So who *aren't* Redskins on this team?
 

Joe Gibbs always talks about how he is looking for true Redskins. I think we can agree that the following players are true Redskins:

Clinton Portis
James Thrash
Fred Smoot
Antonio Pierce
Cornelious Griffin
Lemar Marshall
Shawn Springs


But who has established themself as NOT a future redskin: someone who wont be here next year or will leave soon. Here are my candidates:

Mark Brunell (Yeah, even *I* have to agree he had better NOT be here next year)
Rod Gardner

Hmmm, thats all I really can think of right now- since our defense is #1 I really cant nominate anyone there. And I think our offensive trouble lies with Brunell, and I cant see any of our lineman next year be truly responsible. Is anyone here for letting Samuels go?

Anyway- discuss :httr:

I am not sure about Rod Gardner, but I can think of 1 guy on our D and that is Mike Barrow, I said it before and I will say it again, it is great what he did in the past but what has he done for us lately??

Hate to tell you guys. But both Brunell and Barrow will be here next year. We can't trade them away, and we can't afford the cap hit we'd take from ditching them.

Rod Gardner isn't going anywhere. He's a solid receiver.

I think Gardner's work ethic especially during practice makes him a Redskin in Gibbs eyes. Even though he's know as 50/50 he still works hard and that's what Gibbs wants.

On the No list:
Darnerian Mcants

[QUOTE=BrunellFan]Here are my candidates:

Mark Brunell (Yeah, even *I* have to agree he had better NOT be here next year)
Rod Gardner

Is anyone here for letting Samuels go?[/QUOTE]

- Well whether it's starting :doh: or riding the bench, I'm quite sure Brunell is here in 2005 due to his contract. Probably 2006 as well.

- As for Gardner, I disagree that he is not a "Redskin". He's been here for a while and seems to finally have come into his own under Gibbs (ie he started catching the ball). IMO he's been as good or better than Coles this year. I'd love to keep him. But like I've posted before his contract is up after 2005. Since we're deep at WR I expect the Skins to trade him this offseason.

- Unless he restructures, Samuels is gone for sure in 2006. He can even void 2006 from his contract if he wants. He'll cost $10M against the cap in 2005, while his "deadcap" would be $6M if we cut/traded him. So it's basically a $4M cap savings if we let him go next year. But maybe he'll restructure.

CrazyCanuck! We've missed ya buddy! You rule!

What about Rock Cartwright?

[QUOTE=Daseal]CrazyCanuck! We've missed ya buddy! You rule![/QUOTE]

Thanks but I never really left. I've been a little quiet lately, but I'm always hanging around.

How's this for a post:
"I think Brunell sucks and Ramsey should be starting." :silly:

After reading that 20,000 times a day I'm usually too tired to type. :sleep:

Not that I disagree with it...

I don't think Hall is a true Redskins...he always looks very smug on the sideline.

Football is a business. Would you call yourself a true *insert company you work for*???

Portis can get pissy at any time and so can a lot of other players. Remeber kids, this game is still about the benjamins.

The no-Redskin players are:

1.Chad Morton- One return since he's been here.
2.Mike Barrow-Practice's just enough to be told he's not playing.
3.Darnerian McCants-No special teams experience. Moping about his inactive status.
4.Derrick Dockery-One of the worst offensive lineman I have ever seen.
5.Rod Gardner-Reminds Gibbs of Monk. Maybe the size, definitely not the hands.
6.Ray Brown-I've got 42 reasons why he shouldn't be here.
7.Ladell Betts-never established himself as a threat and is not a great blocker.
8.Rock Cartwright-Doesn't fit in this system. Missing in action most of the year.
9.Mike Sellers- He's got the heart, but something his holding him back.
10.Brian Kozlowski- Emergency backup. In his 12th season, nothing left in the tank.

I think Gardner will stay.

He's had some impressive games in this offense and once we get a QB that can actually get him the ball more he'll only continue to improve.

He's really come into his own this year, and he's got a great worth ethic that Gibbs loves.

[QUOTE=CrazyCanuck]Thanks but I never really left. I've been a little quiet lately, but I'm always hanging around.

How's this for a post:
"I think Brunell sucks and Ramsey should be starting." :silly:

After reading that 20,000 times a day I'm usually too tired to type. :sleep:

Not that I disagree with it...[/QUOTE]
Yeah that's starting to wear on me too

I'm trying to stay away from those conversations, I think we all know how we feel and it's already been said a few million times. LOL

rock, mccants, some of those 3rd stingers... samuels may be gone, i'd LOVE to see brunell go...

meanwhile, looks like ryan clark and AJ both found ways to stay on the team somehow...

[QUOTE=SUNRA]The no-Redskin players are:

1.Chad Morton- One return since he's been here.
2.Mike Barrow-Practice's just enough to be told he's not playing.
3.Darnerian McCants-No special teams experience. Moping about his inactive status.
4.Derrick Dockery-One of the worst offensive lineman I have ever seen.
5.Rod Gardner-Reminds Gibbs of Monk. Maybe the size, definitely not the hands.
6.Ray Brown-I've got 42 reasons why he shouldn't be here.
7.Ladell Betts-never established himself as a threat and is not a great blocker.
8.Rock Cartwright-Doesn't fit in this system. Missing in action most of the year.
9.Mike Sellers- He's got the heart, but something his holding him back.
10.Brian Kozlowski- Emergency backup. In his 12th season, nothing left in the tank.[/QUOTE]

I'd definitely agree with these two: Morton (though I think we are stuck with him b/c of cap reasons); McCants

IF the question is who are "NOT" Redskins, then Barrow, Brown are not the answer. Brown is the type of leader JG looks for even if he is on the downside of his career, Barrow we just don't know about yet but, based on his past, he is exactly the kind of guy Gibbs likes: hard worker, leader etc.

As for Betts, Gardner, Cartwright, Sellers, Kozlowski and Dockery: I think all pretty much fall into the in between category, each has some good points (youth, talent, work ethic) and bad points (mainly inconsistency, lack of talent or age) - BUT as for being "NOT" redskins in the Gibbs mold, I don't think any of them can said to definitely fall into that category. Unless you can read Gibbs mind, I don't think we can say any of these guys are off the team soley 'cause they don't buy into Gibbs philosphy.

I Think the most interesting person to this question is going to be Samuels. I mean we have wayyy to much money invested in this guy. While he is still a good tackle, he really holds us down in terms of the salary cap. If he restructures I think he could be a Skin' for a while, but if he dosent, we have to do what we have to do to clear some room up.

I Think as long as Gardner dosent go crazy and demand a boatload of cash, he'll be back. All I really care about is that we keep the core ( Portis, Coles, Jansen, hopefully Ramsey offensivley.... Smoot,Springs, Taylor , Arrington, Washington defensivley, I may have left someone out.) then build around them. If we feild the same team next year (with a different QB hopefully Ramsey ), with maybe a new guy or two from the draft, I'll be happy.

Samuels said he would be willing to restructure after this year so we'll see if he holds true to that. If he doesn't we'll have to get rid of him, his cap numbers are going through the roof.

[QUOTE=Daseal]Hate to tell you guys. But both Brunell and Barrow will be here next year. We can't trade them away, and we can't afford the cap hit we'd take from ditching them.

Rod Gardner isn't going anywhere. He's a solid receiver.[/QUOTE]

Ok - we definately can't cut Brunell, but I think we can definately take the cap hit for Barrow, can't we?

What kind of SB did he get?

[QUOTE=SUNRA]The no-Redskin players are:

1.Chad Morton- One return since he's been here.
2.Mike Barrow-Practice's just enough to be told he's not playing.
3.Darnerian McCants-No special teams experience. Moping about his inactive status.
4.Derrick Dockery-One of the worst offensive lineman I have ever seen.
5.Rod Gardner-Reminds Gibbs of Monk. Maybe the size, definitely not the hands.
6.Ray Brown-I've got 42 reasons why he shouldn't be here.
7.Ladell Betts-never established himself as a threat and is not a great blocker.
8.Rock Cartwright-Doesn't fit in this system. Missing in action most of the year.
9.Mike Sellers- He's got the heart, but something his holding him back.
10.Brian Kozlowski- Emergency backup. In his 12th season, nothing left in the tank.[/QUOTE]

I agree with all of them except for Dockery and Sellers.

I really think that Dockery is coming along. Sellers, is simply a beast on ST and a great blocker. He really is a Gibbs-type of guy.

Betts is hard to figure out. He blocks like a pussy, but he seems like a serviceable back-up. I don't know.

[QUOTE=Drift Reality]Ok - we definately can't cut Brunell, but I think we can definately take the cap hit for Barrow, can't we?

What kind of SB did he get?[/QUOTE]

8.6 Million over 7 years. Thanks CCanuck!

[url]http://www.thewarpath.net/WarpathRedskinsCap.htm[/url]

again, chad sucked cause the blocking sucked... in those early games when betts and thrash returned ball they got 1, 4, and -2 yards... chad also had a 30 and 50 yd return called back... he's not bad, and he helps with a bit of the coaching stuff... the question is whether betts and thrash (and simon) are good enough that we don't really need him, and right now (even though chad is better), i'd say thrash is good enough.

betts isn't going anywhere, he's the best backup RB we have (BY FAR), and he can do special teams...

No surprises!
 

There have been no surprises for me this year. Our poor record is a carry over from the Cerrato-Spurrier regime.

Bad move: HOF Coach Gibbs wanted a rag armed Brunnell. Didn't like the move then, and like it less now!

Good move: Defensive HC Williams wanted and got a lot of additional parts this past year.

Bad move: Signing Barrow.

ST play was bad early, better now.

30 Second Clock for HOF Coach Gibbs. A difficult move.
Helmet speakers. A difficult move for HOF Coach Gibbs.

So, this year is a real struggle!

All of the Ramsey/Brunell talk is not the way HOF Coach Gibbs will do things.
Probably bad move. See first sentence.

But we are still on track for that 8-8 record I predicted. We just have to win more than we lose the rest of the way.

Unfortunately, there have been more bad bounces than good bounces this year. (or more bad moves if you will)

[QUOTE=Drift Reality]I agree with all of them except for Dockery and Sellers.

I really think that Dockery is coming along. Sellers, is simply a beast on ST and a great blocker. He really is a Gibbs-type of guy.

Betts is hard to figure out. He blocks like a pussy, but he seems like a serviceable back-up. I don't know.[/QUOTE]

I know this is the most playing time Dockery has been given, but when you look at his size 6"6, 345lbs, he should be opening holes for a tank to fit through. Instead, he's getting a lot of false starts and holding penalties. I would really like to see Sellers stay here, especially since he has multiple job assignments.

[QUOTE=Drift Reality]Ok - we definately can't cut Brunell, but I think we can definately take the cap hit for Barrow, can't we?

What kind of SB did he get?[/QUOTE]

JoeRedskin mentioned $8.6M signing bonus but that's actually what Brunell got.

Barrow only got a $2.5M signing bonus, so if we wanted to cut him next year it would cost us about $2.1M in dead cap. Then again if we keep Barrow next year he'll also count about $2.1M against the cap, so is there any reason to cut him?

oops sorry. I didn't read that carefully. I thought the question was how much was Brunnell's signing bonus. Sorry.

[QUOTE=CrazyCanuck]JoeRedskin mentioned $8.6M signing bonus but that's actually what Brunell got.

Barrow only got a $2.5M signing bonus, so if we wanted to cut him next year it would cost us about $2.1M in dead cap. Then again if we keep Barrow next year he'll also count about $2.1M against the cap, so is there any reason to cut him?[/QUOTE]
How about to pick up a player that can actually play on Sunday??? I know Barrow doesn't have a history of injuries, but it seems that as well a Pierce is playing, they should just put Barrow on IR and re-evaluate in the offseason.

[QUOTE=SkinsRock]How about to pick up a player that can actually play on Sunday??? I know Barrow doesn't have a history of injuries, but it seems that as well a Pierce is playing, they should just put Barrow on IR and re-evaluate in the offseason.[/QUOTE]

I agree if the guy can't play then he should be on IR. All I'm saying is that cutting/trading him this year or next will not free up any cap space, only a roster spot.