Cop Punches Student
 

I'm guess most here have either heard or seen the clip with a cop punching a student who had pushed him as he was trying to arrest her friend. Was the cop wrong for what he did and what if any actions should be taking against him?

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_P5jOoDDbI&feature=related"]YouTube - Seattle Police Officer Punches Girl In The Face[/ame]

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

Well I hadn't seen it. As always you have to avoid the rush to judgement, but geez the flat out punch seemed clearly out of line, and borderline criminal assault. I imagine he will be put on leave immediately and an investigation began. My initial reaction would be completely against the cop.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

While I think he may have over reacted some the girl had no business coming in and pushing the officer. The officer also has to wonder if anyone else is going to jump in and he has to keep a handle on the situation before it gets futher out of control. How does the cop know if she is going to start swinging on him along with the other girl who is pushing him off?

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

Couldn't pay me enough to be a cop, all this over a jay-walking ticket I believe. Thank God this situation didn't escalate even further than it already had. Could've been handled in a much better way, by all parties involved.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

The fact is, I never once saw him radio for additional units, he was in an untenable situation, he had to see the cell phone cameras recording him, I counted at least 3 including the one the video is from, she pushed but he took a lunging step forward to land a solid punch to the face, by that time he had lost control of the situation, and would have been better off radioing for help and getting names and addresses. Again, I don't know what precipitated the initial contact, but unless it was a violent action, his actions only worsened the situation. If the car was the girl's as it appeared to me, she wasn't going to walk away, and he could have calmed the situation by requesting back up and using words, instead, as is to often the case it appears he decided he was going to use his authority and obvious size advantage to subdue them (a silly mistake in my mind)

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

if the lady who pushed him was a threat to his safety that warranted a punch, how come after he punches her he just goes right back to grabbing the other girls wrists. he obviously didnt view her as a physical threat b/c after he punches her he pays no attention to her. if she was a threat then why didnt he try to neutralize the threat?

why is this cop playing around and grabbing her wrists. that isnt proper procedure. give her clear and loud verbal instructions. if she refuses then order her to put her hands behind her back. if she refuses, then use your cop training to put her hands behind her back.

how a cop cant properly restrain and handcuff a women is a joke. ive never seen a cop trying what he is doing. did he not get trained?

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

This guy may have a future in politics.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

You don't want to get punched, then don't push a cop. He probably could have handled the situation better, but I do not fault him. She was trying to help a friend resist arrest. You just don't do that and not expect consequences.

You have the right to subdue/neutralize the target by using the minimum force necessary up to and including "Deadly force". Was the punch the minimum amount of force necessary? Probably not, but it wasn't much more than what was necessary.


I was in a similar situation when I was in the desert and that situation called for a butt stroke to the head series. He wasn't resisting over jaywalking though.

[IMG]http://www.thewarpath.net/members/angry-albums-skins-vs-bills-extended-picture156-image1072.jpg[/IMG]

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=over the mountain;707059]if the lady who pushed him was a threat to his safety that warranted a punch, how come after he punches her he just goes right back to grabbing the other girls wrists. he obviously didnt view her as a physical threat b/c after he punches her he pays no attention to her. if she was a threat then why didnt he try to neutralize the threat?

why is this cop playing around and grabbing her wrists. that isnt proper procedure. give her clear and loud verbal instructions. if she refuses then order her to put her hands behind her back. if she refuses, then use your cop training to put her hands behind her back.

how a cop cant properly restrain and handcuff a women is a joke. ive never seen a cop trying what he is doing. did he not get trained?[/quote]


You need to watch the video again. The car was a cop car with lights and police stickers down the side. After he punch the girl he pursued her (pink shirt) down the side of the car and thats when the other girl (black shirt)came up behind him grabbing and pushing the cop. He then turned to her and the guy (green Shirt) grabbed the girl in pink and pulled her out of the way. Sorry after watching this several time she got what she deserved.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

What she did was absolutely wrong but damn if what the officer did isn't wrong either. You have to assess the situation and clearly he put himself and others in danger by taking on the whole street alone. At one point he has the two girls at the same time and his gun exposed. Not having backup and manhandling people alone is not what they teach you at the police academy, at least I hope not. This cop is not street ready, get him of the streets and get him some more training.

How would I have handled it? I would put a distance between me and the teens...unbuckle my holster and put my hand on my gun, inform them that they have 3 seconds comply to my commands. If they don't obey, draw the gun though not point at them...if they still don't obey, then you call for backup and charge them with resisting arrest and fleeing.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=saden1;707066]What she did was absolutely wrong but damn if what the officer did isn't wrong either. You have to assess the situation and clearly he put himself and others in danger by taking on the whole street alone. At one point he has the two girls at the same time and his gun exposed. Not having backup and manhandling people alone is not what they teach you at the police academy, at least I hope not. This cop is not street ready, get him of the streets and get him some more training.

How would I have handled it? I would put a distance between me and the teens...unbuckle my holster and put my hand on my gun, inform them that they have 3 seconds comply to my commands. If they don't obey, draw the gun though not point at them...if they still don't obey, then you call for backup and charge them with resisting arrest and fleeing.[/quote]

While I agree with what you said its much easier to look at this on film after the fact and we don't know that he had not called for back up.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=firstdown;707064]You need to watch the video again. The car was a cop car with lights and police stickers down the side. After he punch the girl he pursued her (pink shirt) down the side of the car and thats when the other girl (black shirt)came up behind him grabbing and pushing the cop. He then turned to her and the guy (green Shirt) grabbed the girl in pink and pulled her out of the way. Sorry after watching this several time [B]she got what she deserved.[/B][/quote]

I don't know that "she got what she deserved," but she definitely ran the risk of it happening by going after the officer. She came up and pushed him, I don't think he should have punched her, and I don't think he should have punched her, but she definitely put herself in harm's way by helping her friend resist arrest.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

You can't put your hands on a cop for any reason and not expect to get tasered or punched. Just like i agreed with that cop 2 years ago who tasered that old lady that was cursing and beating on him. To try and physically restrain her could have done worse damage than the taser.

A punch could have been excessive, but what else could he do other than taker her down or hit her with pepper spray or the taser....

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=SolidSnake84;707075]You can't put your hands on a cop for any reason and not expect to get tasered or punched. Just like i agreed with that cop 2 years ago who tasered that old lady that was cursing and beating on him. To try and physically restrain her could have done worse damage than the taser.

A punch could have been excessive, but what else could he do other than taker her down or hit her with pepper spray or the taser....[/quote]

You noticed she did not get back in his face after that.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

He let his ego get in the way of good judgement. Both the ladies get assault on a cop and whatever else they...need. He gets reprimanded for being stupid. ALL is well, have a nice day..........

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

For what it's worth, the Seattle Police Bureau or what its called is defending the officer's actions. They have seen and been reviewing the tapes and felt that the officer had to use physical force.

I felt the same way. I may have not hit the girl, but I would have maced her or used the tazer...they really are less damaging than physically beating someone.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

I think the officer force was a little excessive, but the bottomline is you shouldnt be putting your hands on the cop interferring and being aggressive. If she would have pulled a can of mace or knife from her pocketbook while in that close, the police officer's life could have been at risk. People need to stop acting stupid and think of consequences for once and think they can get away with acting like that. I stand behind the officer in this case, but he obviously needs more coaching or training about how to better handle that situation.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

hit a woman? interesting

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Yea, you don't put your hands on a cop period. Man or woman. They tend to get offensive when you do that.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=SolidSnake84;707095]For what it's worth, the Seattle Police Bureau or what its called is defending the officer's actions. They have seen and been reviewing the tapes and felt that the officer had to use physical force.

I felt the same way. I may have not hit the girl, [SIZE=5]but I would have maced her or used the tazer[/SIZE]...they really are less damaging than physically beating someone.[/quote]

AND that is what he should done. By virtue that she was pushing him he had the right to respond, and subdue. Not sure a "haymaker" on a woman is hoyle in the law enforcement world.......

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=saden1;707066]What she did was absolutely wrong but damn if what the officer did isn't wrong either. You have to assess the situation and clearly he put himself and others in danger by taking on the whole street alone. At one point he has the two girls at the same time and his gun exposed. Not having backup and manhandling people alone is not what they teach you at the police academy, at least I hope not. This cop is not street ready, get him of the streets and get him some more training.

[B]How would I have handled it? I would put a distance between me and the teens...unbuckle my holster and put my hand on my gun, inform them that they have 3 seconds comply to my commands. If they don't obey, draw the gun though not point at them...if they still don't obey, then you call for backup and charge them with resisting arrest and fleeing.[/B][/quote]

This.

I can't come down too far on the righteous indignation side on this one. If this was a cop arresting a man, and some other dude came up pushing him and acting in the exact same manner as that woman did, we wouldn't be thinking twice about this. Equality works both ways.

Seriously, who here would ever even consider acting like that if someone was being arrested?

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=Chico23231;707097]I think the officer force was a little excessive, but the bottomline is you shouldnt be putting your hands on the cop interferring and being aggressive. If she would have pulled a can of mace or knife from her pocketbook while in that close, the police officer's life could have been at risk. People need to stop acting stupid and think of consequences for once and think they can get away with acting like that. I stand behind the officer in this case, but he obviously needs more coaching or training about how to better handle that situation.[/quote]

He needs a membership to the gym, too. He was having way too much trouble in trying to arrest that girl.

The officer and chicks should get in at least some trouble though and police should stop giving out jay walking tickets.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=BleedBurgundy;707103]This.

I can't come down too far on the righteous indignation side on this one. If this was a cop arresting a man, and some other dude came up pushing him and acting in the exact same manner as that woman did, we wouldn't be thinking twice about this. Equality works both ways.

Seriously, who here would ever even consider acting like that if someone was being arrested?[/quote]

True F'ing story. Still, I find it odd that he never really hesitated in throwing that punch. As though the thought that she is woman didn't cross his mind. I know I can't just haul off and punch a chick in the face, makes me wonder why it was so easy for him.

NOTE: I'm not accusing this officer of anything, just wondering how he was so comfortable doing that.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=Duffman003;707106]He needs a membership to the gym, too. He was having way too much trouble in trying to arrest that girl.

The officer and chicks should get in at least some trouble though and police should stop giving out jay walking tickets.[/quote]

I watched it again, and really think the officer actually was trying to not hurt the girl he was arresting. He outweighed her and up until the point that he actually twisted her arm behind her back, he was trying to not exert brute force. He was hoping she would calm down on her own. I noticed right at the end, that he did put her in a wrist lock once her arm was behind her back, which is standard protocol when escorting prisoners. (It was that way in the military, at least)

Still though, i am surprised why mace was not used....i think the punch on the 1st girl was self defense, a response to being angrily pushed, as he couldn't have honestly known what would happen next.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

I can tell you this.

#1- We don't know why he was dealing with the first juvenile, but "if" the officer had a legal reason to be dealing with that juvenile, then the second juvenile was obstructing his justice. Hopefully she was charged and possibly jailed as well.

#2- The two worse situations an officer can find himself in is a traffic stop. A lot of officers are killed walking up on a car and the second worse situation is a domestic where a husband or wife might try to defend their spouse. When it comes to juveniles there is no respect of the law. Only a few have it. The rest act just like this situation with their thinking that the police or anyone has no right to touch them. You can clearly hear the girls saying "you aint got no right to touch me." If she was breaking the law or about to break the law the officer has every right to put his hands on them. Kids don't get this. In this situation the girls friend tried to get involved and help get the officer off of her friend. That alone is against the law. Now the officer is in a bad spot with two females and a crowd of people he doesn't know and they are ganging up on him. No matter how you look at it if the officer felt, being the last line of the law, that his life was in danger based off of what they were saying and doing and possibly what they already had done... I don't have a problem with what he did. Plus I'm betting a jury wouldn't either.

I'll admit it looks bad, but when it get picked a part by the Commonwealth's Attorney, the officer did what came natural when he felt his life was in danger. Punches can be used as stunning techniques in order to gain control of the situation. Which is exactly what he did.

#3- For those wondering why he never called for back up.... perhaps it was on it's way. He might have been called to juveniles fighting and when he arrived he decided it was best to take that girl into custody first and all hell broke loose.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=SBXVII;707112]I can tell you this.

#1- We don't know why he was dealing with the first juvenile, but "if" the officer had a legal reason to be dealing with that juvenile, [B]then the second juvenile was obstructing his justice.[/B] Hopefully she was charged and possibly jailed as well.

#2- The two worse situations an officer can find himself in is a traffic stop. A lot of officers are killed walking up on a car and the second worse situation is a domestic where a husband or wife might try to defend their spouse. When it comes to juveniles there is no respect of the law. Only a few have it. The rest act just like this situation with their thinking that the police or anyone has no right to touch them. You can clearly hear the girls saying "you aint got no right to touch me." If she was breaking the law or about to break the law the officer has every right to put his hands on them. Kids don't get this. In this situation the girls friend tried to get involved and help get the officer off of her friend. That alone is against the law. Now the officer is in a bad spot with two females and a crowd of people he doesn't know and they are ganging up on him. No matter how you look at it if the officer felt, being the last line of the law, that his life was in danger based off of what they were saying and doing and possibly what they already had done... I don't have a problem with what he did. Plus I'm betting a jury wouldn't either.

I'll admit it looks bad, but when it get picked a part by the Commonwealth's Attorney, the officer did what came natural when he felt his life was in danger. Punches can be used as stunning techniques in order to gain control of the situation. Which is exactly what he did.

#3- For those wondering why he never called for back up.... perhaps it was on it's way. He might have been called to juveniles fighting and when he arrived he decided it was best to take that girl into custody first and all hell broke loose.[/quote]

Even if the officer was wrong dealing with the 1st juvenile the 2nd girl still should have stayed out of the way.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

I think the punch was a bit too much and I think if anything he should maybe receive some sort of reprimand in his file or some sort of minor fine, but you don't get in the way of an officer trying to do his job. Period.

I mean the second chick (the one in the pink shirt who pushed the officer away) to me is just flat out stupid. No friend is worth me getting either 1) arrested or 2) getting my lights punched out over. Eff that, sorry girlfriend, you get arrested and you're on your own.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

Yeah if you're going to put your hands on a cop (man or woman), be prepared to go the distance. Trust me on this one.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

When I was her age if you pushed a cop you would be lucky if you only got punched in the face. To many kids now day do not respect athority and just look at the attacks on teachers now days. Kids are taught that no one has the right to touch them and this is what we get. I would have never thought of touching a cop back in the day.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=saden1;707066]What she did was absolutely wrong but damn if what the officer did isn't wrong either. You have to assess the situation and clearly he put himself and others in danger by taking on the whole street alone. At one point he has the two girls at the same time and his gun exposed. Not having backup and manhandling people alone is not what they teach you at the police academy, at least I hope not. This cop is not street ready, get him of the streets and get him some more training.

How would I have handled it? I would put a distance between me and the teens...unbuckle my holster and put my hand on my gun, inform them that they have 3 seconds comply to my commands. If they don't obey, draw the gun though not point at them...if they still don't obey, then you call for backup and charge them with resisting arrest and fleeing.[/quote]
Nice post . An officer has too be defensive , because of the risk of someone getting control of his gun , then maybe using it . As SS33 said , I would not want that job , very stressful and emotionally trying . Too bad it came to this .

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

I have to say I am surprised by the overall support for the cop. When I was an MP if that situation had arisen, you get control, but also you get backup. Some comments imply backup may have been on the way, but during the video he never used his radio mike right by his shoulder. At one point he nearly pulled the one girls shirt off, and he was in the middle of what could have become a mob. As Saden said, you back off, give firm commands, with the taser at the ready, and work to diffuse the situation, not go whaling about. My guess is he didn't initially call for backup because he felt in control, and once it got mixed up he let his emotions control his actions. I can not in my mind justify his punch in any way. Once pushed and cleared he should have straightened up and gotten the taser ready. Also, this was NOT a barroom situation where everyone was kinda roudy and outta control, where punches might get thrown, this was a teenage girl jaywalking.

From the bit I've seen, I just can't accept that his punch was appropriate.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

What a fail by that cop. Punches one woman in the face, then after more than two minutes when the video ends he still has yet to restrain that woman who's significatly smaller than him. Wus.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=DynamiteRave;707118]I think the punch was a bit too much and I think if anything he should maybe receive some sort of reprimand in his file or some sort of minor fine, but you don't get in the way of an officer trying to do his job. Period.

I mean the second chick (the one in the pink shirt who pushed the officer away) to me is just flat out stupid. No friend is worth me getting either 1) arrested or 2) getting my lights punched out over. Eff that, sorry girlfriend, you get arrested and you're on your own.[/quote]

Interesting take. The problem with society is no one wants to respect or trust cops. I'll be the first to tell you there are bad cops. No different then in any other job. There is always one bad apple and unfortunately all the rest get the bad apple routine.

I'll say it again, we don't know why the officer was even there dealing with the juvenile. Maybe she had been fighting another girl and when the cop showed up she resisted arrest. Then the friend got involved. I can tell you this when an officer is dealing with an issue .... never put your hands on them. By court room standards .... it's assault on law enforcement. Even if it's just a push.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]This was flat out wrong and absolutely excessive. I used to be a huge Cops fan (the show) in my younger days. If you watch a rerun of the show back when the program began and compare it the most recent Saturday at 8pm version the attitudes and force employed by police have immensely changed. And its pretty disturbing. [/FONT][/COLOR]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Its had to completely blame the officers because it has to be the way they are trained. The tactics and styles have become much more aggressive. Im hoping that cameras in the hands of the people will start to change things and reduce the agressive styles taught in training. [/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

Here is what I learned of the case. ...

The cop had stopped a man for jaywalking. Yes it's petty but while dealing with the man the 1st girl started running her mouth and became angry. At this point she is already obstructing justice because the officer is trying to deal with the jaywalker not her. When he tries to detain her or take her into custody the 2nd female steps up and tries to push the officer off her friend.

I'll be honest with you they both are lucky they weren't pepper sprayed or tazered. The punch was not a big deal considering officers are taught stunning techniques like stepping on toes, raking the shin, chop to the neck. In a nut shell officers are being taught Jujitsu. The officer could have done a lot worse and didn't. Maybe pepper spray might have been more appropriate but did he have time to use it before the other girl walked into the fight? He could have broken the contact and pulled his tazer and been in his legal right to have tazered both. Now what would have been worse the punch or the other two?

[url=http://www.officer.com/online/article.jsp?siteSection=1&id=52937]Police Guild Defends Seattle Officer's Actions: Top News Stories at Officer.com[/url]

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=mlmpetert;707178][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]This was flat out wrong and absolutely excessive. I used to be a huge Cops fan (the show) in my younger days. If you watch a rerun of the show back when the program began and compare it the most recent Saturday at 8pm version the attitudes and force employed by police have immensely changed. And its pretty disturbing. [/FONT][/COLOR]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Its had to completely blame the officers because it has to be the way they are trained. The tactics and styles have become much more aggressive. Im hoping that cameras in the hands of the people will start to change things and reduce the agressive styles taught in training. [/FONT][/COLOR][/quote]

Let me just say as society gets more violent and especially with police, the police have to be taught ways to deal with and control the violence. As someone else said... I never would have even thought of putting my hands on a cop growing up. God forbid you even had any type of contact. Let the officer bring me home and I would have gotten whooped for the officer having to deal with me.

Everyone has this nice pretty bubble they live in where people are all not breaking the law and going about their business. In reality as you see 95% of all the good in people, the cops are only seeing 95% of the bad in people. Imagine everyday and having to be on guard with everyone you come in contact with. Expecting them to hurt you in some manner. Something simple as the cop talking to the jaywalker and possibly giving him a warning or a summons turned into a lady arguing with the cop an getting arrested and a 17 y/o putting her hands on the cop who is trying to do his job then punches her.

Maybe society should be asking why can't cops be allowed to do their jobs with out arguing or fighting the officer?

It could have been totally different. The officer talks with the man and everyone walks away. Instead the women starts arguing which is obstructing the officers duty with the man and then proceeds to possibly incite a riot, but definitely she was acting in a disorderly manner.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=GMScud;707140]What a fail by that cop. Punches one woman in the face, then after more than two minutes when the video ends he still has yet to restrain that woman who's significatly smaller than him. Wus.[/quote]

To me this is the bottom line. The cop is a pussy and a moron...double threat guy! He can't handle himself (physically, mentally or emotionally) and completely lost control of a situation that really shouldn't have gone anywhere. Forget about the guidelines, laws and regulations. If the precinct wants to have a cheese-ball like that on the force you can't have respect for the local law enforcement.

I find the broad-based support of the dude's actions disturbing and sad.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

[quote=The Goat;707199]To me this is the bottom line. The cop is a pussy and a moron...double threat guy! He can't handle himself (physically, mentally or emotionally) and completely lost control of a situation that really shouldn't have gone anywhere. Forget about the guidelines, laws and regulations. If the precinct wants to have a cheese-ball like that on the force you can't have respect for the local law enforcement.

I find the broad-based support of the dude's actions disturbing and sad.[/quote]
I agree with everything you just wrote.

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I'm a black man, and the cop was clearly right for punching her, she should of let him do his job, and then, if they thought it was some case (racist) then they could have taking legal actions later....... this no different than when that white cop punched that black teenage girl for biting him..... in this case, the cop could have pulled out his tazor and started tazing they ass........ but hey everyone go have a opinion thats mine.

Re: Cop Punches Student
 

Had a great FB debate on this. I have no problem with what happened.

There is a longer/full vid from this and it shows more of what happened before the punch. I'm not sure he needed to do it but honestly he needed to create separation and it worked. In the long term that's less painful than mace or a taser. By taking her to the ground to restrain her he'd have left his weapons exposed and there were plenty of people around. He could've also been more prone to external attack.

That girl just didn't want to behave. You guys know that I'll say F Cops just about as quickly as anybody on here but he's fine here. Had that been a guy he would've gotten the baton justifiably.