Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

So sad.

[url=http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=7805194&page=1]Guard Dies After Holocaust Museum Shootout - ABC News[/url]

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

Very sad indeed. I suspect this sort of violence is only going to get worse.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

I can't believe it! I mean this dude just walked through the front door with an assault rifle? Freakin Insane!

Kudos to the Security guards! They put themselves between the patrons and this crazy piece of shit! They saved the lives of dozens of people by doing what they did. Unfortunately, one of them died, but he saved the lives of many more. RIP Officer Johns.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

The gunman was almost 90 years old. That's crazy. Demented old bastard. RIP to brave guard who lost his life. What a horrible tragedy.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

Sad that the security guard lost his life, but the whole thing is weird in both the venue and timing of the shooting, not to mention the shooter was an old man who just walked up with an assault rifle.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

People are sick creatures.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=saden1;562283]Very sad indeed. I suspect this sort of violence is only going to get worse.[/quote]
What does that mean?

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=Miller101;562289]I can't believe it! I mean this dude just walked through the front door with an assault rifle? Freakin Insane!

Kudos to the Security guards! They put themselves between the patrons and this crazy piece of shit! They saved the lives of dozens of people by doing what they did. Unfortunately, one of them died, but he saved the lives of many more. RIP Officer Johns.[/quote]
A 22 is not even close to an assult rifle.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

The guy who did this was a complete loon. Consumed by hate.

In 1981, he attempted to kidnap the Federal Reserve board (yes, you read that right). He spent six years in prison for that:

"In December 1981, he walked into the Federal Reserve Board's Washington headquarters with weapons and a plan to confront the bank's governors, according to news accounts. ... Carrying a revolver, a hunting knife and a sawed-off shotgun in a satchel, von Brunn raced past a guard to the second floor, where the board was meeting. He pulled the shotgun on another guard in the corridor leading to the boardroom. ... The guard called for help, and von Brunn was overpowered before anyone got hurt. "

[url=http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nation/bal-md.vonbrunnjun11,0,7826592.story]James von Brunn: Maryland man held in shooting at Holocaust museum -- baltimoresun.com[/url]

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

The few times I've been to that museum I remember security being pretty tight. How did this nutjob get in with a gun?

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=Mattyk72;562353]The few times I've been to that museum I remember security being pretty tight. How did this nutjob get in with a gun?[/quote]

If they don't have metal detectors it would be pretty easy. Even with them you could still run in and start shooting before anyone has any time to react.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

I think they do have metal detectors, I could be wrong though.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

Apparently he started shooting before reaching the metal detectors:


Washington, D.C. Police Chief Kathy Lanier said the gunman appeared to have acted alone. He was "engaged by security guards immediately after entering the door" with a rifle, she said, but "the second he stepped into the building he began firing." The suspect reportedly did not attempt to conceal his weapon and began shooting before reaching the museum's metal detectors.

[url]http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/06/10/national/main5077874.shtml[/url]

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=Mattyk72;562357]Apparently he started shooting before reaching the metal detectors:


Washington, D.C. Police Chief Kathy Lanier said the gunman appeared to have acted alone. He was "engaged by security guards immediately after entering the door" with a rifle, she said, but "the second he stepped into the building he began firing." The suspect reportedly did not attempt to conceal his weapon and began shooting before reaching the museum's metal detectors.

[url=http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/06/10/national/main5077874.shtml]Guard Killed In Holocaust Museum Shooting - CBS News[/url][/quote]
Like I said metal detectors will only do so much and if someone has their mind made up they want to kill there is not much that can be done to stop them.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=firstdown;562349]What does that mean?[/quote]

It means more guys like this are going to come out of the woodworks.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=saden1;562362]It means more guys like this are going to come out of the woodworks.[/quote]
I knew thats what you where saying but why do you feel this way? Is it because of all the hate for the jews that the Rev. Wright preaches about all the time? Just read the first paragraph.

[url=http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/06/10/wright-suggests-jews-white-house-wont-let-speak-obama/]Rev. Wright Says 'Them Jews' Won't Let Obama Talk to Him - Political News - FOXNews.com[/url]

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=firstdown;562364]I knew thats what you where saying but why do you feel this way? [/quote]

Because right wing nut jobs are better armed then left wing nut jobs.

Essentially, the right wing guys recruit and attract ex-military types while the left wing guys get the tech savvy types who just f* the world's computers.
[url=http://www.foxnews.com/politics/first100days/2009/04/14/homeland-security-warns-rise-right-wing-extremism/]Homeland Security Warns of Rise in Right-Wing Extremism - First 100 Days of Presidency - Politics FOXNews.com[/url]


This is from a 2001 publication but contains some interesting info:

"Leftist extremists were responsible for three-fourths of the officially
designated acts of terrorism in America in the 1980s. From an international perspective, of the 13,858 people who died between 1988 and 1998 in attacks committed by the 10 most active terrorist groups in the world, 74 percent were killed by leftist organizations."
[url]http://fas.org/irp/world/para/left.pdf[/url]

Violence for extremism is not owned by any particular ideology.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;562367]Because right wing nut jobs are better armed then left wing nut jobs.

Essentially, the right wing guys recruit and attract ex-military types while the left wing guys get the tech savvy types who just f* the world's computers.
[URL="http://www.foxnews.com/politics/first100days/2009/04/14/homeland-security-warns-rise-right-wing-extremism/"]Homeland Security Warns of Rise in Right-Wing Extremism - First 100 Days of Presidency - Politics FOXNews.com[/URL]


This is from a 2001 publication but contains some interesting info:

"Leftist extremists were responsible for three-fourths of the officially
designated acts of terrorism in America in the 1980s. From an international perspective, of the 13,858 people who died between 1988 and 1998 in attacks committed by the 10 most active terrorist groups in the world, 74 percent were killed by leftist organizations."
[URL]http://fas.org/irp/world/para/left.pdf[/URL]

Violence for extremism is not owned by any particular ideology.[/quote]
Have you ever watched the news when they have one of those national labor talks and all those left winngers are tearing up the city hoasting the event?

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

I was reading this guy's website and to attach any political tag to him would be inappropriate. He was just paranoid schizophrinic. All the Conservatives I know are quite sympathetic towards Jews. In fact you were more likely to hear the anti-semitic stuff from the anti-war movement in the last ten years than you were from the right. It was common to hear them talk about how the neo-cons had hijacked the Bush presidency, etc. Chris Matthews used to recite the names of all the Jews in the Bush Administration (Scooter Libby, Paul Wolfowitz, Douglas Feith) and then ask rhetorically of some guest, "Aren't these the guys that are really in charge?"

I grew up in the evangelical sub-culture and anti-semitism was not present. Anti-Catholic bigotry was not uncommon but the Jews were viewed as "the chosen people". The holocaust was seen as proof of this. Catholics, in my experience, take quite a different view of the Jews. There's a definite, "They killed our Lord" mentality. This is what you see with Matthews and Pat Buchanan. My point is that Jew hating is pervasive and is not specific to any political movement. It's all around.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=70Chip;562713]I was reading this guy's website and to attach any political tag to him would be inappropriate. He was just paranoid schizophrinic. All the Conservatives I know are quite sympathetic towards Jews. In fact you were more likely to hear the anti-semitic stuff from the anti-war movement in the last ten years than you were from the right. It was common to hear them talk about how the neo-cons had hijacked the Bush presidency, etc. [B]Chris Matthews used to recite the names of all the Jews in the Bush Administration (Scooter Libby, Paul Wolfowitz, Douglas Feith) and then ask rhetorically of some guest, "Aren't these the guys that are really in charge?"[/B]

I grew up in the evangelical sub-culture and anti-semitism was not present. Anti-Catholic bigotry was not uncommon but the Jews were viewed as "the chosen people". The holocaust was seen as proof of this. Catholics, in my experience, take quite a different view of the Jews. There's a definite, "They killed our Lord" mentality. This is what you see with Matthews and Pat Buchanan. My point is that Jew hating is pervasive and is not specific to any political movement. It's all around.[/quote]

You make it all sound so nefarious. It's not like those guys didn't earn their scumbag badges. One got a presidential pardon due to a federal conviction, another got fired twice due to incompetence and lack of ethics, and the third cooked books to such an extent that the pentagon commissioned a report on his misconduct.

Also, it is helpful to point out that this guys could have just as easily targeted a black church. Jews were among many of a long list of people to hate. I'm not going to speculate on his ideology but I have a very hard time believing that this man would vote for anyone that has the support of 90% of blacks and 70% of Jews and might take his guns away. It simply doesn't make sense not that I would expect this guy to be sensible at all.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=saden1;562720]You make it all sound so nefarious. It's not like those guys didn't earn their scumbag badges. One got a presidential pardon due to a federal conviction, another got fired twice due to incompetence and lack of ethics, and the third cooked books to such an extent that the pentagon commissioned a report on his misconduct.

Also, it is helpful to point out that this guys could have just as easily targeted a black church. Jews were among many of a long list of people to hate. I'm not going to speculate on his ideology but I have a very hard time believing that this man would vote for anyone that has the support of 90% of blacks and 70% of Jews and might take his guns away. It simply doesn't make sense not that I would expect this guy to be sensible at all.[/quote]

I hear you, but there were lots of others he could have mentioned and the subtext was always that they were looking out for Israel instead of the U.S. Furthermore, the anti-war movement often flirted with anti-semetism in the period from 2003 to 2008. Cindy Sheehan had an episode as did many others. Matthews has been very careful to avoid this sort of rhetoric since Christopher Hitchens , among others started noticing it publically. I'm not casting stones, I'm merely saying that anti-semetism is not now nor has it ever been a purely "right wing" phenomenon. It's really more familial and cultural.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=70Chip;563270]I hear you, but there were lots of others he could have mentioned and the subtext was always that they were looking out for Israel instead of the U.S. Furthermore, the anti-war movement often flirted with anti-semetism in the period from 2003 to 2008. Cindy Sheehan had an episode as did many others. Matthews has been very careful to avoid this sort of rhetoric since Christopher Hitchens , among others started noticing it publically. I'm not casting stones, I'm merely saying that anti-semetism is not now nor has it ever been a purely "right wing" phenomenon. It's really more familial and cultural.[/quote]

What is anti-semitism? Believing that these guys who are all members of Project for the New American Century and share a bed with AIPAC have a pro-Israel stance? Give me a break, Israel is the new South Africa and everyone knows it and no one wants to do anything about it because big campaign contributions are at play. I tend to think this is the reality of our world as oppose to believe in the ridiculous notion that "the special land belongs to the special chosen people."

The dirty little secret of America is that it was the last developed nation to withdraw its support for South Africa's oppressive apartheid regime and I am afraid history will eventually repeat itself again. Friends tell friends when they have bad breath, America is no friend of Israel now and then.

I hope i don't come-off as anti-semitic for your liking because I'm not for I too have Jewish friends.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

First of all, Israel is not the new South Africa. The apartheid in South Africa was based on and justified by colonial notions of racial inequality. Israel's current imbroglio is a sovereignty/ security issue. Israel has behaved punitively but it has been in response to decades of terrorist attacks. Both sides share blame. Saden, your position lacks any degree of nuance or historical perspective. If you accept that Israel has a right to exist then you have to recognize its right to defend itself.

And while it’s true the PNAC was as pro-Israel as it gets, such support was part and parcel of their larger thesis, which was that the United States, as a unique unipolar power, needed to basically act imperially. Israel was to function as an extension of US military power in the region. One can criticize this policy, as I certainly have, without characterizing them as a Jewish group, which can be more problematic.

Second, there is a qualitative difference between the fanatical anti-semitism of far right fringe groups, which tends to be based on demonization of the Jewish race and conspiracy theory, and criticism of the "neo-cons," which is principally a policy objective. As a Jew, I don't get offended by criticisms of people who happen to be predominantly Jewish; nor do I by criticisms of Israeli policy, even when I think they are kind of dopey. I do obviously by the former, as well as the illuminati style conspiracy theories involving Jewish banking cabals frequently propagated by people on the "left" (true story, my Greek friend once asked me if I was aware that no Jews had died in 9/11. His point? The illuminati had tipped off every Joe Rubenstein from the Bronx working in the towers. That I found more moronic than offensive, but you do hear stuff like this from time to time).

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

There's at least a little crazy in everyone. Moreso in some than others. And Anti-Semitism has been around for thousands of years. It isn't going anywhere and isn't dominated by any one kind of person from what I have experienced.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=djnemo65;563284]First of all, Israel is not the new South Africa. The apartheid in South Africa was based on and justified by colonial notions of racial inequality. Israel's current imbroglio is a sovereignty/ security issue. Israel has behaved punitively but it has been in response to decades of terrorist attacks. Both sides share blame. Saden, your position lacks any degree of nuance or historical perspective. If you accept that Israel has a right to exist then you have to recognize its right to defend itself.

And while it’s true the PNAC was as pro-Israel as it gets, such support was part and parcel of their larger thesis, which was that the United States, as a unique unipolar power, needed to basically act imperially. Israel was to function as an extension of US military power in the region. One can criticize this policy, as I certainly have, without characterizing them as a Jewish group, which can be more problematic.

Second, there is a qualitative difference between the fanatical anti-semitism of far right fringe groups, which tends to be based on demonization of the Jewish race and conspiracy theory, and criticism of the "neo-cons," which is principally a policy objective. As a Jew, I don't get offended by criticisms of people who happen to be predominantly Jewish; nor do I by criticisms of Israeli policy, even when I think they are kind of dopey. I do obviously by the former, as well as the illuminati style conspiracy theories involving Jewish banking cabals frequently propagated by people on the "left" (true story, my Greek friend once asked me if I was aware that no Jews had died in 9/11. His point? The illuminati had tipped off every Joe Rubenstein from the Bronx working in the towers. That I found more moronic than offensive, but you do hear stuff like this from time to time).[/quote]

The oppressed have become the oppressor under the guise of the right to defend itself and that's the real shame. Israel should exist but it shouldn't be caging and expanding at the expense of others. Correlation to South Africa isn't racial but grounded on [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizenship_and_Entry_into_Israel_Law"]ethnicity and to an extend religion[/URL].

I've dealt with the 9/11 cooks too. They're a scary bunch and one wonders how they manage to tie their shoes every morning. You ask them for proof and they tell you to go watch the video on-line...when you tell them that's not good enough they say "the truth is right in front of you, you just choose not to see it." F'ing morons.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

NAZI = National Socialist = Leftist Bigot, as opposed to

Far Right Radical = Crazy Anarchist.

You leftist might not like it but this guy is one of your peeps not ours.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=saden1;563277]What is anti-semitism? Believing that these guys who are all members of Project for the New American Century and share a bed with AIPAC have a pro-Israel stance? Give me a break, Israel is the new South Africa and everyone knows it and no one wants to do anything about it because big campaign contributions are at play. I tend to think this is the reality of our world as oppose to believe in the ridiculous notion that "the special land belongs to the special chosen people."

The dirty little secret of America is that it was the last developed nation to withdraw its support for South Africa's oppressive apartheid regime and I am afraid history will eventually repeat itself again. Friends tell friends when they have bad breath, America is no friend of Israel now and then.

I hope i don't come-off as anti-semitic for your liking because I'm not for I too have Jewish friends.[/quote]

Read some history. The Arabs have launched a half-dozen wars against the Jews since 1948. They have perfected the art of playing the victim for Western Liberals. And you fall for it. You are not an anti-semite, you are a fool.

[YT]F_Wqi_BqI9E[/YT]

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=70Chip;563501]Read some history. The Arabs have launched a half-dozen wars against the Jews since 1948. They have perfected the art of playing the victim for Western Liberals. And you fall for it. You are not an anti-semite, you are a fool.

[yt]F_Wqi_BqI9E[/yt][/quote]

LOL...I suppose that gives the "Jews" permission to do as they please to the "Arabs?" Your justification for my foolishness is baseless and wanting. You're not that smart of a person, just another pseudo historian/thinker that is capable of stringing a few facts together now and then. It's a real shame because if you choose to you could be capable of so much more. Then again, jonah Goldberg is your idol so there isn't much hope for you.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=saden1;563511]LOL...I suppose that gives the "Jews" permission to do as they please to the "Arabs?" Your justification for my foolishness is baseless and wanting. You're not that smart of a person, just another pseudo historian/thinker that is capable of stringing a few facts together now and then. It's a real shame because if you choose to you could be capable of so much more. Then again, jonah Goldberg is your idol so there isn't much hope for you.[/quote]

I'm psuedo-thinking right now that I will continue to defend Israel's existence against those who would betray Western Civilization to the Barbarians at the Gates. You're roblem is that you have never read anything. Therefore you have no self respect, no pride. You are putty in the hands of the acamedicians and phonies who have brain ****ed you. You are their bitch. When the history of this nation's demise is written, they will mention people like you along with the homosexuals as the key factors in our undoing.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=70Chip;563871]I'm psuedo-thinking right now that I will continue to defend Israel's existence against those who would betray Western Civilization to the Barbarians at the Gates. You're roblem is that you have never read anything. Therefore you have no self respect, no pride. You are putty in the hands of the acamedicians and phonies who have brain ****ed you. You are their bitch. When the history of this nation's demise is written, they will mention people like you along with the homosexuals as the key factors in our undoing.[/quote]

Even by your standards, which I assure you is quite low, this is pathetic. I'll chalk it up to you being drunk. Enjoy the rest of your liquor.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=70Chip;563871]I'm psuedo-thinking right now that I will continue to defend Israel's existence against those who would betray Western Civilization to the Barbarians at the Gates. You're roblem is that you have never read anything. Therefore you have no self respect, no pride. You are putty in the hands of the acamedicians and phonies who have brain ****ed you. You are their bitch. [B] When the history of this nation's demise is written, they will mention people like you along with the homosexuals as the key factors in our undoing[/B].[/quote]

Wow.

Really?

:doh:

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=Mattyk72;563898]Wow.

Really?

:doh:[/quote]

Aaaaand that's why I stick to football and other lighter topics on this website. Sheesh.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=GMScud;563904]Aaaaand that's why I stick to football and other lighter topics on this website. Sheesh.[/quote]

Yeah seriously. I've shied away recently from chiming in but that comment just amazed me.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=Mattyk72;563898]Wow.

Really?

:doh:[/quote]

Give him a break, he is confusing wanting to destroy people like him, which I wholeheartedly do through the democratic process, with wanting to destroy America. He thinks him and his ilk are America.

70, slowly but surely you will be destroyed. Be patient mon ami, your vitriol will be fulfilled in due time.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=70Chip;563871]I'm psuedo-thinking right now that I will continue to defend Israel's existence against those who would betray Western Civilization to the Barbarians at the Gates. [B]You're roblem[/B] is that you have never read anything. Therefore you have no self respect, no pride. You are putty in the hands of the [B]acamedicians[/B] and phonies who have brain ****ed you. You are their bitch. When the history of this nation's demise is written, they will mention people like you along with the homosexuals as the key factors in our undoing.[/quote]

Uh-oh...someone's been using the Firstdown Spell Checker

I'm looking forward to reading this book. Especially the part where it will say "And the nation crumbled, due in large part to Nathan Lane, Ellen DeGeneres, Sir Ian McKellan, and saden1"

And then, as I'm sitting in my rocking chair over looking the Mediterranean Sea on the deck from my summer home in Spain (because, you know, this nation will be kaput) I can tell my grandkids..."You know, there was a time when I kind of, sort of, knew saden1. You see kids, there was once a site called thewarpath.net..."

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

I think it was the Beer Spell Checker.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[quote=SmootSmack;563964]Uh-oh...someone's been using the Firstdown Spell Checker

I'm looking forward to reading this book. Especially the part where it will say "And the nation crumbled, due in large part to Nathan Lane, Ellen DeGeneres, Sir Ian McKellan, and saden1"

And then, as I'm sitting in my rocking chair over looking the Mediterranean Sea on the deck from my summer home in Spain (because, you know, this nation will be kaput) I can tell my grandkids..."You know, there was a time when I kind of, sort of, knew saden1. You see kids, there was once a site called thewarpath.net..."[/quote]

I wonder if academias are going to write "we along with the homosexuals destroyed America" in the history books they will inevitably author.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

In a related matter [URL="http://www.politico.com/blogs/joshgerstein/0609/DOJ_Aipac_case_witness_asked_to_fakesuicide.html"]this is the most bizarre story I have read in recent memory[/URL]. I wonder if we'll ever see an [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abscam"]Abscam[/URL] like operation against AIPAC and its waterboys.

Re: Guard at Holocaust Museum Killed by Alleged White Supremacist
 

[url=http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/bal-holocaust-shooter0106,0,5933068.story?track=rss]Accused Holocaust museum shooter dies in prison hospital - baltimoresun.com[/url] The nutbag shooter has died in prison. I just hope the family of the guard that he killed can find some sense of justice in this since the gunman died before he could go to court.