a dallas cowboy shirt and I strangled her to death with the embilical cord. I've been in the angola pen since that very day. don't talk to me about fanhood.

Re: Solidarity
 

I will pumped, but I don't see us with more than 6 or 7 wins followed by the usual end-of-year-implosion by the team, so I won't be as hyped as usual when the season starts...which I guess, in a way, is good because I usually almost die of a heart attack on a weekly basis.

Re: Solidarity
 

[quote=Paintrain;413559]The funny thing is once the schedule comes out there's going to be a slew of 12-4 or 11-5 predictions from some of the same people who are decrying this process..[/quote]

The schedule is out as follows: Of course plus our (2) divisional games per team. Dallas, Giants, Philly.

[B]2008[/B] [B]Home[/B] 2008 AWAY


[B]
Home-Cards /Away-49's
Home-Rams /Away-Seattle
Home-Browns/Away -Ravens
Home-Steelers/Away- Bengals
Home-Saints/Away- Lions

2008 and 2009 schedules:
[URL="http://www.redskins.com/news/0309schedules.jsp"]Washington Redskins[/URL]
[/B]

Re: Solidarity
 

[QUOTE=skinsfan_nn;413586]The schedule is out as follows: Of course plus our (2) divisional games per team. Dallas, Giants, Philly.

[B]2008[/B] [B]Home[/B] [B]Away[/B] Arizona San Francisco St. Louis Seattle Cleveland Baltimore Pittsburgh Cincinnati New Orleans Detroit[/QUOTE]
This is easier to look at.

Home: Dallas Cowboys, New York Giants, Philadelphia Eagles, Arizona Cardinals, St. Louis Rams, New Orleans Saints, Cleveland Browns, Pittsburgh Steelers

Away: Dallas Cowboys, New York Giants, Philadelphia Eagles, San Francisco 49ers, Seattle Seahawks, Detroit Lions, Baltimore Ravens, Cincinnati Bengals

Re: Solidarity
 

[quote=SmootSmack;413577]It's too bad we have to wait so many months just to see these guys back on the field again.[/quote]

True. At least we have Free Agency and pretty much all of our draft picks, so there will be plenty to talk about. I'm sure the time will go by faster than we think.

Its going to be very interesting to see how we approach the off-season with a new coaching staff.

Re: Solidarity
 

I can't wait to see what the new coaches will be able to do next year and Hopefully it'll be a better year then 07..... (and of course can't wait to see what Favre does too)

Re: Solidarity
 

I just don't understand why they did not promote Williams and give him and Al Saunders one more year. After all we looked pretty good toward the end of the year with Collins. I think Cambell would have been really good in that offense next year.

And if it did not work then go and get Bill Cower. I just don't like Fossel. How can a guy go from one of the highest paid and respected guys in the league does not get his shot. And if we bring in a guy that has never been a head coach I am going to pull my hair out.

I had just started coming around on Snyder (because of the class he showed during the death of Sean Taylor) and he goes and does something crazy.

Guess we can just cross our fingers and hope Snyder has something up his sleeve. I mean I think we were all shocked when he got Gibbs back!!

Re: Solidarity
 

[quote=That Guy;413558]chances are the massive staffing changes and huge dropoff in coaching talent is going to result in another 6-10 type season.....winning teams have stability. we don't.[/quote]
The "stability" at the Steelers and Cowboys didn't work out too bad this year. McCarthy at Green Bay is only in his 2nd year and they did well. "Never Nervous" Norval did pretty well in San Diego this year.

Where is the "huge drop-off" in coaching talent, outside of Gibbs leaving? Zorn did a good job in Seattle with Hasselbeck, their offense has been solid and they did well this year with no running game. Blanche was a good DC in Chicago and was key in developing the gameplans here. As long as we make a solid HC hire we will be fine.

Also, looking at next years schedule I really don't see 6-10. There wil be a drop-off in Dallas, Parcells raided their coaching staff. I don't see the Eagles being a powerhouse. The 49ers won't improve much, neither will the Cardinals, St. Louis & Baltimore will struggle, the Saints, Browns & Lions are all inconsistent. I wouldn't book Super Bowl XLIII tickets just yet, but we will be fine.

Re: Solidarity
 

I think we will all be pretty darn excited around training camp time when we start to see this engine run. All this mess will be behind us, and we will be looking forward to seeing our team come together and making another run at this thing.

Looking at the schedule I also don't early on see us as any 6-10 team, get some of our key injury guys back, work the draft ( which is GREAT), and a few FA moves. I don't care whos at the helm I see us being as good or better than last year.

Re: Solidarity
 

[quote=skinsfanzg18;413579]any of you guys hyped what kind of superstars laron landry and JC will turn into???[/quote]I've maintained all along that Campbell was on the verge of a breakout season under Saunders next year, but with a new OC and system, I'm not so sure. To be honest, we're probably more likely to see offensive struggles that were especially apparent during Saunders's first year when players were learning his complicated system.

As for Landry, he was playing like a pro-bowler almost as soon as he was moved to FS. I hope that Blache leaves him there, because no other safety on the team has the range to go sideline to sideline.

Re: Solidarity
 

[QUOTE=canthetuna;413574]I just plain don't like jim fassel. I'll have a real hard time getting up for any offseason activity with him at the helm. I can't say that I'm fond of Cerrato either. If I were snyder I'd have thrown millions of dollars at AJ smith to come in and be the Sr. Pres. of football operations. I think he's the best GM in the biz.

If we give a new up and comer a chance, I'm okay with that... even though Im incredibly loyal by nature and it kills me that GW didn't get a shot.

Also, I can't get over the whole "smear campaign" crap. It seems to me that snyder has done many many things in order to get the public to back his bad decisions throughout the years, and even recently buying several media outlets that he controls himself and allowing them exclusive access to the team. He's already reputed as one of the worst owners in the league, and I can honestly say if I were a coach, I would't work for him. Not a chance after seeing some of the things that went on before gibbs came back... and now that he's gone it just feels to me like he went right back to the same old bs. Maybe I'm wrong, but it sure looks that way.

I'm not at all saying I won't be a skins fan, I will be until I die... but I am less than enthused at the way things are going down right now.[/QUOTE]

Yep. Especially the part about a coach's perspective. Sort of funny some of us have assumed Snyder will get The Chin next year if that's what the plan is. Cowher knows what it means to work under a patient owner, which makes me think he'll probably never deal w/ Snyder. Cowher is probably headed to Carolina next year to turn that team around. At any rate, my guess is a lot of coaches around the league would never work for Snyder, maybe even most coaches. I wouldn't be at all surprised if for many years to come Snyder has to choose from average to below-average coaches. I just don't see guys of real character (aside from Gibbs) putting up w/ the drama and bullshit Snyder likes to create.

Re: Solidarity
 

After all of the whining about wanting an "up and coming guy," or "young," innovative," we got it. Zorn isn't a retread. He's ready to prove that he can run an offense. After a badly called day we don't have to hear of the 2004 Chiefs or some other blast from Suanders past that put up great numbers.
Defensively, we wanted some continuity. Got that too. Blache doesn't want to be a HC and in a few years could retire and turn it over to Olividatti. After the successes and failures of the past 4 years expect Blache to improve the D and finish top 5.
As for the HC, I don't want a great coach with a "proven system." Follow the lead of the Cowboys, Colts and Steelers (and yes Gibbs 2.0). Coordinators coach and scheme. HC's lead men.

Re: Solidarity
 

[QUOTE=rypper11;413626]After all of the whining about wanting an "up and coming guy," or "young," innovative," we got it. Zorn isn't a retread. He's ready to prove that he can run an offense. After a badly called day we don't have to hear of the 2004 Chiefs or some other blast from Suanders past that put up great numbers.
Defensively, we wanted some continuity. Got that too. Blache doesn't want to be a HC and in a few years could retire and turn it over to Olividatti. After the successes and failures of the past 4 years expect Blache to improve the D and finish top 5.
As for the HC, I don't want a great coach with a "proven system." Follow the lead of the Cowboys, Colts and Steelers (and yes Gibbs 2.0). Coordinators coach and scheme. HC's lead men.[/QUOTE]

Maybe that will be the plan in bringing in Fassel, if he fails Zorn gets promoted to HC. Zorn is an excellent, innovative up and coming coach. I loved him as a player and I'm sure also as OC. We were lucky Seattle didn't give him the OC position, otherwise we would be screwed.

Re: Solidarity
 

Lets all face the music. I like the idea of Zorn but I have this little voice in me saying even though he has been in the same offense learning everything and how to run it...all he has done was coach the QB's. Yes he will be great for Jason but will he be great for the whole offense? Will he be able to game plan? Then theres Blache. I keep reading how he game plans like no other coach, I hope so. I also worry about how he will coach the D. Is he also a start from the back of the defense and work forward or is he going to bring in some better, younger DL/DE? I always felt we were over loaded at CB and LB.

Who knows maybe the offense will be better in the WC. Maybe Portis will shine like he did in Denver. Maybe the D will be alot better and will not fizzle in the 4th quarter. Most importantly maybe we can bring in a trainer to stop all the ham string crap and pulled groin muscles.

Re: Solidarity
 

This is a nice idea, and I wish I could just put this past month behind me and move on, but I'm still really, really bitter about what Snyder's done here.

Frankly, even if he produces a winning product next year or in the near future, it's going to be hard for me to accept. I'll still be pulling for my guys on the field, but I really can't support Dan Snyder or anything he stands for at this point.

I now have the same nauseated feeling about this franchise as I did when we had that awful, gaudy, summer where Deion was giving a press conference in a Burgundy suit and we defrosted Bruce Smith out of cryogenic storage in that pathetic record grab. I guess the only difference is, I really like our players today (as opposed to the awful retreads we had back then). But, I feel like the leadership and brotherhood that had developed over the last year is probably gone now.

I'll always be a Redskins fan, but right now I'm saying: thank God for the Wizards.

Re: Solidarity
 

[quote=SBXVII;413639]Lets all face the music. I like the idea of Zorn but I have this little voice in me saying even though he has been in the same offense learning everything and how to run it...all he has done was coach the QB's. Yes he will be great for Jason but will he be great for the whole offense? Will he be able to game plan? Then theres Blache. I keep reading how he game plans like no other coach, I hope so. I also worry about how he will coach the D. Is he also a start from the back of the defense and work forward or is he going to bring in some better, younger DL/DE? I always felt we were over loaded at CB and LB.[/quote]
This is exactly what is needed though. Find that new talent, not recycle.

Re: Solidarity
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;413580]I'm just expressing my feelings of all the crap I've been through, I'm sure there might be other fans that have endured more. I've you seen this it also pains you of what a proud franchise this once was and what a joke or embarrassment it has become. Capish?[/quote]
If you really feel that this team has become a joke or embarrassment how or why would you still cheer for them? If I felt that way I would not back a team.

Re: Solidarity
 

[QUOTE=firstdown;413725]If you really feel that this team has become a joke or embarrassment how or why would you still cheer for them? If I felt that way I would not back a team.[/QUOTE]

Because I love the team, the tradition, history, etc. I don't like what our latest owner has done. I have lots of mixed feelings right now.

Re: Solidarity
 

[quote=SouperMeister;413622]I've maintained all along that Campbell was on the verge of a breakout season under Saunders next year, but with a new OC and system, I'm not so sure. To be honest, we're probably more likely to see offensive struggles that were especially apparent during Saunders's first year when players were learning his complicated system.

As for Landry, he was playing like a pro-bowler almost as soon as he was moved to FS. I hope that Blache leaves him there, because no other safety on the team has the range to go sideline to sideline.[/quote]
I'm was not convensed that JC was improving under Saunders system. In fact he was in a four game loosing streek befor Collins came off the bench. Collins ran the system just fine but he has half the talent of JC who it seems just did not have a grasp of the system. Our O was still rank way down again this year. Why is everyone bashing Snyder for this wasn't it Gibbs who jumped ship with one year left on his contract.

Re: Solidarity
 

I think if we were going to hire Fassel we would of hired him by now so lets hope we can be greatful for that. I also think that is is fair to wait until after the Super Bowl to find the coach. It should almost be a rule that teams wait and hire the head coach untill after the Super Bowl. Who know maybe we will hire belichick. Highly doubtful and you all cant say that you would not want him. Besides what else does he have to prove in New England. Ok I will put my crack pipe down now.

Re: Solidarity
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;413727]Because I love the team, the tradition, history, etc. I don't like what our latest owner has done. I have lots of mixed feelings right now.[/quote]
Well it was Gibbs that walked with another year on his contract leaving us with this issues. I'm not placing any judgement on what Snyder has done until I see the product on the field. Saunders system was not really working here. Williams while he has done a great job with our D we have no way of known if he was cut out to be a head coach. AS a matter of fact we have more evidence that says he has struggled as a head coach.

Re: Solidarity
 

[QUOTE=firstdown;413731]Well it was Gibbs that walked with another year on his contract leaving us with this issues. I'm not placing any judgement on what Snyder has done until I see the product on the field. Saunders system was not really working here. Williams while he has done a great job with our D we have no way of known if he was cut out to be a head coach. AS a matter of fact we have more evidence that says he has struggled as a head coach.[/QUOTE]

Joe didn't walk away, he had legitimate obligations to take care of. Joe is not Dan's babysitter, if Dan was smart he would have prepared himself for the day Joe quit and have a plan in advance. I won't judge Dan (even if I rip him ) until I see what he gives us. We'll see what kind of football mind he is.

Re: Solidarity
 

It seems that all Coaches that have been here since Snyder except Gibbs have had a difficult time working with Snyder because of all his meddling ways.

It's only because it was Gibbs that we didn't see the same thing happen in the last four years.

But we are going to see it again and it's going to be worse then it ever has been because Snyder thinks he's even smarter now then he was four years ago.

Here comes another era of pussy whipped coaches.