This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

In my 30 years of being a Redskins fan, this is an all time low. Worse than losing the 1 game to the 1-15 Cowboys. Worse than losing 38-9 in the Super Bowl. Worse than any Spurrier loss or even the Coach 'Robinskie' era. We lost to a team that hadn't won a game in 20 months. Any team would be embarrassed by today's effort and result. It just happens to have happened to us.

So now what? I think Dan Snyder has to now acknowledge that it's not working. This is not just a loss, this is an organizational failure. This is a failure of management, coaching and players. This is an organizational opportunity to reset. If Snyder reacts by firing Zorn tomorrow, that would be a typical, old Snyder knee jerk reaction. I hope he gets the realization that it's not working and takes a few measured steps to correcting the course of the franchise.

What I'd like to see Snyder do tomorrow is start the search immediately for a President of Football Operations. Instead of operating from the sideline up, we need drastic change from the front office down. There are some people available (Casserly, Holmgren, Floyd Reese, Bruce Allen) that Snyder could bring in now and allow them to take the season to evaluate the roster, the front office staff and the coaching staff. He doesn't need to make a move on Zorn or Cerrato. Someone needs to come in and be our Parcells or Joe Banner. We need an experienced front office person to come in and set the direction for the football team. Let them make the decisions on the coach and GM.

Personally, I want Shanahan to be our coach for the next decade because I believe he's a brilliant and progressive offensive mind and one of our major problems for decades is lack of an offensive identity. But, I don't think he'll be any more successful than Turner, Schotty, Spurrier, Gibbs or Zorn under our current structure. Unless we have a strong front office structure and an organizational plan, we'll be wasting Shanahan's talent and more years of our players careers.

I know I'm not breaking any new ground with this post, but this is a crucial point for the future of the Washington Redskins. We can do business as usual or make a dramatic change in the way things are done in order to save this once proud franchise.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

I would love for this to happen but I just do not know if Snyder will ever admit that he has failed, his ego is too big.
Do you think this is where us fans need to start speaking up more? I mean do we need to start writing the organization what do you recommend?

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

Yeah I just came back from the game. Don't know what to say. JC throws for almost 300 yards and only 2 scores. Our D isn't so hot, and the offense was inept.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=TheSmurfs22;597308]I would love for this to happen but I just do not know if Snyder will ever admit that he has failed, his ego is too big.
Do you think this is where us fans need to start speaking up more? I mean do we need to start writing the organization what do you recommend?[/quote]
Ordinarily I'd agree but the evidence is SO overwhelming, I'd think even Snyder would have to admit it's not working.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

Bring me the head of Vinny Cerrato!!!!!!!!

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Paintrain;597314]Ordinarily I'd agree but the evidence is SO overwhelming, I'd think even Snyder would have to admit it's not working.[/quote]

~~~~~
Lets hope he does, but I am not going to hold my breath.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Counter-Tre;597320]Bring me the head of Vinny Cerrato!!!!!!!![/quote]

Yep.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

I agree.

It could SLAP SNYDER in the effing face and make him come to the conclusion that he needs to appoint FOOTBALL PEOPLE to make FOOTBALL DECISIONS.

I hope this game cost Cerrato his job. That can be the only upside to losing this game.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

The OWNER of this franchise has to KEEP HIS HANDS OFF and hire talented personnel to run the show, totallly run the show. He has to get rid of his buddy, Vinny. Danny, look at Kraft in NE and follow his example. But if you can't do that it will not not change.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Counter-Tre;597320]Bring me the head of Vinny Cerrato!!!!!!!![/quote]

K

[IMG]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o99/milrenkb/Vinnyhead.jpg[/IMG]

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Paintrain;597314]Ordinarily I'd agree but the evidence is SO overwhelming, I'd think even Snyder would have to admit it's not working.[/quote]

I pretty much agree with what you said in your first post but the major thing here is Snyder. I think pretty much the only knee jerk reaction he'd get out of this would be to fire Zorn. I don't think that will happen this week but it could be coming in the coming months. I would love for Snyder to bring in a football operations guy to evaluate the roster and be our Parcells so to speak but I don't think that's how Snyder wants to operate his franchise.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Paintrain;597301]In my 30 years of being a Redskins fan, this is an all time low. Worse than losing the 1 game to the 1-15 Cowboys. Worse than losing 38-9 in the Super Bowl. Worse than any Spurrier loss or even the Coach 'Robinskie' era. We lost to a team that hadn't won a game in 20 months. Any team would be embarrassed by today's effort and result. It just happens to have happened to us.

So now what? [B]I think Dan Snyder has to now acknowledge that it's not working. [/B]This is not just a loss, this is an organizational failure. This is a failure of management, coaching and players. This is an organizational opportunity to reset. If Snyder reacts by firing Zorn tomorrow, that would be a typical, old Snyder knee jerk reaction. I hope he gets the realization that it's not working and takes a few measured steps to correcting the course of the franchise.

What I'd like to see Snyder do tomorrow is start the search immediately for a President of Football Operations. Instead of operating from the sideline up, we need drastic change from the front office down. There are some people available (Casserly, Holmgren, Floyd Reese, Bruce Allen) that Snyder could bring in now and allow them to take the season to evaluate the roster, the front office staff and the coaching staff. He doesn't need to make a move on Zorn or Cerrato. Someone needs to come in and be our Parcells or Joe Banner. We need an experienced front office person to come in and set the direction for the football team. Let them make the decisions on the coach and GM.

Personally, I want Shanahan to be our coach for the next decade because I believe he's a brilliant and progressive offensive mind and one of our major problems for decades is lack of an offensive identity. But, I don't think he'll be any more successful than Turner, Schotty, Spurrier, Gibbs or Zorn under our current structure. Unless we have a strong front office structure and an organizational plan, we'll be wasting Shanahan's talent and more years of our players careers.

I know I'm not breaking any new ground with this post, but this is a crucial point for the future of the Washington Redskins. We can do business as usual or make a dramatic change in the way things are done in order to save this once proud franchise.[/quote]

Not according to the press conference when Gibbs retired. When asked if it's time to get a general manager, and change up the player-personnel department, Snyder said, "I'm a firm believer, if it ain't broke, don't fix it."

Dan Snyder doesn't think anything is wrong with the way this franchise is run.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Beemnseven;597355]Not according to the press conference when Gibbs retired. When asked if it's time to get a general manager, and change up the player-personnel department, Snyder said, "I'm a firm believer, if it ain't broke, don't fix it."

Dan Snyder doesn't think anything is wrong with the way this franchise is run.[/quote]

There is no reason for him to change. Redskins fans are major addicts and whatever bag of dope he feels like selling us he knows we will buy it.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

Hey Tony Dungy what are you doing?

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Beemnseven;597355]Not according to the press conference when Gibbs retired. When asked if it's time to get a general manager, and change up the player-personnel department, Snyder said, "I'm a firm believer, if it ain't broke, don't fix it."

Dan Snyder doesn't think anything is wrong with the way this franchise is run.[/quote]

At the time we had just come off of playoff seasons in 2 of the prior 3 seasons. We've now lost 10 of the last 13 and lost to a team that hadn't won a game in 20 months. Can't see how that's the same thing.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

Not sure how much good this will do but I just wrote the organization a letter. Guess I just had to get it off my chest. I let them know that we need a GM and it was time for Snyder to stop micro-managing everything. I also said that they need to remember to respect the fanbase. We do not feel respected anymore, at least not by management.

Maybe the more we speak our minds and send letters/emails to the organization maybe, maybe they will begin to hear us. While I know it is a business they cannot ignore us for long.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

Well something is not right, when you have the largest payroll in the NFL and get these crappy results. Both sides of the ball were just plain mediocre. JC had the stats, but he looked more like the rook QB than Stafford did, as he was scrambling around a lot. He lost 3-4 snaps also. Our O line sucks monkey balls. Is there really that big of adrop off when one starter goes down, or was the Lion's D line and LB corp that good. Portis didn't do squat today. We our screwed!!!!!! We don't just need to draft a couple of positions, we need to draft just about every position, with the exception of the LBs. Sorry, but Thomas and Kelly are not going to pan out when your QB only throws it to only one guy(Moss) as the rest of the guys are covered well. Our pass rush was decent at times. We needed to blitz more though. Sorry for ranting, but when a 0-19 team beats you with a rook QB and some unknown Wr's helping out you just have to worry.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

Its not even losing at this point .... this is just not fun anymore. I realize losing has an awful lot to do with it...but I look at this team, what do we even have to look forward to? We're not rebuliding right now. We're supposed to be "there" and were on our way to a 4-12 season.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=wilsowilso;597361]There is no reason for him to change. Redskins fans are major addicts and whatever bag of dope he feels like selling us he knows we will buy it.[/quote]
~~~~
That is why we got to start telling him that we aint buying it anymore.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

here tony tony tony tony

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Paintrain;597371]At the time we had just come off of playoff seasons in 2 of the prior 3 seasons. We've now lost 10 of the last 13 and lost to a team that hadn't won a game in 20 months. Can't see how that's the same thing.[/quote]

The only reason we had those two playoff appearances was due to Joe Jackson Gibbs.

As the two-man team running this organization, Dan Snyder and Vinny Cerrato have exactly three winning seasons in ten years. Can't see how anyone can see this as anything else but broken...

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Beemnseven;597355]Not according to the press conference when Gibbs retired. [B]When asked if it's time to get a general manager, and change up the player-personnel department, Snyder said, "I'm a firm believer, if it ain't broke, don't fix it."[/B]

[B]Dan Snyder doesn't think anything is wrong with the way this franchise is run[/B].[/quote]


Yeah I agree...I know ffor a fact that Snyder won't recall that statement if presented with it.

He's a guy with a PR staff and a complete lack of sincerity. It's just a good thing to say at the time for him. He doesn't really believe that.

You're right...this thing is really broken and Snyder is the one who broke it. He won't fix this though. Good call.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=TheSmurfs22;597308]I would love for this to happen but I just do not know if Snyder will ever admit that he has failed, his ego is too big.
Do you think this is where us fans need to start speaking up more? I mean do we need to start writing the organization what do you recommend?[/quote]

You know if he did ever does admit he has failed, then that in its self might be a turning point for this team. I believe he wants nothing more than for this team to win super bowl after super bowl. But now he must step back before doing anything and ask what is it really gonna take to turn this team around. A new front office, new coaches, new players, etc. etc.. He must also ask himself what has not worked? Then act only after he has these answers. You know at times I think Vinny has Synder hyimtized and that he puts to much trust into what Vinny says. Bottom line is for Synder to say ok folks I've messed up and now its time to fix this mess.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

Zorn will be fired by tommorrow. Sherman Smith will resume his offensive playcallling and Greg Blache will be named interim coach until Shanahan or Cowher is named head coach. Campbell should take that Capital "C" off of his chest because he's no captain of anything. Zorn's arrogance has sealed his fate and I can't wait to see his face when he's cleaning out his office. He was in over his head from the beginning. I believe a team takes the personality of its coach and Zorn's personality sucked this team dry of any continuity. Good riddens.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

i believe it can be done with the players we have

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=TheSmurfs22;597376]Not sure how much good this will do but I just wrote the organization a letter. Guess I just had to get it off my chest. I let them know that we need a GM and it was time for Snyder to stop micro-managing everything. I also said that they need to remember to respect the fanbase. We do not feel respected anymore, at least not by management.

Maybe the more we speak our minds and send letters/emails to the organization maybe, maybe they will begin to hear us. While I know it is a business they cannot ignore us for long.[/quote]

post the letter...and the address to mail it to...get more people on board- we'll take'em down, shawshank style

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Skinny Tee;597394]Yeah I agree...I know ffor a fact that Snyder won't recall that statement if presented with it.

He's a guy with a PR staff and a complete lack of sincerity. It's just a good thing to say at the time for him. He doesn't really believe that.

You're right...this thing is really broken and Snyder is the one who broke it. He won't fix this though. Good call.[/quote]

Well he also said that a week after we made the playoffs. I know it was 9-7 season, but we were looking pretty good at the time.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=47FAN;597400]i believe it can be done with the players we have[/quote]

I agree, I dont think the problem is a lack of talent. We are lacking in a couple areas(O-line/Defensive backfield) but there is no way someone believes the Rams and/or Lions have more talent than we do? Its the pathetic coaching, the crap schemes, and piss-poor playcalling. Zorn was over his head from day one. Can we get Holmgren now and slide Zorn back to QB coach? Something has to change ASAP!!!

As for Snyder and him having "knee-jerk reactions", this is one case where I pray he reacts and pulls the plug on the "Mr. Pathetic aka Jim Zorn show".

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=wilsowilso;597361]There is no reason for him to change. Redskins fans are major addicts and whatever bag of dope he feels like selling us he knows we will buy it.[/quote]


Best post of the day. I went to the game and there were easily 10-15 thousand seats empty. When the Lions suck the folks of Detroit refuse to go see a bunch of overpaid bums. What do the Skins fans do when they go 5-11, they still beg for season tickets with a waiting line of years. No need for Snyder to do a god damn thing or not do a god damn thing. He is a billionaire and runs the show. He makes money and has made the Skins the most profitibale franchise on earth, and that is the bottom line. If the fans want to be blind fools to mediocrity that is their problem.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Gmanc711;597418]Well he also said that a week after we made the playoffs. I know it was 9-7 season, but we were looking pretty good at the time.[/quote]

Yeah but that statement applies to our competitive output for this year and last.

Something is wrong and it needs to be fixed. Whether he realizes the fix is removing himself from the equasion will more than likely not be realized.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=roth74va;597419]I agree, I dont think the problem is a lack of talent. We are lacking in a couple areas(O-line/Defensive backfield) but there is no way someone believes the Rams and/or Lions have more talent than we do? Its the pathetic coaching, the crap schemes, and piss-poor playcalling. Zorn was over his head from day one. Can we get Holmgren now and slide Zorn back to QB coach? Something has to change ASAP!!!

As for Snyder and him having "knee-jerk reactions", this is one case where I pray he reacts and pulls the plug on the "Mr. Pathetic aka Jim Zorn show".[/quote]

We have a core group to build around, but only that. Moss, Portis, and Cooley are gamers. JC had nice stats, but did not show poise at all. In fact Stafford showed more moxy than JC. Our offensive lined is rather aged and needs to go. Our entire draft should be linemen next season and defensive backs. We have no depth at all at any position, except RB.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;597434]We have a core group to build around, but only that. Moss, Portis, and Cooley are gamers. JC had nice stats, but did not show poise at all. In fact Stafford showed more moxy than JC. Our offensive lined is rather aged and needs to go. Our entire draft should be linemen next season and defensive backs. We have no depth at all at any position, except RB.[/quote]Stafford didn't really show me anything except his accuracy with a football is no better than mine.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

I was just thinking.......WHAT positive aspect of their game can be counted on to perform week in and week out?
Defense?
Offense?
Rushing?
QB play?
Coaching?
Etc?
I honestly cannot think of...anything.
It is not a successful team...beginning with VC, and trickling down hill.
They are not COMPLETELY bad, just NEVER going to have Big success or constant, in our current Team mode.
I hope Dan is up to the task!

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Counter-Tre;597320]Bring me the head of Vinny Cerrato!!!!!!!![/quote]

The head of b*tch a** danny snyder will be more fitting.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Hog1;597457]I was just thinking.......WHAT positive aspect of their game can be counted on to perform week in and week out?
Defense?
Offense?
Rushing?
QB play?
Coaching?
Etc?
I honestly cannot think of...anything.
It is not a successful team...beginning with VC, and trickling down hill.
They are not COMPLETELY bad, just NEVER going to have Big success or constant, in our current Team mode.
I hope Dan is up to the task![/quote]

Maybe the team needs to be blown up and start from scratch, from the top down.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Paintrain;597301][B]In my 30 years of being a Redskins fan, this is an all time low. Worse than losing the 1 game to the 1-15 Cowboys. Worse than losing 38-9 in the Super Bowl. [/B]Worse than any Spurrier loss or even the Coach 'Robinskie' era. We lost to a team that hadn't won a game in 20 months. Any team would be embarrassed by today's effort and result. It just happens to have happened to us.

So now what? I think Dan Snyder has to now acknowledge that it's not working. This is not just a loss, this is an organizational failure. This is a failure of management, coaching and players. This is an organizational opportunity to reset. If Snyder reacts by firing Zorn tomorrow, that would be a typical, old Snyder knee jerk reaction. I hope he gets the realization that it's not working and takes a few measured steps to correcting the course of the franchise.

What I'd like to see Snyder do tomorrow is start the search immediately for a President of Football Operations. Instead of operating from the sideline up, we need drastic change from the front office down. There are some people available (Casserly, Holmgren, Floyd Reese, Bruce Allen) that Snyder could bring in now and allow them to take the season to evaluate the roster, the front office staff and the coaching staff. He doesn't need to make a move on Zorn or Cerrato. Someone needs to come in and be our Parcells or Joe Banner. We need an experienced front office person to come in and set the direction for the football team. Let them make the decisions on the coach and GM.

Personally, I want Shanahan to be our coach for the next decade because I believe he's a brilliant and progressive offensive mind and one of our major problems for decades is lack of an offensive identity. But, I don't think he'll be any more successful than Turner, Schotty, Spurrier, Gibbs or Zorn under our current structure. Unless we have a strong front office structure and an organizational plan, we'll be wasting Shanahan's talent and more years of our players careers.

I know I'm not breaking any new ground with this post, but this is a crucial point for the future of the Washington Redskins. We can do business as usual or make a dramatic change in the way things are done in order to save this once proud franchise.[/quote]

Sorry but those losses were WAY WORSE. You know why? Cause those were good teams. This is not a good team so my expectations are much lower. The bottom line is we're just an average football team.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;597434]We have a core group to build around, but only that. Moss, Portis, and Cooley are gamers. JC had nice stats, but did not show poise at all. In fact Stafford showed more moxy than JC. Our offensive lined is rather aged and needs to go. Our entire draft should be linemen next season and defensive backs. We have no depth at all at any position, except RB.[/quote]


Our defensive backs can play better if they are coached better. We need to draft all OLs in the draft and maybe a linebacker and also pick up a vet LB so we can put Orakpo on the Dline.

Also I would never think I would say this but Doughty needs to play more.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=dmvskinzfan08;597463]Our defensive backs can play better if they are coached better. We need to draft all OLs in the draft and maybe a linebacker and also pick up a vet LB so we can put Orakpo on the Dline.

Also I would never think I would say this but [B]Doughty[/B] needs to play more.[/quote]

Probably one of the few positives from this game.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Hog1;597457]I was just thinking.......WHAT positive aspect of their game can be counted on to perform week in and week out?
Defense?
Offense?
Rushing?
QB play?
Coaching?
Etc?
I honestly cannot think of...anything.
It is not a successful team...beginning with VC, and trickling down hill.
They are not COMPLETELY bad, just NEVER going to have Big success or constant, in our current Team mode.
I hope Dan is up to the task![/quote]The passing game has been here all three weeks. That's mostly Campbell, but when he's had his bumps, the receivers have picked him up.

I'd say run defense, but that didn't show up at all today.

Re: This loss could be the best thing to happen to his franchise.
 

[quote=Ruhskins;597461]Maybe the team needs to be blown up and start from scratch, from the top down.[/quote]

Are you talking about a demolition-ops attack on the head of the snake in Ashburn???...Damn that's pretty ballsy!

You better watch where you say that...lol...

You must be REALLY pissed...I like your style...lol : )