Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Not surprised Tony took a seat on this but Gruden? That's seems odd.


[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4174469]Jon Gruden joins Monday Night Football team, replacing Tony Kornheiser - ESPN[/url]

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Why can't they just have Trico and Jaws? I think Gruden will be fine but I always hated the 3 man booth. But at least they got a FOOTBALL guy in there.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

I was never a Kornheiser fan so this suits me well.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Not my first choice but not the worst either. For the life of me I could not figure out why Tony was there other then to add color commentary. Half the time the conversations went astray into left field. Atleast we get someone with some form of actual football knowledge who can add perhaps the "BOOM" Like Madden. Except they will have to have someone piss off Chucky so we can see the face once and a while. ;)

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

I'm a little surprised that ESPN would want a guy who may only be there for a short time. I would think that Gruden would like to get back into coaching sooner rather than later.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=ArtMonkDrillz;558319]I'm a little surprised that ESPN would want a guy who may only be there for a short time. I would think that Gruden would like to get back into coaching sooner rather than later.[/quote]

Yeah, I was thinking that also. I can't see Gruden being out of work for more than a year or so. Maybe he sees that he's 4th best of the 'big name' coaches out there for '10 (Cowher, Shanahan, Holmgren, Gruden) and wants to at least have something lined up in the interim.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

How long till Mr. Tony is back on radio?

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

I did not think Gruden was all that great on NFLN during the draft, but if he stays in the job I am sure he will improve. If I were going to poach someone from NFLN I would have taken Marshall Faulk. He was not very good when he started there, but he has really made himself into an excellent commentator.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=SC Skins Fan;558325]I did not think Gruden was all that great on NFLN during the draft, but if he stays in the job I am sure he will improve. If I were going to poach someone from NFLN I would have taken Marshall Faulk. He was not very good when he started there, but he has really made himself into an excellent commentator.[/quote]

I think that you could say that about all of the former players and coaches on NFLN. Woodson, Prime, Mooch, Kennedy, Dukes, Billick, they were all terrible at first.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Kornheiser in the booth was about as out of place as a ballerina calling a title fight.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=53Fan;558329]Kornheiser in the booth was about as out of place as a ballerina calling a title fight.[/quote]


I tend to agree with you there. It was certainly awkward to listen to Tony in the booth, but Jaws and Mike are almost as bad. They just need to scrap the whole cast and start over.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=53Fan;558329]Kornheiser in the booth was about as out of place as a ballerina calling a title fight.[/quote]I dunno, I think Mario Lopez could call a fight.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

I got tired of Kornheiser always trying to make a story out of the game, yeah I know that was his angle but it just got old quick to me. Gruden at least is a true football guy and if his passion for the game comes through he could be interesting in the booth.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

I'm not surprised by this move. Gruden is a "football guy" that will compliment Jaws and Tirico.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Hey Tony, Hey Tony, Hey Tony... You're Fired.

I hope this signals a realization on the part of ESPN that the game IS the story.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=SC Skins Fan;558325]I did not think Gruden was all that great on NFLN during the draft, but if he stays in the job I am sure he will improve. If I were going to poach someone from NFLN I would have taken Marshall Faulk. He was not very good when he started there, but he has really made himself into an excellent commentator.[/quote]
I actually like Gruden during the draft stuf on the NFLN. He seemed to find the postive side of each pick or issue they talked about. We allready get enough negative feedback from the other guys.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

yeah i think tony felt too much pressure to be the "funny" color commentator guy, always seemed like a real real bad reaching episode of seinfeld.

but the man did give us atleast one great line . ."joe gibbs is to DC what rocky balboa is to philly . . . except he's real."

go skins!!

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

I used to be a fan of TK until he went to MNF and got all bitchy when ppl were criticizing his performance in the booth. He should stick to radio. I think Chucky is a nice addition, I liked him during the NFLN coverage of the draft.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Since Gruden probably wants another NFL Head Coaching gig, just how candidly critical do you expect him to be regarding bad teams - - the ones that might be looking to hire a new coach in the next year or two?

If he wants a coaching job, he isn't likely to tee off on bad GMs or ownership situations around the league. Jon Gruden is not stupid; he will see immediately that would be a bad job-hunting strategy.

I expect him to be only mildly critical of anyone or anything. Time will tell...

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;558348]Since Gruden probably wants another NFL Head Coaching gig, just how candidly critical do you expect him to be regarding bad teams - - the ones that might be looking to hire a new coach in the next year or two?

If he wants a coaching job, he isn't likely to tee off on bad GMs or ownership situations around the league. Jon Gruden is not stupid; he will see immediately that would be a bad job-hunting strategy.

I expect him to be only mildly critical of anyone or anything. Time will tell...[/quote]

Good points.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Good deal. Gruden is a likeable guy who knows his stuff. Kornheiser, was fine but the fact of the matter is he didn't really want to be there. Of course they need to have Grudens replacement for next year in mind since he'll probably return to coaching.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Really like Kornheiser on PTI, not so much on MNF. Definitely a fish out of water. He's not really a football guy...sure he knows football, but he is too intelligent to be in the booth, and I think he loses the crowd too easily.
Gruden...well, could care less really...it seems to be a revolving door over there, and they seem to be trying too hard to find a perfect match, when they should just start over with people and stick with them. Stop trying so hard. (aka: Dennis Miller, Korniheiser)

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

now if they would replace Tirico with Mike Patrick

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=SC Skins Fan;558325]I did not think Gruden was all that great on NFLN during the draft [/quote]

I watched ESPN for the most part but when I flipped it to NFLN or watched the recap shows of the draft I thought he did a pretty good job for his first time. I think his personality will be great for the MNF booth and hes a HUGE upgrade over Kornheiser.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;558348]Since Gruden probably wants another NFL Head Coaching gig, just how candidly critical do you expect him to be regarding bad teams - - the ones that might be looking to hire a new coach in the next year or two?

If he wants a coaching job, he isn't likely to tee off on bad GMs or ownership situations around the league. Jon Gruden is not stupid; he will see immediately that would be a bad job-hunting strategy.

I expect him to be only mildly critical of anyone or anything. Time will tell...[/quote]
Well after the ball is kicked off it boils down to the coaches and players. I'd perfer for them to stick to the game on the field so I don't see that coming into play.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

I think they keep trying to find these bold funny personalities, but they are failing. At least they went to a football guy.
I seriously doubt that people tune into MNF to listen to the commentators, I'd watch it on mute before I turned the game itself off. It's like cheerleaders think people come to the games to see them cheer. Nope, they come to see your ass in that outfit, but that's only after they watched the play of the game.
aka: commentators are nothing but non-eye-candy cheerleaders.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Personally i'm not a big fan of Jaws either.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=jsarno;558376]He's not really a football guy...sure he knows football, but he is too intelligent to be in the booth, and I think he loses the crowd too easily. (aka: Dennis Miller, Korniheiser)[/quote]
Now that shocked me.

I've never seen anything else Kornheiser has done but he always came across to me as a babbling imbecile on MNF. I quite liked Dennis Miller though, I thought he was genuinely witty and inteligent.

I will actually look forward to MNF now.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=davy;558405]Now that shocked me.

I've never seen anything else Kornheiser has done but he always came across to me as a babbling imbecile on MNF. I quite liked Dennis Miller though, I thought he was genuinely witty and inteligent.

I will actually look forward to MNF now.[/quote]

Don't be fooled by Kornheisers love of raising his voice and seemingly brash approach, he's a lot smarter than people give him credit for.
Dennis Miller lost waaaay too many people in the MNF audience. He's too smart for MNF too.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Tony took a huge step forward year 1 to year 2. He actually learned something about the game, and i thought was contributing fairly well during the course of the game. What i didn't like was the pregame where he clearly scripted every single word. I'm sure they all script that portion. But with Tony, his real talent is in writing. So it was so over the top perfect and he was losing touch with the joe football fan.

You can only be so eloquent when describing 5 300+ lb guys waging war on 5 other 300+ lb guys.

Who really cares who's in the booth anyways. I barely hear them and yell my own commentary.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Pretty interesting developments. Curious to see how Gruden fits in.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Good for MNF. Kornheiser just didn't seem like a good fit. Still wished Fouts was the 3rd man. He was a natural fit for the 3rd man in the booth in my opinion. Gruden will do a good job.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=jsarno;558399]I think they keep trying to find these bold funny personalities, but they are failing. At least they went to a football guy.
I seriously doubt that people tune into MNF to listen to the commentators, I'd watch it on mute before I turned the game itself off. It's like cheerleaders think people come to the games to see them cheer. Nope, they come to see your ass in that outfit, but that's only after they watched the play of the game.
aka: commentators are nothing but non-eye-candy cheerleaders.[/quote]
Nice post , looks like the cheerleaders might have some competition ...[url=http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=1127343212&play=1]Video - CNBC.com[/url]

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

Theismann.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

I think it's an excellent choice. The only drawback is that Gruden, clearly, is not ready to turn in his clipboard to become the next Madden. Thus you are looking at renting a guy for a year or two, then having to make another change. Nevertheless, he should be outstanding in this role. Someone with his level of knowledge will be able to do what us sports fans really want from an announcer - tell us stuff we don't already know (which Tony never once did).

I love Kornheiser as a writer, radio host, and sports debate program pioneer, but clearly he was in way over his head in that booth. I'm sure he'll land on his feet though.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

MNF is different than your average Sunday game. It is a national game that has to appeal to more than just the fans of the teams playing. That's why both ABC and ESPN have worked to create it is more of a regular entertainment option rather just a pure football sport game. I doubt ESPN will or even should abandon that strategy. It may turn off some more hardcore type fans (like us) but it also makes the product more accessible to the masses...and that's the point really.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

I think Kornheiser only had one comment I really loved in his time on MNF:

"Joe Gibbs is to Washington what Rocky Balboa is to Philadelphia, except he's real."

LOL!

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=FRPLG;558451]MNF is different than your average Sunday game. It is a national game that has to appeal to more than just the fans of the teams playing. That's why both ABC and ESPN have worked to create it is more of a regular entertainment option rather just a pure football sport game. I doubt ESPN will or even should abandon that strategy. It may turn off some more hardcore type fans (like us) but it also makes the product more accessible to the masses...and that's the point really.[/quote]

I think you are underestimating the sophistication of your average NFL viewer FRPLG. This is not 20 years ago when Joe 6-Pack needed Madden to explain nickel coverage to him. Your average NFL fan today has grown up on simulation video games and NFL network, and resultantly, understands the game with a depth of knowledge that his father most likely did not.

I think both the backlash that Kornheiser and Dennis Miller before him engendered, as well as ESPN's decision to fill that third seat with a pure football guy this time around, say a lot about the changing demands of the NFL viewer.

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=djnemo65;558477]I think you are underestimating the sophistication of your average NFL viewer FRPLG. This is not 20 years ago when Joe 6-Pack needed Madden to explain nickel coverage to him. Your average NFL fan today has grown up on simulation video games and NFL network, and resultantly, understands the game with a depth of knowledge that his father most likely did not.

I think both the backlash that Kornheiser and Dennis Miller before him engendered, as well as ESPN's decision to fill that third seat with a pure football guy this time around, say a lot about the changing demands of the NFL viewer.[/quote]

Salient points by you and by FRPLG

Re: Kornheiser out/Gruden in on MNF
 

[quote=FRPLG;558451]MNF is different than your average Sunday game. [B][I]It is a national game that has to appeal to more than just the fans of the teams playing.[/I][/B] That's why both ABC and ESPN have worked to create it is more of a regular entertainment option rather just a pure football sport game. I doubt ESPN will or even should abandon that strategy. It may turn off some more hardcore type fans (like us) but it also makes the product more accessible to the masses...and that's the point really.[/quote]

You know, that's a really good point. I watch the Redskins every week as a Redskins fan of course but I watch the MNF game as a football fan. Since most of my friends aren't Redskins fans (maybe I need new friends!) then I don't really talk much Redskins football but we have conversations every Tuesday about the MNF game and the rest of the league.

Between MNF, Madden and fantasy football there's no need for each game to be a skull session on football but the ability to combine X & O commentary with a personality should be what Gruden adds to the booth.