Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3781605]ESPN - Jim Zorn's status with Washington Redskins not discussed[/url]

Classic front office speak.... I will be shocked if Zorn is here in 09

Dagger.... I guess we are starting over again.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

I would be more worried if he got a "vote of confidence."

He'll be here. Zorn was our choice of many candidates last year. VC said so.

Don't fire JZ. But if you do, Jim Schwartz and a GM, not Bill Cowher.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

I don't know. When asked if Zorn was staying, Vinny answered yeah, then reiterated the matter has'nt been discussed. Sounds to me like he slipped when he said yeah.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

I can only accept it if Vinny goes with him. Vinny drafts. Vinny sings older vets to big money deals. Vinny makes stupid trades. ANDDDDDDDD Vinny hired Zorn. Getting rid of Zorn and keeping Vinny fixes NOTHING.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

I hope he is back.....but why wouldn't VC just say so? If he knows he is coming back why be so secretive?

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=53Fan;513643]I don't know. When asked if Zorn was staying, Vinny answered yeah, then reiterated the matter has'nt been discussed. Sounds to me like he slipped when he said yeah.[/quote]

He's saying that Zorn will be back and that they didn't even discusss a change.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=53Fan;513643]I don't know. When asked if Zorn was staying, Vinny answered yeah, then reiterated the matter has'nt been discussed. Sounds to me like he slipped when he said yeah.[/quote]

I think Zorn is gone. He has lost 5 straight to sub par teams, he then got into it with arguably our best offensive player. All of this as well as the fact management sides with big name players.


[B]Bottom Line: If Zorn goes 7-9 he'll see the door[/B]

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=maroonandblack30;513646]I hope he is back.....but why wouldn't VC just say so? If he knows he is coming back why be so secretive?[/quote]


EXACTLY! Why not come out and say this is our guy enough! All rumors would end.

I think JZ is gone also and honestly I don't care, if he stays or goes this team is going to suck fow awhile.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

I think this is another reason that VC shouldn't have a talk show. What's the purpose? Get that schlub Larry Michael to do it. You know, i don't mind LM on the radio broadcast. I just can't listen to any Redskins show w/ him on it. I get the part that he's working for the skins...they pay his bills, etc. There's something to be said for a little bit of objectivity. The skins can do no wrong in his b&g eyes.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=WaldSkins;513650]He's saying that Zorn will be back and that they didn't even discusss a change.[/quote]

:food-smil

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=vallin21;513651]I think Zorn is gone. He has lost 5 straight to sub par teams, he then got into it with arguably our best offensive player. All of this as well as the fact management sides with big name players.


[B]Bottom Line: If Zorn goes 7-9 he'll see the door[/B][/quote]

Sub-par? Steelers, Cowboys, Giants, Ravens? those aren't sub par teams.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=maroonandblack30;513635][URL="http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3781605"]ESPN - Jim Zorn's status with Washington Redskins not discussed[/URL]

Classic front office speak.... I will be shocked if Zorn is here in 09

Dagger.... I guess we are starting over again.[/quote]
What do you mean by classic front office speak. He said they have not discussed the issue so I would think that looks better for Zorn. If they are talking about the issue then they would be talking about letting him go.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=maroonandblack30;513667]Sub-par? Steelers, Cowboys, Giants, Ravens? those aren't sub par teams.[/quote]

So your saying we can't beat those teams. 3 of those 4 games were at home. Baltimore is a 45 min drive. They might not be "sub par" but all 4 games are games we had a chance to win.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[url=http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d80d6d12a&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true]These 10 understudies ready to become leading men[/url]

NFL.com has put together their own list. So with that said anyone up for hiring Brian Schottenheimer? Yeah I thought he was a little young myself.

Can't say thought that I'm to excited about the list. I mean Spags won't come here, Fischer will probably advise Swartz not to come here considering what we did to his friend GW as well as the fact that Swartz will get plently of offers.

Jeff Davidson though seemed intriguing considering his offensive philosophy, influences, and age. Though I wish I knew a little more about his personallity.

Ironically right now among the many coaching related thoughts in my ADD mind maybe we could go a long way towards getting the locker room back together by bringing back GW. However that would also make it less likely for us to be able to cut Springs, Griffin, and Washington in one big swoop. Anyway heres a short list of guys I'd like to see as possible head coaches of the Washington Redskins.

GW, Grimm, Davidson, Swartz, Cowher, Mooch (yes I still think he would make a lot of sense), and Spagnola (fat chance). Not to crazy about the Holgrom theory.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

Classic front office speak = "We will evaluate everything at the end of the year, right now we will focus on the next opponent" Translation = our coach is gone.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=vallin21;513670]So your saying we can't beat those teams. 3 of those 4 games were at home. Baltimore is a 45 min drive. They might not be "sub par" but all 4 games are games we had a chance to win.[/quote]

Those are definitely not sub-par teams though. I think the concern shouldn't be that we lost to those teams so much as how non-competitive we looked.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=vallin21;513670]So your saying we can't beat those teams. 3 of those 4 games were at home. Baltimore is a 45 min drive. They might not be "sub par" but all 4 games are games we had a chance to win.[/quote]

Where did I say we couldn't beat those teams? I am just disputing that teams with a combined record of 40-13 aren't "sub-par" I think thats pretty obvious.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=SmootSmack;513673]Those are definitely not sub-par teams though. I think the concern shouldn't be that we lost to those teams so much as how non-competitive we looked.[/quote]

Absolutely.... our offense look over whelmed all 5 games.... not a good sign.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=maroonandblack30;513672]Classic front office speak = "We will evaluate everything at the end of the year, right now we will focus on the next opponent" Translation = our coach is gone.[/quote]
If you say so.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

I heard Vinny this am and it really didn't sound like a vote of confidence for Zorn. It sounded like Vinny was dancing around the subject. I just kind of think that the problem in the locker room is what's going to get him fired.... as well as his offense sucking beyond belief.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

If Vinny wants a scapegoat for the teams poor performance, than he can look in the mirror. Our struggles are stemming from learning a complex new offense (any former WCO QB will tell you it takes a few seasons, not a few games, to become proficient), and big time personnel issues. The former Vinny and everyone else knew when Zorn was hired, the latter is directly Vinny's fault. Not to mention Zorn wasn't given much say on the coaches, aside from Smith and Mitchell.

Now, if Zorn is a poor motivator, can't relate to players, and has already lost the locker room... well that's a different story. Has this happened? I don't know, but I hope not.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

If Zorn goes, JC might as well go to. I feel bad for JC, what a "cursed" career. I think he could/would be good if ever got a chance to learn a system.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

I think before Zorn goes or Vinny, there has to be an overhaul of the coaching staff. Find out if Blache and Bugel are truly committed to another year on the team, move Jackson, Hixon, and Smith out of here the day after the last game. Start there.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

If Zorn goes than Vinny has to go also if Snyder wants an OUNCE of respect from whomever he hires to run things.

The only scenario where I want to see changes are if we bring in someone to run the entire operation (Scott Pioli, Floyd Reese, James Harris, Mike Holmgren) and they are given a true opportunity to set the organizational course for the future.

We are not one player, coach or scheme change away from being an elite team. I've been fooled into thinking we were on the cusp, but we need to step back, rebuild and establish an organizational philosophy that promotes winning.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=SmootSmack;513686]I think before Zorn goes or Vinny, there has to be an overhaul of the coaching staff. Find out if Blache and Bugel are truly committed to another year on the team, move Jackson, Hixon, and Smith out of here the day after the last game. Start there.[/quote]


Good call.... give Zorn a chance to build his own staff. I agree.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=SmootSmack;513686]I think before Zorn goes or Vinny, there has to be an overhaul of the coaching staff. Find out if Blache and Bugel are truly committed to another year on the team, move Jackson, Hixon, and Smith out of here the day after the last game. Start there.[/quote]

I think Blache should go. He wanted to retire anyway, we convinced him to stick around. We need a coach who cares about sacks and turnovers. Those kind of momentum swings affect games way too heavily to not put a premium on them.

Jackson, Hixon, and Smith need to go immediately, I agree there. If Buges wants to stay, he's earned that right. It's not his fault our line is old and injured.

With Holmgren leaving the Seahawks, I don't know to what extent the rest of their staff will get "blown up," but I think brining in their receivers coach would be smart if possible.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=GMScud;513691]I think Blache should go. He wanted to retire anyway, we convinced him to stick around. We need a coach who cares about sacks and turnovers. Those kind of momentum swings affect games way too heavily to not put a premium on them.

Jackson, Hixon, and Smith need to go immediately, I agree there. If Buges wants to stay, he's earned that right. It's not his fault our line is old and injured.

With Holmgren leaving the Seahawks, I don't know to what extent the rest of their staff will get "blown up," but I think brining in their receivers coach would be smart if possible.[/quote]

The fact that our 3 rookie recievers can't even get on the field has to at least make the FO LOOK at Hixon. Especially if you look at the production of other rookie recievers around the league.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=maroonandblack30;513694]The fact that our 3 rookie recievers can't even get on the field has to at least make the FO LOOK at Hixon. Especially if you look at the production of other rookie recievers around the league.[/quote]

No doubt. Hixon and Danny Smith need to go right away. Like yesterday.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=firstdown;513668]What do you mean by classic front office speak. He said they have not discussed the issue so I would think that looks better for Zorn. If they are talking about the issue then they would be talking about letting him go.[/quote]

I agree. Sure I would like a solid affirmation. But this is the next best thing. Would you rather hear "We've discussed JZ's status at length and he is staying"?? I'ld rather think that they made this decision last year, and it is what it is. Period. End of statement.
I hope.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

Can anyone tell me if we have any chance in hell of getting my latest man crush Eric DeCosta or are we doomed to have Vinny, who's STILL talking about Recievers on his radio show to lead us into to football oblivion?

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;513696]I agree. Sure I would like a solid affirmation. But this is the next best thing. Would you rather hear "We've discussed JZ's status at length and he is staying"?? I'ld rather think that they made this decision last year, and it is what it is. Period. End of statement.
I hope.[/quote]


That could be the case. I just don't understand why VC wouldn't just come out and say JZ is the coach in 09. Something is strange about that.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=maroonandblack30;513700]That could be the case. I just don't understand why VC wouldn't just come out and say JZ is the coach in 09. Something is strange about that.[/quote]
Because Vinny is a idiot and he doesn't take himself responsible for this mess. Remember, he promoted zorn to head coach from the Offensive Coordinator position when they couldn't get another head coach.

For the record: If Jim Zorn is fired and Vinny keeps his job, THE REDSKINS HAVE NO HOPE. SERIOUSLY:WHO THE HELL WANTS TO COACH HERE ANYWAY? THIS WILL BE SYNDER 7TH HEAD COACH HE HAS HIRED IN HIS NINE YEAR REGIME, THAT'S GOTTA BE A NFL RECORD OF SOME SORTS.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=SmootSmack;513686]I think before Zorn goes or Vinny, there has to be an overhaul of the coaching staff. Find out if Blache and Bugel are truly committed to another year on the team, move Jackson, Hixon, and Smith out of here the day after the last game. Start there.[/quote]

I agree on Hixon, Smith, Bugel and Blache.. I think Jackson is ok. I wouldn't mind seeing Jerry Gray or Kirk Olavodatti (sp) as the defensive coordinator.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=Paintrain;513704]I agree on Hixon, Smith, Bugel and Blache.. I think Jackson is ok. I wouldn't mind seeing Jerry Gray or Kirk Olavodatti (sp) as the defensive coordinator.[/quote]

Well Olivadotti is definitely a guy they've been building up for the past several years. I don't know that he's ready yet for defensive coordinator, but I might make him defensive line coach or special teams coach.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;513699]Can anyone tell me if we have any chance in hell of getting my latest man crush Eric DeCosta or are we doomed to have [B]Vinny, who's STILL talking about Recievers on his radio show[/B] to lead us into to football oblivion?[/quote]

yeah i caught a bit of this in the car when vinny was talking to mel kipper. vinny and mel were talking about how WRs take 2-3 years to see what you got and then started pointing out the D line players drafted in the first 2 rounds this year throwing out stats like "jake long 4 sacks, merling 1 1/2 sacks" etc. to me it seemed vinny was trying to cover his ass by pointing out that any D lineman we could have drafted would not have contributed this year like our WRs. well thanks to vinny those Dlineman he listed wont be contributing next year or the year after for the skins. to me it showed a lack of long term thinking which i thought was why we pay the man.

yeah vinny, defend your logic, i understand its your job but to me he comes off like a laughing hyenia who doesnt want to admit certain short-comings or even learn from past mistakes. just dont really like the guy, seems like a bit of tool with his humor.

go skins i suppose . . .

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=maroonandblack30;513672]Classic front office speak = "We will evaluate everything at the end of the year, right now we will focus on the next opponent" Translation = our coach is gone.[/quote]

Hmmm...I swore that meant "Vinny likes hairy asses", I will have to go back and review my Front Office Speak Dictonary for the correct translation.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=over the mountain;513707]yeah i caught a bit of this in the car when vinny was talking to mel kipper. vinny and mel were talking about how WRs take 2-3 years to see what you got and then started pointing out the D line players drafted in the first 2 rounds this year throwing out stats like "jake long 4 sacks, merling 1 1/2 sacks" etc. to me it seemed vinny was trying to cover his ass by pointing out that any D lineman we could have drafted would not have contributed this year like our WRs. well thanks to vinny those Dlineman he listed wont be contributing next year or the year after for the skins. to me it showed a lack of long term thinking which i thought was why we pay the man.

[B]yeah vinny, defend your logic, i understand its your job but to me he comes off like a laughing hyenia who doesnt want to admit certain short-comings or even learn from past mistakes. just dont really like the guy, seems like a bit of tool with his humor.[/B]

go skins i suppose . . .[/quote]

Don't you love that he is so bug eyed? I mean I don't know if I've ever seen someone who's eyes are that wide at all times. He's literally and figuratively a deer in headlights! LOL!

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=SmootSmack;513706]Well Olivadotti is definitely a guy they've been building up for the past several years. I don't know that he's ready yet for defensive coordinator, but I might make him defensive line coach or special teams coach.[/quote]

Considering how poorly our linebackers have played (other than Fletcher), The last thing Olivadotti deserves is a promotion. We should bring in someone outside for the DC position, possibly Keith Butler (Steelers LB coach), or Mike Waufle (Giants DL coach). We need some fresh blood injected into the defense, not someone who will just continue with Blache's wussy-pants philosophy.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

maybe the Zorn discussion never happened (with Vinny present) becuase the Redskins are FINALLY going to KICK HIM TO THE CURB and are keeping him out of the loop.

Re: Reading between the lines I say Zorn is gone.
 

[quote=mredskins;513708]Hmmm...I swore that meant "Vinny likes hairy asses", I will have to go back and review my Front Office Speak Dictonary for the correct translation.[/quote]

I'm just going off of what I have seen and heard in the past 10 years. Thats usually what the GM says before someone gets the axe.

Let me know what your dictionary says.