Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

Crazy stuff.

[URL="http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/2010/11/28/2010-11-28_wikileaks_weve_been_hit_with_mass_distributed_denial_of_service_attack.html"]WikiLeaks website hit with 'mass distributed denial of service attack'[/URL]
[URL="http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/28/us-embassy-cable-leak-diplomacy-crisis"]US embassy cables leak sparks global diplomatic crisis | World news | The Guardian[/URL]
[URL="http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/d2bc69f8-fb2c-11df-b576-00144feab49a.html"]FT.com / US / Politics & Foreign policy - US tries to limit WikiLeaks damage[/URL]
[URL="http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,731587,00.html"]Orders from Clinton: US Diplomats Told to Spy on Other Countries at United Nations - SPIEGEL ONLINE - News - International[/URL]

There are so many more links. Just a few here....

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

Apparantly this is quote unquote "the 9/11 of world diplomacy."

:doh:

Is there anything to be gained by doing this? I mean, yeah it's nice to see a little information revealed on the inner workings of the state department, but you look at the cost, which could be peoples' lives, diplomacy between allies falling to ruins, and at what point do you justify releasing this information to the public? I'd rather not know what's going on within our government if it means keeping peoples' lives safe and keeping relations with foreign countries at peace and in order.

I won't be suprised if the government is doing everything humanly possible to prevent this from happening. The damage has already been done though in my opinion. Now I'm not much for politics, but I do understand the need for sensitive information to be kept secret. The world is a fickle place, and if there were no secrets between any and all countries it would be chaotic.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

Here is the wikileaks FAQ page, which gives their thoughts on the matter of the releases:

[url=http://cablegate.wikileaks.org/static/html/faq.html]Cable Viewer[/url]

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

this guy is a totally prick and not helping anyone, i think he will be found soon dead from something "accidental"

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

Sunshine is the best disinfectant and anonymity is for cowards and the shady. I hope they keep it up and keep releasing info. And instead of bitching perhaps United States should concentrate on securing their fcking data. If these guys can get it I wonder what the Chinese have.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=saden1;763628]Sunshine is the best disinfectant and anonymity is for cowards and the shady. I hope they keep it up and keep releasing info. And instead of bitch perhaps United States should concentrate on securing their fcking data.[B] If these guys can get it I wonder what the Chinese have.[/B][/quote]

In fact, Iran's president said that this release won't change his country's dealings. Yes that is partially political speak, but fact is they probably already knew any or most of these facts. Only the US citizens are unaware of these type monologues. But the government does like its secrecy.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=saden1;763628]Sunshine is the best disinfectant and anonymity is for cowards and the shady. I hope they keep it up and keep releasing info. [B]And instead of bitching perhaps United States should concentrate on securing their fcking data.[/B] If these guys can get it I wonder what the Chinese have.[/quote]

While I agree to a point would you feel that way if someone found a way to drain your checking and saving accounts?

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

You know what ? I ****ing hate people like this. Hackers that live to come up with viruses to destroy your computer, not because I slapped your mother. Not because I stole from you. Not because I didn't put enough sugar in your Kool-Aid. And not because I overcooked your steak. Just because you have nothing else to do. ****ing douche. Everyone is in this whole lets get the info out there because we deserve to know. We don't derserve to know dick. I don't need anyone to tell me that Kennedy was killed by someone who will never be named, I had Oliver Stone for that.

I wonder what these miserable shits will say when everything they wanted to expose comes back and bites us in the ass. Go watch some Anime porn and find out the newest glitch in COD. I've got some wet poontang to get and some folks to kill in COD. Let the info be, leave the secrets where they should be. HIDDEN,......sonsabitches !

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=saden1;763628]Sunshine is the best disinfectant and anonymity is for cowards and the shady. I hope they keep it up and keep releasing info. And instead of bitching perhaps United States should concentrate on securing their fcking data. If these guys can get it I wonder what the Chinese have.[/quote]

I mean nobody should be surprised at any of the info in the leaks. Hell yes we do shady shit all the time as a country. Now we just have less deniability.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=firstdown;763658]While I agree to a point would you feel that way if someone found a way to drain your checking and saving accounts?[/quote]

I expect my bank account to be secure and so does the law. The law says if I tell my bank I didn't drain my account and that the transaction was fraudulent they are required to deposit all my stolen money back within 10 days.

A fair comparison would be me having 100K under my mattress and it being stolen then bitch about those who stole it.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=saden1;763628]Sunshine is the best disinfectant and anonymity is for cowards and the shady. I hope they keep it up and keep releasing info.[/quote]I assume you don't have anyone close to you working in the State Dept. and stationed overseas. I will also assume you don't care about the safety and well being of our sources that are in unfriendly foregin gov'ts that may suddenly "disappear" once this information is made public. This is a devastating blow to our HUMINT capabilities. Potential contacts we could gather valuable info from will be much more reluctant to talk for fear of being outed. Keep in mind Bill Clinton's scaling back of our HUMINT capabilities and politcal fear to take out Bin Laden was a major contributing factor to 9/11.

I applaud Hillary for tasking our diplomats with aggressive HUMINT gathering. These WikiLeaks idiots will have blood on their hands within days/weeks of this info being released. I hope they meet the same fate as any of our sources who "disappear".

[quote]And instead of bitching perhaps United States should concentrate on securing their fcking data. If these guys can get it I wonder what the Chinese have.[/quote]The place you can never secure 100% is from inside access to information. To get a more secure environment we would need to implement far more rigorous background screenings for military and intelligence personnel and also enforce harsh punishments for offenders; such as being charged with treason and life imprisonment without pardon or parole.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;763746]I assume you don't have anyone close to you working in the State Dept. and stationed overseas. I will also assume you don't care about the safety and well being of our sources that are in unfriendly foregin gov'ts that may suddenly "disappear" once this information is made public. This is a devastating blow to our HUMINT capabilities. Potential contacts we could gather valuable info from will be much more reluctant to talk for fear of being outed. Keep in mind Bill Clinton's scaling back of our HUMINT capabilities and politcal fear to take out Bin Laden was a major contributing factor to 9/11.

I applaud Hillary for tasking our diplomats with aggressive HUMINT gathering. These WikiLeaks idiots will have blood on their hands within days/weeks of this info being released. I hope they meet the same fate as any of our sources who "disappear".

The place you can never secure 100% is from inside access to information. To get a more secure environment we would need to implement far more rigorous background screenings for military and intelligence personnel and also enforce harsh punishments for offenders; such as being charged with treason and life imprisonment without pardon or parole.[/quote]

You assume wrong...my cousin who I am very close to is a field operations director for USAID in Pakistan and Afghanistan right now and has been for the past 5 years. These leaks won't make any difference in her safety. She has previously told me that she's just as likely to die from a helicopter crash as she is from gunfire. Plus wnemies of the United States don't need excuses to kill Americans.

They need to secure their documents and insure their internal staff don't leak information. If they can't they shouldn't be in the business of doing shady shit that if revealed could bring about harm.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=saden1;763759]You assume wrong...my cousin who I am very close to is a field operations director for USAID in Pakistan and Afghanistan right now and has been for the past 5 years. These leaks won't make any difference in her safety. She has previously told me that she's just as likely to die from a helicopter crash as she is from gunfire. Plus wnemies of the United States don't need excuses to kill Americans.

They need to secure their documents and insure their internal staff don't leak information. If they can't they shouldn't be in the business of doing shady shit that if revealed could bring about harm.[/quote]USAID is U.S. Agency for International Development, and not to say that some of their folks aren't involved with HUMINT activities on the down-low, but they're generally not an intelligence organization. You're correct, these leaks probably will have little to no affect on her safety.

That being said, folks who are in "diplomatic" roles working for State are many times a lot more than that. It's those folks that are in more jeopardy because of these leaks. Best case - some of our sources of info are just shut down temporarily....Worst case - some of our people or inside sources are imprisoned or killed.

You can never secure information 100% from a cleared insider with an axe to grind, and from the few things I've read these leaks may also be attributed to Private Bradley Manning. I worked at NSA for a short time while I was in the AF. Back in the day, this wouldn't have been possible because technology didn't allow for the access to the wide range of data that we have today. The systems were far more stove-piped and compartmentalization of info was much easier.

We have to stay in the business of doing shady shit to stop the folks that have ill-will towards us from doing more shady or murderous shit to us.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;763791]USAID is U.S. Agency for International Development, and not to say that some of their folks aren't involved with HUMINT activities on the down-low, but they're generally not an intelligence organization. You're correct, these leaks probably will have little to no affect on her safety.

That being said, folks who are in "diplomatic" roles working for State are many times a lot more than that. It's those folks that are in more jeopardy because of these leaks. Best case - some of our sources of info are just shut down temporarily....Worst case - some of our people or inside sources are imprisoned or killed.

You can never secure information 100% from a cleared insider with an axe to grind, and from the few things I've read these leaks may also be attributed to Private Bradley Manning. I worked at NSA for a short time while I was in the AF. Back in the day, this wouldn't have been possible because technology didn't allow for the access to the wide range of data that we have today. The systems were far more stove-piped and compartmentalization of info was much easier.

We have to stay in the business of doing shady shit to stop the folks that have ill-will towards us from doing more shady or murderous shit to us.[/quote]

The danger angle is overplayed and overrated...what we are more likely to lose is trust and credibility. GMScud said it best:

[quote]I mean nobody should be surprised at any of the info in the leaks. Hell yes we do shady shit all the time as a country. Now we just have less deniability.
[/quote]

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=Chico23231;763614]this guy is a totally prick and not helping anyone, i think he will be found soon dead from something "accidental"[/quote]

Considering he stated big corporations are his next target (as in the content is already in his possession) I wouldn't be even remotely surprised if he has an "accident."

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

It almost feel like people want him to have an "accident." I wonder if they feel the same way about journalists who expose a big government scandal or whistle-blowers who expose malfeasance.

I am disgusted by the amount of vitriol directed at him and I hope he doesn't have an "accident." Wikileaks isn't just run by Julian Assange, they're a moderate sized operation with lots of volunteers not to mention the fact that big media, including American media, back them with legal issues. Plus the whole operation is distributed so Assanger having an "accident" isn't going to get rid of the problem.

[URL="http://stefanmey.wordpress.com/2010/01/04/leak-o-nomy-the-economy-of-wikileaks/"]Leak-o-nomy: The Economy ofÂ*Wikileaks (Interview with Julian Assange) | Medien-Ökonomie-Blog[/URL]

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

Seems like a classic case of blaming the messenger rather than the true source.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[url=http://www.forbes.com/2010/11/29/julian-assange-wikileaks-business-media-assange_lander.html?boxes=businesschannellighttop]WikiLeaks' Julian Assange Wants to Spill Your Corporate Secrets - Forbes.com[/url]

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

My thing with this is what good comes out of this? Most of it seems to be kinda what everyone is thinking, but now its just written account or opinion. Think what people tend to forget is every country has its own written opinions and foreign strageties. I like the response one country said about the Clinton remarks which was something to the effect of "you should hear what we say about you," which is the right way to take many of the releases. But in a period where we are in the process of rebuilding relations around the world, having something that was said several years ago impact that current relationship is bothersome. There is the aspect of puting some in danger as well, especially our diaplomats. I dont see any good in it and yes i would enjoy transparency in foreign relations, but come on that fantasy world. You think other countries are transparent? lol

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

Matty while I agree with what you are saying, I do not think there is too much positive that comes out of this. Governments may just be more paranoid about communications now.

This is simply become like HS gossip. With nations being spoiled 16 year old girls trashing each other behind their back. The only result from it is a "battle" a la season finale of Bad Girls Club.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

Just curious if the tune will change once they start going after big business.

Let's face it the gov't and corporations will never give true transparency, so are we really interested in having it or not?

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

Knowledge is power and therefore good....that in itself is good enough for me. Gems:



[QUOTE]When Afghanistan’s vice president visited the United Arab Emirates last year, local authorities working with the Drug Enforcement Administration discovered that he was carrying $52 million in cash. With wry understatement, a cable from the American Embassy in Kabul called the money “a significant amount” that the official, Ahmed Zia Massoud, “was ultimately allowed to keep without revealing the money’s origin or destination.”[/QUOTE]

Really America? Are we trying to rebuild the ****ing country with thiefs?

[QUOTE]Saudi donors remain the chief financiers of Sunni militant groups like Al Qaeda, and the tiny Persian Gulf state of Qatar, a generous host to the American military for years, was the “worst in the region” in counterterrorism efforts, according to a State Department cable last December. Qatar’s security service was “hesitant to act against known terrorists out of concern for appearing to be aligned with the U.S. and provoking reprisals,” the cable said.[/QUOTE]

You knew about the Saudis but the Qatari?


[QUOTE] American diplomats in Rome reported in 2009 on what their Italian contacts described as an extraordinarily close relationship between Vladimir V. Putin, the Russian prime minister, and Silvio Berlusconi, the Italian prime minister and business magnate, including “lavish gifts,” lucrative energy contracts and a “shadowy” Russian-speaking Italian go-between. They wrote that Mr. Berlusconi “appears increasingly to be the mouthpiece of Putin” in Europe. The diplomats also noted that while Mr. Putin enjoyed supremacy over all other public figures in Russia, he was undermined by an unmanageable bureaucracy that often ignored his edicts.[/QUOTE]

Wow...that's crazy!

It's a fcking goldmine! I love it and everything that comes of it will in the long run lead to good.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

Assange speaks (from an undisclosed location - NOT in the back mountains of Pakistan):
[url=http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/08599203377100]WikiLeaks Founder Assange to TIME: Clinton 'Should Resign' - Yahoo! News[/url]

[QUOTE]"We have now in our four-year history, and over 100 legal attacks of various kinds, been victorious in all of those matters." He added, "It's very important to remember the law is not what, not simply what, powerful people would want others to believe it is. The law is not what a general says it is. [B]The law is not what Hillary Clinton says it is.[/B]"[/QUOTE]

Blasphemy!

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;764446]Assange speaks (from an undisclosed location - NOT in the back mountains of Pakistan):
[URL="http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/08599203377100"]WikiLeaks Founder Assange to TIME: Clinton 'Should Resign' - Yahoo! News[/URL]



Blasphemy![/quote]

If he was talking about Lord Obama I'd agree with you. The truth is Hillary Clinton should resign less we want to bribe countries to look the other way when it comes to what was said about them.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

I guess this Wiki Leak shows why we need to reduce goverment because they F everything up at some point.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

I guess this shithead is laying low in England and British authorities have known about it since October. WTF??

[url=http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/wikileaks-chief-what-will-he-do-next-2148813.html]Wikileaks chief: What will he do next? - Home News, UK - The Independent[/url]

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

Amazon dumped them and is no longer willing to host them. This whole thing seems like story from a movie.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=saden1;763800]The danger angle is overplayed and overrated...what we are more likely to lose is trust and credibility.[/quote]Bill Clinton doesn't think so

[url=http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/12/01/clinton-expects-cables-leak-cost-lives/]Bill Clinton Expects Cables Leak to Cost Lives - FoxNews.com[/url]

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;764523]Bill Clinton doesn't think so

[url=http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/12/01/clinton-expects-cables-leak-cost-lives/]Bill Clinton Expects Cables Leak to Cost Lives - FoxNews.com[/url][/quote]

I imagine he would seeing how his administrations dirty diplomatic laundry will be exposed. And of course the question is if they do cost lives who should be held responsible? Excellent question, no?

Only secrecy and torture save lives.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=saden1;764525]I imagine he would seeing how his administrations dirty diplomatic laundry will be exposed. [B]And of course the question is if they do cost lives who should be held responsible?[/B] [B]Excellent question, no?[/B][/quote]Many would have blood on their hands including:
- the actual killer
- whoever ordered the hit
- the traitor who provided the information (assuming it was an insider)
- and the wikileaks personnel responsibile for publishing the info

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=GMScud;764519]I guess this shithead is laying low in England and British authorities have known about it since October. WTF??

[URL="http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/wikileaks-chief-what-will-he-do-next-2148813.html"]Wikileaks chief: What will he do next? - Home News, UK - The Independent[/URL][/quote]

Man, if there's one thing I'm really tired of, it's countries that are supposed to be our allies not doing anything about fugitives that are in their country.

Like the lawless tribal badlands of Pakistan where I'm sure quite a few high ranking insurgents are hiding, to this asshat living in England and authorities not yet willing to authorize his arrest warrant for w/e reason, it just needs to stop. No wonder criminals don't give a shit about the crimes they commit, they know as long as they can just stay at a safe haven in another country they'll live another day to commit another crime.

It's like the Mexican drug lords not giving a shit about what happens in America, because they know Mexico is such a crappy country that they'll never get caught as long as they stay in control of the borderlands, and that the US will never be able to step foot into Mexico to go seize those worthless mofo's.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=mooby;764578]Man, if there's one thing I'm really tired of, it's countries that are supposed to be our allies not doing anything about fugitives that are in their country.

Like the lawless tribal badlands of Pakistan where I'm sure quite a few high ranking insurgents are hiding, to this asshat living in England and authorities not yet willing to authorize his arrest warrant for w/e reason, it just needs to stop. No wonder criminals don't give a shit about the crimes they commit, they know as long as they can just stay at a safe haven in another country they'll live another day to commit another crime.

It's like the Mexican drug lords not giving a shit about what happens in America, because they know Mexico is such a crappy country that they'll never get caught as long as they stay in control of the borderlands, and that the US will never be able to step foot into Mexico to go seize those worthless mofo's.[/quote]


The law is not what the United States says or thinks it is. Other countries govern themselves and therefore have their own set of principles. One cannot expect that just because they are your allies they'd jump on our whim and do as we want them to. We certainly don't, why should they be expected to?

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=mooby;764578]Man, if there's one thing I'm really tired of, it's countries that are supposed to be our allies not doing anything about fugitives that are in their country.

Like the lawless tribal badlands of Pakistan where I'm sure quite a few high ranking insurgents are hiding, to this asshat living in England and authorities not yet willing to authorize his arrest warrant for w/e reason, it just needs to stop. No wonder criminals don't give a shit about the crimes they commit, they know as long as they can just stay at a safe haven in another country they'll live another day to commit another crime.

It's like the Mexican drug lords not giving a shit about what happens in America, because they know Mexico is such a crappy country that they'll never get caught as long as they stay in control of the borderlands, and that the US will never be able to step foot into Mexico to go seize those worthless mofo's.[/quote]

Problem in Pakistan is that the government is not very strong and they have to walk a fine line to not send the country into war. They do what they can to bust people but if the government looks to heavy handed then they have problems. Mexico is just a corrupt government that we deal with.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

This Wikileak guy is just a big prick who is also wanted for rape. Not sure how anyone who uses a computer everyday and has to pay for all the fire walls from assholes like this could give this guy a pass. He is just doing to the goverment what small time guys try to do our information everyday.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

Nigeria has [URL="http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-12-01/nigeria-to-charge-dick-cheney-in-pipeline-bribery-case.html"]issued an arrest warrant[/URL] through interpol for Dick Cheney...I wonder if we're going to hand him over.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

So what do we think of him leaking the list of [URL="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-11923766"]key security facilities around the world[/URL]? Disinfectant?

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[QUOTE=FRPLG;765982]So what do we think of him leaking the list of [URL="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-11923766"]key security facilities around the world[/URL]? Disinfectant?[/QUOTE]

LOL...there is nothing secret about these facilities. It wasn't but a few years ago that a George Mason student did his phd thesis on this very same subject matter. It was a big deal then but all his research was based information readily available to the public. This is pathetic...security through obscurit is not security.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=saden1;766047]LOL...there is nothing secret about these facilities. It wasn't but a few years ago that a George Mason student did his phd thesis on this very same subject matter. It was a big deal then but all his research was based information readily available to the public. This is pathetic...security through obscurit is not security.[/quote]

Obscurity as part a security profile is certainly reasonable. You're grasping on that.

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

[quote=FRPLG;766067][B]Obscurity as part a security profile is certainly reasonable.[/B] You're grasping on that.[/quote]


Absolute nonsense. You want your nuclear launch facilities to be secure by design rather than try to redact their locations on published maps. Security through obscurity is lazy and quite frankly it's a very dangerous method of "security."

If a [URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A23689-2003Jul7?language=printer"]graduate student[/URL] can get the information any determined individual can get it too. What kind of fcking security is that?

Re: Another Massive Wiki Leak
 

Here's a study on the subject matter published by RAND and sponsored by DoD:

[url=http://www.rand.org/pubs/monographs/MG142.html]Mapping the Risks: Assessing the Homeland Security Implications of Publicly Available Geospatial Information | RAND[/url]