Denial of free speech @ games?
 

Wow, after reading about the fans attending last night’s game at FedEx field donning anti-Snyder / anti-Cerrato shirts, towels, etc., and subsequent threats from security (some armed allegedly), I was shocked. Is Dan Snyder really that thin skinned? Amazing.

[url=http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/]D.C. Sports Bog - By The Washington Post's Dan Steinberg[/url]

Re: Denial of free speech @ games?
 

Wow. Pretty pathetic by the Danny and Vinny. But is anyone really surprised? I love the Snyder-Vinny "Dumb and Dumber" T-shirts. Classic.

Good for Dan Steinberg for posting this in WaPo.

Re: Denial of free speech @ games?
 

Great shirts, I guess the truth hurts.

Re: Denial of free speech @ games?
 

Do any of you here on this board know of any legal verbiage on your season ticket contracts that prohibit ticket holders from wearing, or displaying, materials that are anti-Redskins or inflammatory?

Re: Denial of free speech @ games?
 

This is just another example of why we are a second (if not third or fourth) rate organization.

PR is the #1 concern of the owner. Not the o-line, not the fans.

Snyder, you had your 10 years. Time for plan B which means a REAL GM who will not allow you to make any football related decisions.

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Fine we'll pay 2009 prices for hot dogs and soda elsewhere rather then the Dan's 2056 prices.

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[quote=Dlyne8r;617066]Do any of you here on this board know of any legal verbiage on your season ticket contracts that prohibit ticket holders from wearing, or displaying, materials that are anti-Redskins or inflammatory?[/quote]

It probably has some sort of catch all that says they can throw you out for any reason they determine. By using the ticket to enter the stadium, you agree to those terms.

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Wow...this is why we gotta get those signs on the buses....Vinny and Danny Boy are really crazy to let this get to them....

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[quote=Chico23231;617085]Wow...this is why we gotta get those signs on the buses....Vinny and Danny Boy are really crazy to let this get to them....[/quote]

Just shows that their focus is misplaced. Again.

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Wow, just got done reading the article and I can't believe that this is a true story. I sware one day my minds going to realize that rooting for the Redskins is bad for my health and make the final switch to Ravens fans. I mean suing season ticket holder, kicking out fans. Mr. 2/3 Snyder should consider why his teams like this in the first place[I] (2 out of 3 being a reference to spending top money on top talent in the coaching and player department while keeping his best friend on as GM. Heck now he's really 1/3 as the reason he hired Zorn over GW was because he liked him better, i.e he wanted another friend.)[/I].

By the way why isn't Vinny called a General Manager? What the heck is an Executive Vice President? Vice seems to suggest that there's someone above you calling the shots, oh wait I just figured it out.

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I guess the next thing is he will ban ESPN and thier reporters. Hell most if not all sports writers in general for that matter.

All have been extremely critical of management.

Re: Denial of free speech @ games?
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;617094]I guess the next thing is he will ban ESPN and thier reporters. Hell most if not all sports writers in general for that matter.

All have been extremely critical of management.[/quote]

Well I wouldn't be surprised. Sal Palantonio really came after Vinny with questions during the pre-game show. I was sure Vinny said to himself midway through the interview that doing this interview was a mistake. Of course hopefully he's solidifying his contacts so he can get back on ESPN after this year instead of picking WR's, TE's, and CB's.

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So if you guys owned a business and a customer was in you business with something like that about you the owner you would allow them to stay?

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It's the private sector; they can limit people's free speech if they want to.

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Per one of the comments on this story in the D.C. Sports Bog, I fear for the part-time female security guard that was almost apologetic to one of the incensed fans stating that she was just doing her job and didn’t necessarily disagree with that fan’s protest, just carrying out management’s directives. Hope she doesn’t indeed lose that job, but I would think after last night she may be looking for alternative part-time work anyway. Who’d want that position?

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[quote=firstdown;617102]So if you guys owned a business and a customer was in you business with something like that about you the owner you would allow them to stay?[/quote]

If my store had 80,000 people there and they were being civil while I was charging $2,000 for a hot dog then absolutely. Especially after I got caught suing fans that were eligible for bankruptcy.

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[B][U]Firstdown[/U][/B] - I understand, but given the current atmosphere and national attention this team is receiving (sports wise of course), I would think that Snyder would be a little more diplomatic in his approach or even allow it considering the potential media backlash it would create (and already has).

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[quote=Dlyne8r;617112][B][U]Firstdown[/U][/B] - I understand, but given the current atmosphere and national attention this team is receiving (sports wise of course), I would think that Snyder would be a little more diplomatic in his approach or even allow it considering the potential media backlash it would create (and already has).[/quote]

Yep. As much bad pub as he's getting, he's going to be getting more for kicking people out and cancelling their seasons tickets. He's better taking the "grin and bear it" approach. Wow, i hope it's not true.

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Cooke is rolling in his grave right now. Until Dan faces the mirror and decides that winning is more important than having his friend at his side, this organization will never change. We will at best be 8-8 year in and year out. And it is simple, we have no real team philosophy set by a GM/Coach duo that the whole team can follow. No real coach will ever want to come to this circus as long as Cerrata is in town. Which means we will actually be worse off than the Raiders, since their owner has less time on this planet to ruin things than Synder.

Re: Denial of free speech @ games?
 

I dont know its a tough call. These kinda stories look pretty bad though. Wait till the national media gets winds, or some kid records security guards forcing an old man to leave. Then Dan is gonna get national attention, and that will hurt him.

It is definitely better to let the mass voice their opinion quietly. As long as they are not creating a stir.

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Didn't the Detroit FO do something similiar when M. Millen was the GM?

Re: Denial of free speech @ games?
 

What if every fan that came to the next home game was wearing a Dan and Vinny are butt weasels T-shirt and all the fans refused to take them off? What then? The game would be played to an empty stadium?
I think Danny and Vinny are stupid, they do not realize they are playing with fire.
By denying the fans the right to poke fun at the FO they are going to alienate more fans and add fuel to the building fire.
[B]This is yet another example of Danny's ego is more important than anything else...like the team, the fans, the franchise[/B]. Danny will never learn. He behaves like a spoiled child.
Who the fuck does he think is? That he is not open to criticism? That by definition is childish.
Ready, Fire, Aim!

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[quote=Dirtbag359;617097]Well I wouldn't be surprised. Sal Palantonio really came after Vinny with questions during the pre-game show. I was sure Vinny said to himself midway through the interview that doing this interview was a mistake. Of course hopefully he's solidifying his contacts so he can get back on ESPN after this year instead of [B]picking WR's, TE's, and CB's[/B].[/quote]

He sure picked some good ones too.

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Jamaican Skin:

Yes, the Lions did something similar with regard to "offensive" posters and signs about Matt Millen. ANd that is what the Washington Redskins' organization has sunk to - - the level of the Detroit Lions...


tjmorgan:


You said:
[INDENT]Until Dan faces the mirror and decides that winning is more important than having his friend at his side, this organization will never change.[/INDENT]

Is it possible - even remotely possible - that winning is NOT as important to Danny Boy than having his ego stroked by a bunch of ass-kissers around him? Think about it...

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[quote=Defensewins;617127]What if every fan that came to the next home game was wearing a Dan and Vinny are butt weasels T-shirt and all the fans refused to take them off? What then? The game would be played to an empty stadium?
I think Danny and Vinny are stupid, they do not realize they are playing with fire.
By denying the fans the right to poke fun at the FO they are going to alienate more fans and add fuel to the building fire.
[B]This is yet another example of Danny's ego is more important than anything else...like the team, the fans, the franchise[/B]. Danny will never learn. He behaves like a spoiled child.
Who the fuck does he think is? That he is not open to criticism? That by definition is childish.
Ready, Fire, Aim![/quote]

It's easy to hate someone who sues little old ladies. Eff Al Snyderato!

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I'm all for freedom of speech, but if these people are that disgruntled with Snyder, wouldn't it speak louder to just not go to the games?

At the same time, throwing these people out is definitely thin skinned. Without the fans, there is no Daniel Snyder, there is no full stadium, there is no Washington Redskins. So, I DO think people have the right to voice their displeasure inside the stadium. Fans were even approached by security in the parking lots. Now, that is above and beyond.

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[quote=skinsguy;617135]I'm all for freedom of speech, but if these people are that disgruntled with Snyder, wouldn't it speak louder to just not go to the games?

At the same time, throwing these people out is definitely thin skinned. Without the fans, there is no Daniel Snyder, there is no full stadium, there is no Washington Redskins. So, I DO think people have the right to voice their displeasure inside the stadium. Fans were even approached by security in the parking lots. Now, that is above and beyond.[/quote]
Not showing up to the game is not getting the message across. The signs are for the nationally television audience that doesn't watch the Redskins on a weekly basis. A lot of the national audience do not know how bad the situation is. They watch one game and don't realize its an organization problem. If you only watch one game, you might think, its only one or two players that are not performing, as opposed to a cancerous lack of performance on the entire offense. The signs or needed. They voice the opinion of the fan and Danny & Vinny need to see it every week until they do something about it. Protest brings about change.

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[quote=hail_2_da_skins;617145]Not showing up to the game is not getting the message across. The signs are for the nationally television audience that doesn't watch the Redskins on a weekly basis. A lot of the national audience do not know how bad the situation is. They watch one game and don't realize its an organization problem. If you only watch one game, you might think, its only one or two players that are not performing, as opposed to a cancerous lack of performance on the entire offense. The signs or needed. They voice the opinion of the fan and Danny & Vinny need to see it every week until they do something about it. Protest brings about change.[/quote]
Well I watched the game last night and saw a full stadium and none of those protesters. I was actually surprised by how many fans went to the game and thought that the Eagle fans would be there in larger numbers.

Re: Denial of free speech @ games?
 

[quote=hail_2_da_skins;617145]Not showing up to the game is not getting the message across. The signs are for the nationally television audience that doesn't watch the Redskins on a weekly basis. A lot of the national audience do not know how bad the situation is. They watch one game and don't realize its an organization problem. If you only watch one game, you might think, its only one or two players that are not performing, as opposed to a cancerous lack of performance on the entire offense. The signs or needed. They voice the opinion of the fan and Danny & Vinny need to see it every week until they do something about it. Protest brings about change.[/quote]

I don't know about that. If I tune into a game and I know that the home team is 2-4 and I am seeing that the stadium is not even half filled, then that says to me that there is something really wrong with the team. And, honestly, I really doubt that football fans of other teams are going to care if Snyder is the problem or if it's Portis. They are going to see that fans must be so fed up with the team that they don't bother even showing up to the stadium. I mean anyways, if one watches football on a regular basis, they would have to be living under a rock to not know that Daniel Snyder is not a very well liked owner amongst the Redskins fans and across the league.

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[quote=firstdown;617152]Well I watched the game last night and saw a full stadium and none of those protesters. I was actually surprised by how many fans went to the game and thought that the Eagle fans would be there in larger numbers.[/quote]

Exactly! I didn't see one fan wearing any of those shirts on TV. But, if I had tuned in and noticed that half the stadium is empty (like it was last week,) then I would know something is wrong.

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Despite all of these measures, some offensive signs were smuggled through security. Therefore, I think it may be time for Snyder to consider instituting random strip-searches of fans to put a stop to the offensive practice of smuggling signs into the stadium.

The P.G. County police know more about this type of thing than Snyder's rent-a-cops, so he might want to consider enlisting their help in this effort.

From a facilities point-of-view, the sign police could just set up rows of sanitized porta-potties near the turnstiles. This would provide a private, clean, and safe environment the fans who are strip-searched.

I'm not suggesting that any significant number of fans should be strip-searched. That would be ridiculous! Of course, no premium seat ticket-holders should be searched - they are the most loyal fans and they pay too much for their seats to be delayed at the stadium entrances. And only one percent or less of the people in the cheap seats should be asked to step into a porta-potty to be strip-searched. Fewer still should be asked to drop their drawers and bend over for a more thorough search for possible offensive signage hidden on their bodies.

This should provide a safer and more enjoyable stadium experience for the vast majority of fans who are not detained by police and strip-searched prior the game.

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Some felt the crackdown on sign display. many of which were not offensive in any way, is one way to discourage the polarization of discontent being exbibited by fans against management.

While many of the signs had nothing to do with disconted fans, the idea is in furtherence of times to come in the event the team does not improve, and the chorus gets louder with more and more people becoming involved. It could be considered as a way of staving off future situations they deem problematic. Therefore the simplest way to deal with something that might become even more embarassing in the future is to just ban all signs.

The Little Emporer has no clothes but he still runs a tight ship. Imagine the thought of how far we could proceed in an effort to attach signs or decals to Metro Buses, that would truly be interesting to witness if it were ever permissable.

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[quote=KI Skins Fan;617183]Despite all of these measures, some offensive signs were smuggled through security. Therefore, I think it may be time for Snyder to consider instituting random strip-searches of fans to put a stop to the offensive practice of smuggling signs into the stadium.

The P.G. County police know more about this type of thing than Snyder's rent-a-cops, so he might want to consider enlisting their help in this effort.

From a facilities point-of-view, the sign police could just set up rows of sanitized porta-potties near the turnstiles. This would provide a private, clean, and safe environment the fans who are strip-searched.

I'm not suggesting that any significant number of fans should be strip-searched. That would be ridiculous! [B]Of course, no premium seat ticket-holders should be searched - they are the most loyal fans and they pay too much for their seats to be delayed at the stadium entrances.[/B] And only one percent or less of the people in the cheap seats would be asked to step into a porta-potty to be strip-searched. Fewer still would be asked to drop their drawers and bend over for a more thorough search for possible offensive signage hidden on their bodies.

This should provide a safer and more enjoyable stadium experience for the vast majority of fans who are not detained by police and strip-searched prior the game.[/quote]

Wait a minute. So you're saying that those who do not pay for premium seating are not as loyal of fans as the ones who do? Dan, Vinny, is that you? First of all, if I was going to a Redskins game and the cops wanted to strip search me for no reason, then they had better obtain a warrant. Implementing strip searches is against one's rights without reasonable cause.

Re: Denial of free speech @ games?
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;617183]Despite all of these measures, some offensive signs were smuggled through security. Therefore,[B][I] I think it may be time for Snyder to consider instituting random strip-searches of fans to put a stop to the offensive practice of smuggling signs into the stadium.[/I][/B]
The P.G. County police know more about this type of thing than Snyder's rent-a-cops, so he might want to consider enlisting their help in this effort.

From a facilities point-of-view, the sign police could just set up rows of sanitized porta-potties near the turnstiles. This would provide a private, clean, and safe environment the fans who are strip-searched.

I'm not suggesting that any significant number of fans should be strip-searched. That would be ridiculous! Of course, no premium seat ticket-holders should be searched - they are the most loyal fans and they pay too much for their seats to be delayed at the stadium entrances. And only one percent or less of the people in the cheap seats should be asked to step into a porta-potty to be strip-searched. Fewer still should be asked to drop their drawers and bend over for a more thorough search for possible offensive signage hidden on their bodies.

This should provide a safer and more enjoyable stadium experience for the vast majority of fans who are not detained by police and strip-searched prior the game.[/quote]

Strip search fans? Are you kidding??

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[quote=skinsguy;617193]Wait a minute. So you're saying that those who do not pay for premium seating are not as loyal of fans as the ones who do? Dan, Vinny, is that you? First of all, if I was going to a Redskins game and the cops wanted to strip search me for no reason, then they had better obtain a warrant. Implementing strip searches is against one's rights without reasonable cause.[/quote]

I have a hard time believing he wasn't being sarcastic.

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[quote=Longtimefan;617198]I have a hard time believing he wasn't being sarcastic.[/quote]

I really, really, hope so! ;)

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[quote=skinsguy;617153]I don't know about that. If I tune into a game and I know that the home team is 2-4 and I am seeing that the stadium is not even half filled, then that says to me that there is something really wrong with the team. And, honestly, I really doubt that football fans of other teams are going to care if Snyder is the problem or if it's Portis. They are going to see that fans must be so fed up with the team that they don't bother even showing up to the stadium. I mean anyways, if one watches football on a regular basis, they would have to be living under a rock to not know that Daniel Snyder is not a very well liked owner amongst the Redskins fans and across the league.[/quote]

But, you're stuck with the bill dude! No matter what! Season ticket holders pay for the whole season before the season starts. And they paid to see this crap? I mean, what are they going to do? Stay home and eat the cost of their tickets? Eat the thousands of dollars that they spent on them? Or.............get some frustration out! Head on up to that stadium and let everyone know how pissed off you are! You might as well. I mean, you're stuck with the tickets. You might as well have fun with it.

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[quote=skinsguy;617193]Wait a minute. So you're saying that those who do not pay for premium seating are not as loyal of fans as the ones who do? Dan, Vinny, is that you? First of all, if I was going to a Redskins game and the cops wanted to strip search me for no reason, then they had better obtain a warrant. Implementing strip searches is against one's rights without reasonable cause.[/quote]

Loyalty = $$$

I hadn't thought of the need for warrants. Well, maybe Snyder could get a judge to provide stacks of all-purpose warrants with blank names that could be filled in by the sign police just before they drag fans to porta-potties to be strip-searched.

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[quote=Dlyne8r;617066]Do any of you here on this board know of any legal verbiage on your season ticket contracts that prohibit ticket holders from wearing, or displaying, materials that are anti-Redskins or inflammatory?[/quote]

I just read the back of my ticket to the Chiefs game... and really there was nothing on there that you can take as prohibiting ticket holders from wearing anything at all... I dont know if something different is in the season tickets contract, but nothing on this one..

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[quote=skinsguy;617193]Wait a minute. So you're saying that those who do not pay for premium seating are not as loyal of fans as the ones who do? Dan, Vinny, is that you? First of all, if I was going to a Redskins game and the cops wanted to strip search me for no reason, then they had better obtain a warrant. Implementing strip searches is against one's rights without reasonable cause.[/quote]

Reasonable cause huh? Well, lets say that they "pat you down" and feel something like poster board under your shirt. You tell them its just a back brace. And then.................well, that sounds like reasonable cause to me. :)