Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

I think Blache is a great old school coach, and there is a lot to consider, but last year he said he'd be done after this year.

I don't think I would love anything more than for the FO to hire a really agressive up and coming D-coordinator to switch the front 7 to a 3-4. We have the personnel I think.
Orakpo- who's playing so far from his natural position as a 4-3 SAM linebacker
Jarmon- pass rusher
Carter
McIntosh
Fletcher
then for D-line: Haynesworth at NT, then you have Griffin, Alexander, Montgomery and Golston.

What are your thoughts? Who are potential candidates?

It's just something I thought about while sitting on my ass watching this G-Tech- Miami game.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=franklinhimself;590853]I think Blache is a great old school coach, and there is a lot to consider, but last year he said he'd be done after this year.

I don't think I would love anything more than for the FO to hire a really agressive up and coming D-coordinator to switch the front 7 to a 3-4. We have the personnel I think.
Orakpo- who's playing so far from his natural position as a 4-3 SAM linebacker
Jarmon- pass rusher
Carter
McIntosh
Fletcher
then for D-line: Haynesworth at NT, then you have Griffin, Alexander, Montgomery and Golston.

What are your thoughts? Who are potential candidates?

It's just something I thought about while sitting on my ass watching this G-Tech- Miami game.[/quote]

This was debated before, but it was before we got Haynesworth, I'll be curious to see what the debate would look like now that we have a big NT. The Packers seem to have made a good transition to the 3-4. I'm sure realistically any transition would happen in the offseason.

So do you think Miami is back? Or are GTech and FSU not that good?

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

carter was a very average 3-4 lb in san fran. jarmon is not a linebacker in a 3-4.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=Ruhskins;590857]This was debated before, but it was before we got Haynesworth, I'll be curious to see what the debate would look like now that we have a big NT. The Packers seem to have made a good transition to the 3-4. I'm sure realistically any transition would happen in the offseason.

So do you think Miami is back? Or are GTech and FSU not that good?[/quote]

miami is definitely back. maybe not as a national title contender but they are going to be very good. its either them or us (VT) for the ACC this year imo.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=franklinhimself;590853]I think Blache is a great old school coach, and there is a lot to consider, but last year he said he'd be done after this year.

I don't think I would love anything more than for the FO to hire a really agressive up and coming D-coordinator to switch the front 7 to a 3-4. We have the personnel I think.
Orakpo- who's playing so far from his natural position as a 4-3 SAM linebacker
Jarmon- pass rusher
Carter
McIntosh
Fletcher
then for D-line: Haynesworth at NT, then you have Griffin, Alexander, Montgomery and Golston.

What are your thoughts? Who are potential candidates?

It's just something I thought about while sitting on my ass watching this G-Tech- Miami game.[/quote]

I don't think we have the personel for it. We don't have a pure NT, and we don't have 3-4 ends. We might be OK at LB though.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;590860]I don't think we have the personel for it. We don't have a pure NT, and we don't have 3-4 ends. We might be OK at LB though.[/quote]

Even with AH? I mean when we just had Griff I could see that, but AH is huge. Granted, we would need more depth at NT b/c Griff wouldn't be a good NT.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

Miami's BACK!

Besides that though- we could acquire some depth for where we might b weak in terms of 3-4 personnel, but I think it's really possible. Yes, GB looks like they've done it successfully.

and if Haynesworth isn't a pure NT then i dunno who is.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

Why? Not enough LB's on the team and 4-3 is what the Skins D is built around.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

We're far from having the appropriate personnel to run a 3-4 defense. Even assuming big Al could make the transition is a stretch. That said there's much more we can do schematically to improve on our 4-3 base.

Best case scenario...Spags gets ripped apart as an HC and comes in to be our DC. Ok i don't know if that's legit but certainly there's gotta be someone who can "get more" from our guys on defense.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=The Goat;590867]We're far from having the appropriate personnel to run a 3-4 defense. Even assuming big Al could make the transition is a stretch. That said there's much more we can do schematically to improve on our 4-3 base.

Best case scenario...[B]Spags gets ripped apart as an HC and comes in to be our DC.[/B] Ok i don't know if that's legit but certainly there's gotta be someone who can "get more" from our guys on defense.[/quote]

TAMPERING! TAMPERING! Actually I'd be willing to give up a pick to get him. :)

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=The Goat;590867]We're far from having the appropriate personnel to run a 3-4 defense. Even assuming big Al could make the transition is a stretch. That said there's much more we can do schematically to improve on our 4-3 base.

Best case scenario...Spags gets ripped apart as an HC and comes in to be our DC. Ok i don't know if that's legit but certainly there's gotta be someone who can "get more" from our guys on defense.[/quote]
Gregg Williams could get fired again

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

Technically we play our 4-3 with 3-4 personnel. Two traditional linebackers (Fletcher and McIntosh), two outside rushers (Orakpo and Carter), and 3 interior lineman (Griffin, Haynesworth, and Daniels). However I don't think we should be running a 3-4. The way the personnel plays, (particularly Fletcher, Carter, and Haynesworth) is best suited to the 4-3.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=franklinhimself;590853]

I don't think I would love anything more than for the FO to hire a really agressive up and coming D-coordinator to switch the front 7 to a 3-4. We have the personnel I think.

What are your thoughts? Who are potential candidates?
[/quote]

I wish Blache was more aggressive in his schemes.
Is it the 3-4 you want or an aggressive blitz intense scheme?

Because there are plenty of 4-3 teams that are aggressive and dynamic.

But, to answer your question we could easily run a 3-4 and there are times when we were in 3-4 look.

If we were to run a 3-4 i would set it up like this:

Monty, yes monty at NT
Haynesworth DE
Daniels DE
Wilson OLB
Orakpo OLB
Fletcher ILB
Rocky ILB

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

3-4 is all about having great linebackers, so it's viable only if McIntosh has a true breakout year. A DL of Haynesworth, Jarmon, and Lorenzo Alexander could run it, but outside of Orakpo, we just don't have the LBs right now.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=30gut;590878]I wish Blache was more aggressive in his schemes.
Is it the 3-4 you want or an aggressive blitz intense scheme?

Because there are plenty of 4-3 teams that are aggressive and dynamic.

But, to answer your question we could easily run a 3-4 and there are times when we were in 3-4 look.

If we were to run a 3-4 i would set it up like this:

Monty, yes monty at NT
Haynesworth DE
Daniels DE
Wilson OLB
Orakpo OLB
Fletcher ILB
Rocky ILB[/quote]

Yes thats exactly the same way I would run the 3-4. Haynesworth shouldn't be a NT, to anyone who thinks that. He should be a DE, cause he plays that sometimes in a 4-3 and is very adaptable. I would also consider playing lorenzo alexander at DE aswell, asuming that daniels won't be here next year.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

If we were to run a 3-4 i would set it up like this:

Monty, yes monty at NT
Haynesworth DE
Daniels DE
Wilson OLB
Orakpo OLB
Fletcher ILB
Rocky ILB

I like this setup if we did go 3-4. I believe in 2 drafts we would be set at the lacking positions. Look at the Steelers, it doesnt happen overnight. look at the 1st rounders on that defense
Im not sold on da U. I think they beat up on a overrated GT tonight. The same GT that just escaped Clemson and was shut down on O for most of the night just like tonight.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

I dont understand why people want to change the defense. Over the last 5 to 7 years its the only damn thing that has been consistant. Top 10, hell top 5 in total D 4 out of the last 5 years. We played very well against probably the best O-line in the NFL last week. Jacobs didn't have his usual big day, we stuffed the run all day. Only thing I would like us to do, Is send more pressure. Eli basically had all day to throw the ball when we sent our front 4. When we did send pressure we forced bad throws, messed up the timing of some things and got hits on him. Now, not every line we face is going to be near as good as the G-men, but we have to go through them to get to the playoffs. The next few weeks we should see more sacks from our front 4, but we have to be comfortable sending blitzes against teams that have good olines, we can't sit back in the cover2 zones, we get burned all day in that crap.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

Ahh the yearly 3-4 discussion.

Surprised this didn't come up in the preseason.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

We don't have the personnel. Pretty simple.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=FRPLG;590917]We don't have the personnel. Pretty simple.[/quote]

so basically...[/thread]

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

Why change the one thing that works.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=#56fanatic;590909]I dont understand why people want to change the defense. Over the last 5 to 7 years its the only damn thing that has been consistant. Top 10, hell top 5 in total D 4 out of the last 5 years. We played very well against probably the best O-line in the NFL last week. Jacobs didn't have his usual big day, we stuffed the run all day. Only thing I would like us to do, Is send more pressure. Eli basically had all day to throw the ball when we sent our front 4. When we did send pressure we forced bad throws, messed up the timing of some things and got hits on him. Now, not every line we face is going to be near as good as the G-men, but we have to go through them to get to the playoffs. The next few weeks we should see more sacks from our front 4, but we have to be comfortable sending blitzes against teams that have good olines, we can't sit back in the cover2 zones, we get burned all day in that crap.[/quote]
I think the reason a lot of fans are asking for a change in the defense is because this defense does not create enough havoc. It's a bend and don't break approach that allows teams to move the ball if they are patient. The key to beating the Redskins defense is to convert on third down and take advantage of the man coverage. With the Redskin personnel, we as fans expect more sacks, quarterback hurries, interceptions and fumbles. The defense seems passive.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

I don't think 3-4 would suit the redskins d right now. Their strength (and depth) right now is at the defensive line. Even though, Fletcher is one of the strongest players on defense right now, the linebackers corps is not strong as a whole. Like some others are suggesting, I think you would need the lb group to be a strength and also have some depth. These are two things at linebacker that the redskins are lacking.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=#56fanatic;590909]I dont understand why people want to change the defense. Over the last 5 to 7 years its the only damn thing that has been consistant. Top 10, hell top 5 in total D 4 out of the last 5 years. We played very well against probably the best O-line in the NFL last week. Jacobs didn't have his usual big day, we stuffed the run all day. Only thing I would like us to do, Is send more pressure. Eli basically had all day to throw the ball when we sent our front 4. When we did send pressure we forced bad throws, messed up the timing of some things and got hits on him. Now, not every line we face is going to be near as good as the G-men, but we have to go through them to get to the playoffs. The next few weeks we should see more sacks from our front 4, but we have to be comfortable sending blitzes against teams that have good olines, we can't sit back in the cover2 zones, we get burned all day in that crap.[/quote]

I agree with you and I don't understand all the Blache sucks stuff after our D was 4th last year. People need to look at the O's numbers if they want to bitch.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=hail_2_da_skins;590934]I think the reason a lot of fans are asking for a change in the defense is because this defense does not create enough havoc. It's a bend and don't break approach that allows teams to move the ball if they are patient. The key to beating the Redskins defense is to convert on third down and take advantage of the man coverage. With the Redskin personnel, we as fans expect more sacks, quarterback hurries, interceptions and fumbles. The defense seems passive.[/quote]

I think one major problem with the redskins d is the coverage in the middle on passing plays. In trying to adjust to this problem, they have overcompensated and it has led to issues in other areas, too. I think once they have figured out how to fix this, the defense will become more solid.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=firstdown;590968]I agree with you and I don't understand all the Blache sucks stuff after our D was 4th last year. People need to look at the O's numbers if they want to bitch.[/quote]No one said the O doesn't need to improve. But the D does also.

2008 Redskins Team Rankings:

- #30 in Total Turnovers created by the D
- # 28 in Sacks
- 0 Defensive Touchdowns

We are not the 4th best defense in the NFL, we were only #4 in total yards allowed. While we look good statistically in yards & points the key is to stop people when you need to in the 4th quarter and create game changing plays. Our D didn't do either last year. The FO did what it could to solve the problem (AH, Hall, Orakpo). The coaching staff needs to handle it's business or we'll only see a slight improvement.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=franklinhimself;590853]I think Blache is a great old school coach, and there is a lot to consider, but last year he said he'd be done after this year.

I don't think I would love anything more than for the [B]FO to hire a really agressive up and coming D-coordinator to switch the front 7 to a 3-4[/B]. We have the personnel I think.
Orakpo- who's playing so far from his natural position as a 4-3 SAM linebacker
Jarmon- pass rusher
Carter
McIntosh
Fletcher
then for D-line: Haynesworth at NT, then you have Griffin, Alexander, Montgomery and Golston.

What are your thoughts? Who are potential candidates?

It's just something I thought about while sitting on my ass watching this G-Tech- Miami game.[/quote]

Everyone thinks that switching to a 3-4 is the way to go because of teams like the Ravens and Steelers. But there are teams that run the 4-3 as successful as them(Giants, Eagles, Bears). I see a couple things that can be addressed without switching to a 3-4
1.) Blache needs to draw up some blitzes more often to get more pressure. Rushing 4 is not going to get it done.
2.) Play the corners tighter to the line.
3.) Use Laron's closer to the line of scrimmage. He's to good of a football player to be the teams "safety net".

Maybe a new coordinator but the 4-3 is here to stay.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;590985]No one said the O doesn't need to improve. But the D does also.

2008 Redskins Team Rankings:

- #30 in Total Turnovers created by the D
- # 28 in Sacks
- 0 Defensive Touchdowns

We are not the 4th best defense in the NFL, [B]we were only #4 in total yards allowed[/B]. While we look good statistically in yards & points the key is to stop people when you need to in the 4th quarter and create game changing plays. Our D didn't do either last year. The FO did what it could to solve the problem (AH, Hall, Orakpo). The coaching staff needs to handle it's business or we'll only see a slight improvement.[/quote]

Honestly, I don't understand why the rankings are based solely on yards allowed. Maybe they need to come up with some type of formula (a la QB rating) to rate defenses.

[quote=WaldSkins;590999]Everyone thinks that switching to a 3-4 is the way to go because of teams like the Ravens and Steelers. But there are teams that run the 4-3 as successful as them(Giants, Eagles, Bears). I see a couple things that can be addressed without switching to a 3-4
1.) Blache needs to draw up some blitzes more often to get more pressure. Rushing 4 is not going to get it done.
2.) Play the corners tighter to the line.
3.) Use Laron's closer to the line of scrimmage. He's to good of a football player to be the teams "safety net".

Maybe a new coordinator but the 4-3 is here to stay.[/quote]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the Packers' transition to the 3-4. I do think that you need to have the right personnel for this defense and plan way ahead (not just switch a "4-3 to 3-4" button) of time. But personnel is the key, and now teams like the Pats are switching back to the 4-3 b/c they lack the right players for the 3-4.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=Ruhskins;591005]Honestly, I don't understand why the rankings are based solely on yards allowed. Maybe they need to come up with some type of formula (a la QB rating) to rate defenses.



I'm surprised no one has mentioned the Packers' transition to the 3-4. I do think that you need to have the right personnel for this defense and plan way ahead (not just switch a "4-3 to 3-4" button) of time. But personnel is the key, and now teams like the Pats are switching back to the 4-3 b/c they lack the right players for the 3-4.[/quote]

Well the packers are only one game into there new defense. It's a little early for me to jump on there defense.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=hail_2_da_skins;590934]I think the reason a lot of fans are asking for a change in the defense is because this defense does not create enough havoc. It's a bend and don't break approach that allows teams to move the ball if they are patient. The key to beating the Redskins defense is to convert on third down and take advantage of the man coverage. With the Redskin personnel, we as fans expect more sacks, quarterback hurries, interceptions and fumbles. The defense seems passive.[/quote]

Creating havoc is nice and hopefully we will create more turnovers this year, but its only the first game of the season. People jump the gun too much on here. We have had a championship caliber defense every year for the last how many years. If our Offense wasn't so damn pathetic we would win more games and maybe make the playoffs. the offense was basically shut down by the Rams and Bengals last season. that can't happen if you want to be mentioned with the good teams of the league, not alone the elite.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

I think over the next couple of weeks, our DLine will begin to gel and you will see more pressure on opposing QBs.

The one overwhelming problem that I see with the D is a big one. Deangelo Hall getting burned in space and Smoot playing WAY too far off the line of scrimmage. move em up a couple yards, and for Christs sake, make a tackle. The Giants should have never gotten that touchdown on that short WR screen. The skins are paying Deangelo Hall alot of money to perform, not to get his ankles broken by a crappy 6th round rookie WR who is playing basically by default. Gotta step it up secondary. And quit with the personal vendettas with the late hits. Noone cares about the size of your cock. Quit making it a measuring contest and just D UP!!!!!!!!!!!!

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

Don't you think Smoot moreso screwed up the Hicks TD. When you are out in space you've got to make that tackle, or atleast wrap him up so that he doesn't get a head of steam and your team can get over and help you out.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=steveo395;590876]Gregg Williams could get fired again[/quote]

Uhhh not sure if you're serious. No way Williams would ever work for Snyder again. But more than that I think they've completely turned the d over to him in NO...by next year he'll have that group in the top 10 and the Saints a legit contender for the SB. Mark it dude :)

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

Nope we need more LBs and we have no depth there.

Sorry 3-4 is a terrible idea. Get a 3-4 coach and draft LBs. We can talk after 2-3 years.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=hooskins;591149]Nope we need more LBs and we have no depth there.

Sorry 3-4 is a terrible idea. Get a 3-4 coach and draft LBs. We can talk after 2-3 years.[/quote]

It would take that long to make the switch, i just hope RAK dont go all J Peppers on us and want to leave to go to a 3-4 team when he realizes he can be a bad mofo at the OLB spot on a team like Pitt.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=The Goat;591115]Uhhh not sure if you're serious. No way Williams would ever work for Snyder again. But more than that I think they've completely turned the d over to him in NO...by next year he'll have that group in the top 10 and the Saints a legit contender for the SB. Mark it dude :)[/quote]
Yeah, like he did in Jacksonville? Grilliams=overrated.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=The Goat;591115][B]Uhhh not sure if you're serious. No way Williams would ever work for Snyder again.[/B] But more than that I think they've completely turned the d over to him in NO...by next year he'll have that group in the top 10 and the Saints a legit contender for the SB. Mark it dude :)[/quote]

I wouldn't necessarily say that

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=The Goat;591115] Mark it dude :)[/quote]

Best. Movie. Ever.

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

a 3-4 requires about 6 quality LBs...we have 2.

If anything...we need to consider a 5-2, if there is such a thing.
Heck...why not a 6-1?..(joke)

Re: Run the 3-4 Anybody?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;591108]Don't you think Smoot moreso screwed up the Hicks TD. When you are out in space you've got to make that tackle, or atleast wrap him up so that he doesn't get a head of steam and your team can get over and help you out.[/quote]

I agree. Smoot should have made the tackle, which would have stopped the Giants drive. That may have been a missed tackle worth 7 points.