Well, just like old times..
 

Looks like we re in overhaul once again

[url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/11/AR2008021102433.html]washingtonpost.com[/url]

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=GridIron26;421042]Looks like we re in overhaul once again

[url=http://washingtonpost.com]washingtonpost.com - nation, world, technology and Washington area news and headlines[/url][/quote]

Aww yeah. Time for Daniel Snyder to dump everyone but Jason Campbell and Clinton Portis and make a brand new team!... again!

You know its the off season baby! :woot:

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

God I hope this guys info is off. I really don't want to see the Skins blow a ton of cap space and draft picks on a aging vet who sees the Skins' front office as all day suckers.

Again.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[QUOTE=GridIron26;421042]Looks like we re in overhaul once again

[url=http://washingtonpost.com]washingtonpost.com - nation, world, technology and Washington area news and headlines[/url][/QUOTE]

Where did you see an overhaul in that article? Don't fall into the media trap of 'here we go again' because some people are coming in and some people are leaving, that's the nature of the NFL..

Chad Johnson is a Pro Bowl WR in his prime.. He just turned 30 a couple of weeks ago, averaged 90+ catches the past 6 yrs, over 1200 yds and 7 TD each of those years.. Lance Briggs is someone the FO has a hard on for at the LB position and he can come in and be a starter for years. McIntosh is coming off of an injury and Washington is coming off of 2 consecutive injury plagued seasons and is likely in his final year as a Redskin.

Other than those 2 names, the FO is looking at adding depth across the board..

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

The average turnover in the NFL during the offseason is typically 10-15 players per team so if we only bring in two or three and fill in the rest with low key role players that doesn't sound like much of an "overhaul" to me.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

its the off season, so that gives everyone the right to panic

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=dmek25;421056]its the off season, so that gives everyone the right to panic[/quote]


No kidding. Stupid FO! Trying to make our team better, for shame.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[QUOTE=Paintrain;421052]Where did you see an overhaul in that article? Don't fall into the media trap of 'here we go again' because some people are coming in and some people are leaving, that's the nature of the NFL..

Chad Johnson is a Pro Bowl WR in his prime.. He just turned 30 a couple of weeks ago, averaged 90+ catches the past 6 yrs, over 1200 yds and 7 TD each of those years.. Lance Briggs is someone the FO has a hard on for at the LB position and he can come in and be a starter for years. McIntosh is coming off of an injury and Washington is coming off of 2 consecutive injury plagued seasons and is likely in his final year as a Redskin.

Other than those 2 names, the FO is looking at adding depth across the board..[/QUOTE]

I have to agree. There didn't seem to be a single "WTF" move emntioned there. The question froms that article are what will it cost to get CJ. If it is as much as JLC mentioned then I say no go. The market was set last year with the Moss aquisition adn while that was undermarket deal it still should be significant. I hoestly wouldn't giv more than a 2nd and a 4th for CJ. I'd rather sign Javon Walker for an OK contract than trade good picks for CJ and cash him in with a giant contract. As for Briggs he'll certainly be cheaper than he would have been. Kudos for not pulling the trigger.

Everything else addresses a serious concern in terms of depth due to lack of skill or injury.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

Maybe we could pull out the mega trade and give up Brandon Lloyd for Chad.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

This article did give me that old feeling again, like Danny & Vinny haven't learned anything.

I always was optimistic in the offseason, but since 06 I've become more cynical. It's not the mention of 2 big FA's that's scary, it's the potential cost & the fact that one of them IMO has the potential to be a problem (CJ).

Let's all give it time of course, this article cites sources who are speculating based on what they've heard. Who knows what the real price for CJ & Briggs will be? I hope that Danny & Vinny are putting out smokescreens to the rest of the nfl. The Danny has shown recently that he's capable of patience & methodical decision making. I hope he takes the same approach this offseason.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=freddyg12;421081]This article did give me that old feeling again, like Danny & Vinny haven't learned anything.

I always was optimistic in the offseason, but since 06 I've become more cynical. It's not the mention of 2 big FA's that's scary, it's the potential cost & the fact that one of them IMO has the potential to be a problem (CJ).

Let's all give it time of course, this article cites sources who are speculating based on what they've heard. Who knows what the real price for CJ & Briggs will be? I hope that Danny & Vinny are putting out smokescreens to the rest of the nfl. The Danny has shown recently that he's capable of patience & methodical decision making. I hope he takes the same approach this offseason.[/quote]

its just an article, mabye theyve learned...
but they are still going to want to win now and we have a new coach so we are goign to bring in new people. Its hard to judge how fast we get players in FA because we used to changes coachs a lot and new coachs want their type of players. We had Gibbs for a while so thats probably why it just seemed like we wernt going after as many free agents

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=SKINSnCANES;421084]its just an article, mabye theyve learned...
but they are still going to want to win now and we have a new coach so we are goign to bring in new people. Its hard to judge how fast we get players in FA because we used to changes coachs a lot and new coachs want their type of players. We had Gibbs for a while so thats probably why it just seemed like we wernt going after as many free agents[/quote]

What concerns me is that we have a new coach & new O. JC & Zorn have enough of a task ahead in just getting into a working groove. Add Chad Johnson to that & does it make it easier or does his ego & selfishness disrupt the learning curve?

I fear the latter. I'm all for bringing in a solid wr, but CJ is not worth it.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

How is this like old times? There are only two changes mentioned:[LIST][*]We desperately need a possession and playmaking receiver - CJ fits that bill.[*]Our LBs are pretty dinged up - Lance Briggs fills that need.[/LIST]What's shocking is the attempt at consistency and avoiding aging vets:[LIST][*]JC has the full support of Snyder and VC - [U]screw that, can you say "QB controversy"?[/U][*]We aren't going after Collins - [U]what?!? We aren't throwing insane money at a 2-year player? Yeah, sounds just like old times to me![/U][*]We aren't re-signing Brunell - [U](see comment for Collins)[/U][*]We are looking into Dilfer, a backup who knows the offense - [U]that's CRAZY talk, right there[/U].[*]Snyder wants to make sure the players we have (Moss/ARE) stay healthy - [U]Bring me Snyder's head![/U][*]We aren't throwing money at Rock just to do returns? [U]The madness![/U][*]The Skins are going to use Lorenzo Alexander and Heyer to beef up the O-line and Wilson on the D-line - [U]I can't believe we are going to groom players we drafted (or picked up undrafted) as starters. VC is a lackey - bring me his head too.[/U][/LIST]Jeez, it feels just like 1999 again. :doh:

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

I'm not buying that we'll deal for Chad. Too much to give up. There are plenty of cheaper options out there.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

i certainly dont have any issue with the prospect of bring in "ocho cinco". with him, moss, randel el, cooley and portis on the field for pretty much the entire game is a daunting task for any defense to handle. However, I dont like the idea of possibly having to give up a 1st round pick for a 30 year old receiver no matter what his career numbers are. I am one who thinks bringing in a guy like Porter or Jevon Walker for lesser in terms of draft picks would be fine. Porter is not happy in Oakland and it shows on the field. Porter is a good receiver, has the size, the speed and the ability to go and get the ball.
Briggs?? not sure how I feel about that. Rocky should be ready by the start of the season so not sure where they would play him, unless they plan on dropping marcus or moving him to more of a part time player due to injuries. Briggs is a stud, still young and can play side line to side line. Paired with Fletcher and Rocky they would be a very strong LB core.

the move that would bother me more is letting Rock go. Rock has busted his ass since being here going from FB, to RB, then returner. He has done everything this organization has asked and excelled in his new role on special teams. He is a true redskin, which this term seems to be brushed aside when a new regime takes over.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=onlydarksets;421088]How is this like old times? There are only two changes mentioned:[LIST][*]We desperately need a possession and playmaking receiver - CJ fits that bill.[*]Our LBs are pretty dinged up - Lance Briggs fills that need.[/LIST]What's shocking is the attempt at consistency and avoiding aging vets:[LIST][*]JC has the full support of Snyder and VC - [U]screw that, can you say "QB controversy"?[/U][*]We aren't going after Collins - [U]what?!? We aren't throwing insane money at a 2-year player? Yeah, sounds just like old times to me![/U][*]We aren't re-signing Brunell - [U](see comment for Collins)[/U][*]We are looking into Dilfer, a backup who knows the offense - [U]that's CRAZY talk, right there[/U].[*]Snyder wants to make sure the players we have (Moss/ARE) stay healthy - [U]Bring me Snyder's head![/U][*]We aren't throwing money at Rock just to do returns? [U]The madness![/U][*]The Skins are going to use Lorenzo Alexander and Heyer to beef up the O-line and Wilson on the D-line - [U]I can't believe we are going to groom players we drafted (or picked up undrafted) as starters. VC is a lackey - bring me his head too.[/U][/LIST]Jeez, it feels just like 1999 again. :doh:[/quote]
Damn fine post!:goodjob:

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=onlydarksets;421088]How is this like old times? There are only two changes mentioned:[LIST][*]We desperately need a possession and playmaking receiver - CJ fits that bill.[*]Our LBs are pretty dinged up - Lance Briggs fills that need.[/LIST]What's shocking is the attempt at consistency and avoiding aging vets:[LIST][*]JC has the full support of Snyder and VC - [U]screw that, can you say "QB controversy"?[/U][*]We aren't going after Collins - [U]what?!? We aren't throwing insane money at a 2-year player? Yeah, sounds just like old times to me![/U][*]We aren't re-signing Brunell - [U](see comment for Collins)[/U][*]We are looking into Dilfer, a backup who knows the offense - [U]that's CRAZY talk, right there[/U].[*]Snyder wants to make sure the players we have (Moss/ARE) stay healthy - [U]Bring me Snyder's head![/U][*]We aren't throwing money at Rock just to do returns? [U]The madness![/U][*]The Skins are going to use Lorenzo Alexander and Heyer to beef up the O-line and Wilson on the D-line - [U]I can't believe we are going to groom players we drafted (or picked up undrafted) as starters. VC is a lackey - bring me his head too.[/U][/LIST]Jeez, it feels just like 1999 again. :doh:[/quote]

Stop making sense. It's more fun to just freak out and ignore what the article really says.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

Where have you heard that McIntosh will be ready to go on opening day? I've heard mid-season at best.

As for Rock, there are a couple of threads on this. The bottom-line is that he can't make RB money doing returns, and there is no room for him at backup RB. I don't know what he is asking, but combined with the fact that we are committed to Betts (contractually), it doesn't leave much room for him at the salary he likely wants.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

I thought I read something a month or so ago where Bubba tyer said rocky should be ready by the beginning of the season.
With Rock, I dont know what he is asking for either, but with his stellar play on special teams as the kick returner and coverage he found his niche on this team. I think rock is a tremendous team mate and locker room leader.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[QUOTE=#56fanatic;421107]I thought I read something a month or so ago where Bubba tyer said rocky should be ready by the beginning of the season.
With Rock, I dont know what he is asking for either, but with his stellar play on special teams as the kick returner and coverage he found his niche on this team. I think rock is a tremendous team mate and locker room leader.[/QUOTE]

I seem to remember reading a month or so ago (on the washingtonpost) that rock actually made a statement along the lines of "i want to get paid." from that point, he was dead to me. I believe he even mentioned 10 million dollars. he also wants to be somewhere where he will regularly see action on offense.... that won't happen here. Rock is going but if thats his attitude, i wont miss him.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=Paintrain;421052]Where did you see an overhaul in that article? Don't fall into the media trap of 'here we go again' because some people are coming in and some people are leaving, that's the nature of the NFL..

Chad Johnson is a Pro Bowl WR in his prime.. He just turned 30 a couple of weeks ago, averaged 90+ catches the past 6 yrs, over 1200 yds and 7 TD each of those years.. Lance Briggs is someone the FO has a hard on for at the LB position and he can come in and be a starter for years. McIntosh is coming off of an injury and Washington is coming off of 2 consecutive injury plagued seasons and is likely in his final year as a Redskin.

Other than those 2 names, the FO is looking at adding depth across the board..[/quote]


Other than those 2 Blockbuster, Huge salary deals there's nothing to see here.

Mostly speculation, but i'm sure there's some truth to it. I'm not against us signing a FA as long as we don't trade our draft for it.
No,

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

I enjoyed the article. First of all, I don't think the changes mentioned are that outrageous, but let's also look at how many changes have recently happened in DC. We have a complete change of philosophy in offense which may require new personnel, ie a big named receiver like a Chad Johnson. I think we could get him for relatively cheap. Unfortunately, I think Vinny's biggest downside is his negotiation prowess (or lack there of). I've heard two 3rds for Chad Johnson rumored on NFL radio, I'd give that up in a second for a true #1 receiver which is something the skins desperately lack.

As usual people want to bag on Snyder for no particular reason.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=#56fanatic;421107]I thought I read something a month or so ago where Bubba tyer said rocky should be ready by the beginning of the season.
With Rock, I dont know what he is asking for either, but with his stellar play on special teams as the kick returner and coverage he found his niche on this team. I think rock is a tremendous team mate and locker room leader.[/quote]

I read that too. I read he was ahead of schedule and should be ready for training camp.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=TheMalcolmConnection;421123]I read that too. I read he was ahead of schedule and should be ready for training camp.[/quote]
Most accounts have him 9-12 months of rehab away from playing (he had surgery at the beginning of January, I believe). That's September at best, but far from a sure thing at this point until we see how he responds to PT. I do recall Gibbs saying he hoped he would be ready at the earlier end of that, but I don't recall any basis for his speculation.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[QUOTE=firstdown;421078]Maybe we could pull out the mega trade and give up Brandon Lloyd for Chad.[/QUOTE]

This was a joke right? Sometimes my sarcasm meter is a little off. I mean, you don't think they would give up a pro-bowl receiver for a guy who has 0 TDs in 2 years. Yeah must be kidding.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=#56fanatic;421107]I thought I read something a month or so ago where Bubba tyer said rocky should be ready by the beginning of the season.
With Rock, I dont know what he is asking for either, but with his stellar play on special teams as the kick returner and coverage he found his niche on this team. I think rock is a tremendous team mate and locker room leader.[/quote]

I think more than anything Rock wants the chance to carry the ball more, and with Betts and Portis ahead of him that's just not going to happen here.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

30 is pretty old for a WR. If he were 26, I might consider it, but then, teams don't trade WRs that are 26. They trade them when they're 30. Besides, he's a tremendous douchebag. His antics are lame. That HOF jacket was the worst celebration ever. Tony Kornheiser loved it though which sort of tells you just HOW lame the guy is.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

Ironically, I would'nt mind if the Front Office kept Mark Brunell. After all Brunell does have experience in the West Coast Offense and he even led the Jaguars to the AFC Championship running it. Brunell would be a good tutor to Jason Campbell and help aid in his learning curve.

If the FO goes after a reviever I think Chad Johnson would be a better fit here and he is a more team player than Randy Moss. Moss is only as good as the team he is on. When the going gets tough Moss will become a disruption or half tail it like he did in Oakland; he is not TO bad, but the Skins do not need that sort of distraction going on.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

CJ still has a few quality years left, at 30 he could easily go another 4-5 years at his current level of play. Not saying I want him, just saying.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

I loved this article...really no big suprises to me.
Nothing shocking and certainly nothing that says just like old times.

One nice point below that i didn't expect to see but many here pointed out as a need in prior threads:

"Team sources said Snyder is considering expanding his training rehab staff to help limit and cope with the number of hamstring issues, which were prevalent on the team in 2007"

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=Mattyk72;421137]CJ still has a few quality years left, at 30 he could easily go another 4-5 years at his current level of play. Not saying I want him, just saying.[/quote]


that's a good point TO is 34

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[QUOTE=firstdown;421078]Maybe we could pull out the mega trade and give up Brandon Lloyd for Chad.[/QUOTE]

Only if we can get Chad to renegotiate his salary to the veterans minimum.:cool-smil

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[QUOTE=Paintrain;421165]Only if we can get Chad to renegotiate his salary to the veterans minimum.:cool-smil[/QUOTE]

Or maybe a sign a trade of Cartwright for LT? ;)

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

Yup. People are completely misreading a newspaper article and starting an exaggerated thread fueled mainly by panic and ignorance...just like old times indeed.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=SmootSmack;421170]Yup. People are completely misreading a newspaper article and starting an exaggerated thread fueled mainly by panic and ignorance...just like old times indeed.[/quote]

Did those old times ever go away?

Sounds like the same old, same old.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;421140]that's a good point TO is 34[/quote]

Yep, and Moss is 31 this year, Reggie Wayne 30, and Torry Holt 32. That's half of the top 10 receivers in the league (including 4 of the top 5 in yardage). I have no problem getting a 30-year old receiver if he can be productive.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

I think what is getting people is the amount of info JLC threw into the post.

First off most of it is not hards news but rather source based speculation.
Second, I think we can pretty much expect not everything to happen even though most of the moves make complete sense.

This is what every team does. At the end of the season and the beginning of the off season they look at thier roster and figure out what needs to be fixed and what ways they can fix them. I can't say I disagree at all with what they apparently feel needs fixing.

Face it at some spots we are simply old and have serious injury risk/concern. We are an NFL team and this is the way it goes.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[QUOTE=Paintrain;421052]Where did you see an overhaul in that article? Don't fall into the media trap of 'here we go again' because some people are coming in and some people are leaving, that's the nature of the NFL..

Chad Johnson is a Pro Bowl WR in his prime.. He just turned 30 a couple of weeks ago, averaged 90+ catches the past 6 yrs, over 1200 yds and 7 TD each of those years.. Lance Briggs is someone the FO has a hard on for at the LB position and he can come in and be a starter for years. McIntosh is coming off of an injury and Washington is coming off of 2 consecutive injury plagued seasons and is likely in his final year as a Redskin.

Other than those 2 names, the FO is looking at adding depth across the board..[/QUOTE]


I agree...I read that particular article before I went to bed last night, and from what I gather it speaks nothing of an overhaul. It apears as though the team is preparing to move foreward which is the normal course of events that seperate one season from the next.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

I felt pretty good after reading the article. What I got from it was the Dan making necessary changes to make the team better.

CJ would be a great addition. I'm just not sure he is needed. When healthy, Moss can still be a deep threat, and can still put up numbers as good as Chad. Though I do agree that we need a big physical type WR.

If we are going to give up multiple draft picks for one player, I'd much rather it be for a stud pass rusher or DB.

Re: Well, just like old times..
 

[quote]CJ would be a great addition. I'm just not sure he is needed. When healthy, Moss can still be a deep threat, and can still put up numbers as good as Chad.[/quote]

If by putting up numbers, you mean drops. I'm with you.