What would it take?
 

The recount thread has become less about the recounts since it's over. So how about a new question. For those who are anti-Trump, what would it take - or what would you need to see in the first 180 days to bring you to his side. Obviously some parts of his agenda will never be supported by democrats, but what could happen that would make his presidency more palatable then the last 4 years of Bush.

For the Trumpeters, what would it take, or what could he do in the 180 days to shake your faith, and specifically, what legislation could be passed or not passed that would make you buy in to the Trump's a charlatan argument.

My big 3 -
1) failing to repeal the Affordable Care Act - while a replace option at some point could be added, the repeal is the higher priority to me. For my family, I would be content going back to the health care of the past, at least I could afford that. (selfish bastard that I am that I want to be able to cover myself and my kids first).

2) making a unjustified deal with Russia. I don't think we should be Ukraine's protector, but we definitely should be committed to NATO. Any deal that trades any NATO member's security for Russian cooperation would break my faith in him.

3) a lack of efforts that specifically target improving the life of urban US cities. Both parties ignore the real needs of these populations, the democrats take them for granted, and republicans see them as unswerving opponents. I want to see Trump move beyond that dilemna.

the least important thing that Trump promised - the wall. If it's built fine, if not, make immigration attainable, deport criminals here illegally and call it a job well done.

What are your big 3?

Re: What would it take?
 

I'm an anti-Trump republican, a #NeverTrump guy if you will.

To win me over:

1) bring back the jobs in the manufacturing sector in the US without resulting in a CPI increase much different from what we've been experiencing for the last 20 years.

2) stronger commitment to NATO and show an ability to influence Russia's actions. Getting them to withdraw their forces massed at the border of the Baltic states would be a good start.

3) Bring down prescription drug prices in the US

CRedskins I could talk all day about the repeal of Obamacare and why going back to the 'old' healthcare is like trying to put the toothpaste back in the tube. There are countless reasons why repealing Obamacare will not help make your healthcare coverage more affordable. But that's another thread.

What would it take?
 

Feeling kind of left out here since the question is for the trumpeters.
SAD!
Nevermind just saw the first question.
GLAD!

What would it take?
 

To answer your question a shit ton! Lol.
Let me start with the basic fundamentals of being a human being.
1) stop the childish bickering and insults at every single entity or person that ever said anything negative about you. If he were on this site he would be warriorz and banned because he cannot handle criticism of his ideas.
2) take the god damned environmental issues somewhat seriously for christ sake.
3) speak in a manner in which i want my children to speak in.

Re: What would it take?
 

My whole thing with Obamacare is you cant repeal it unless the GOP comes back with a better plan....one that has medium and small business more in mind.

Re: What would it take?
 

Another one to the basic human decency list: don't be so painful to watch and listen to that it causes millions of Americans to tune you out.

I wasn't a fan of Obama's policies but he emoted, he listened, he acknowledged when the other side had a point, and he was not obnoxious. I get concerned with the long term consequences if enough people hate listening to the president sooo much that they decide to check out of the civics process.

By the way I would have had the exact same concern with Hillary, maybe even more so.

Re: What would it take?
 

[QUOTE=Schneed10;1163307]Another one to the basic human decency list: don't be so painful to watch and listen to that it causes millions of Americans to tune you out.



I wasn't a fan of Obama's policies but he emoted, he listened, he acknowledged when the other side had a point, and he was not obnoxious. I get concerned with the long term consequences if enough people hate listening to the president sooo much that they decide to check out of the civics process.



By the way I would have had the exact same concern with Hillary, maybe even more so.[/QUOTE]



Definitely not more so. Lol. But i hear you. I voted for Bernie in the primary for the record.

Re: What would it take?
 

Hillary always sounded like she was lecturing. I dreaded having to listen to her even though I voted for her. She was always somewhere between lecturing and straight up yelling at you.

Neither is very inspiring. It sucks, I've got two girls coming up, they're 10 and 7 now, so old enough to pay attention to the president's words. I'm afraid they'll hear Trump and just say to themselves why do I want to put myself through this?

Sigh.

Re: What would it take?
 

Schneed you know your girls are listening more to you then Trump. Unless you or someone in there direct life is saying something.crazy (and I don't think you are) they are going to grow up believing in themselves. If you want to fear someone's influence you probably need to worry more how Disney is gonna convince them that you and all grown ups are stupid.

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Re: What would it take?
 

I don't fear that they'll be negatively influenced by anything a president has to say, my fear is that the president will come across as so obnoxious that they won't want to listen to him (or her).

At this age you just want your kids to be interested in learning more about the process - what the president does, how the checks and balances work, etc. But if they can't stand listening to him then it increases the chances that they'll show little interest. I think that's a shame.

It's a criticism of style, not substance, and it's independent of party or position.

But you're right, my wife and I steer them much more greatly than anybody else. I may have to work a little harder to get them to listen to his words.

Re: What would it take?
 

Mine mostly stem around the environment and sustainable economic growth we through so much money away on externalized costs I am a firm believer you take a conservative approach with the environment everything else will follow suit.

1. In his infrastructure plan focus on improved energy efficiency. I am all for domestic energy production but lets use what we currently have more sustainably. Use the infrastructure money to decommission old coal fired power plants that generally run at 35% efficiency to build cogeneration power plants that can operate close to 80%. While not a fan of coal I accept it is the primary source of electrical generation in the U.S.
2. Hold corporations and industry accountable and internalize environmental and health costs associated. Make those that use the product be willing to pay for the problems they cause. I drive pretty far to work, I will accept an increase in gasoline prices if they are used to offset other prices I pay externally. Also transparency by companies, if you want to hydrofrack fine, but companies need to be required to disseminate what is in the hydrofracking solution as opposed to calling it a trade secret.
3. Lastly climate change, the secretary of state nominee has voiced his understanding of the science I would like to see the EPA director and the President do the same. Doing the first two will assist in doing our part, but we also need to continue to promote R&D in renewables as well as climate and meteorological research.

Re: What would it take?
 

[quote=Schneed10;1163316]I don't fear that they'll be negatively influenced by anything a president has to say, my fear is that the president will come across as so obnoxious that they won't want to listen to him (or her).

At this age you just want your kids to be interested in learning more about the process - what the president does, how the checks and balances work, etc. But if they can't stand listening to him then it increases the chances that they'll show little interest. I think that's a shame.

It's a criticism of style, not substance, and it's independent of party or position.

But you're right, my wife and I steer them much more greatly than anybody else. I may have to work a little harder to get them to listen to his words.[/quote]

Gotcha, wholeheartedly agree, but trust me once they hit 16, they will already know more about how politics works (and everything else in the world then you ever did) ;) [/sarc /teenknowitalls]

Re: What would it take?
 

Hahaha, truth.

Re: What would it take?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1163297]The recount thread has become less about the recounts since it's over. So how about a new question. For those who are anti-Trump, what would it take - or what would you need to see in the first 180 days to bring you to his side. [/quote]


In 180 days? Nothing. He's already shown me enough with his cabinet selection to know that it's going to be a fucking disaster.

[U][B]Department of Housing and Urban Development[/B][/U]
Ben Carson- absolutely no experience or knowledge about HUD. Hey, if you wanted him as Surgeon General, I could get behind that pick. Let's not forget that Carson said he wasn't qualified to take on any cabinet positions.

[url=http://www.latimes.com/nation/politics/trailguide/la-na-trailguide-updates-ben-carson-won-t-be-joining-donald-1479231990-htmlstory.html]Former presidential candidate Ben Carson says he won't join Trump's Cabinet because he has no government experience - LA Times[/url]

[B][U]Secretary of Education:[/U][/B]
Betsy DeVos- another person with absolutely no experience in education, loans, public institutions. She thinks we should have guns in schools because of Grizzlies. (SMH)

[B][U]Secretary of Energy[/U][/B]
Rick Perry- The very guy who wanted to get rid of the Energy department, and knows jack shit about it. Hell, he didn't even know what the job entailed.

[url]https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/18/us/politics/rick-perry-energy-secretary-donald-trump.html[/url]

[B][U]Secretary of State:[/U][/B]
Rex Tillerson- Yes. Let's appoint a oil company CEO who has ties and deals with Russia on the board. You know those sanctions Obama put on Russia? Those same sanctions stopped some big oil deals with Exxon. Should we even talk about his lack of experience at one of the top spots in the nation?

[B][U]Attorney General:[/U][/B]
Jeff Sessions- He's certainly qualified from an experience standpoint. His views and potential racism is very worrisome.

[B][U]Secretary of Transportation:[/U][/B]
Elaine Chao - A former Secretary of Labor has experience in being in a cabinet, but what does she know about transportation? Had this been the Labor selection, I probably wouldn't have an issue with it. As it stands, it's a good ole boy selection.


[B][U]UN Ambassador:[/U][/B]
Nikki R. Haley- I have no issues with this pick. Good to hear she acknowledge Russia's actions in Syria as war crimes. I don't particularly agree with her on the Israel thing though, but still a qualified candidate. I'd say this was Trump's best pick of them all.


[B][U]Secretary of Defense:[/U][/B]
James Mattis- definitely qualified. Just worry he'll be a war hawk and want to drag us into a war with Iran/Syria. I also worry that Trump won't listen to him either.

I could go on down the list showing you how many of these picks are because they were big donors to his campaign and not because they are right for the job. It's going to be hard for him to be successful if he's picking bad choices to lead these individual departments.

Re: What would it take?
 

Thanks for playing NC. enjoy the resistance.

In all seriousness, I get punch, and others, but I have no idea what form of government/political structure you would support. If you think that government hasn't always formed around the rich/powerful people of a country that's simply crazy. Hell, George Washington was a military general/aristocratic land owning virginian, Hamilton may have been a "bastard, orphan, son of a whore and a Scotsman", but he was also the historical equivalent of Goldman Sachs CEO. Our whole system of banking and government basically boiled down to 5 or 6 greedy white men figuring out how to make government work for them. Jefferson wanted access to government power, Hamilton wanted financial power, and here we are.

So for you, I ask [I]what would it take[/I] for you to accept any government at all?

Re: What would it take?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1163297]My big 3 -
1) failing to repeal the Affordable Care Act - while a replace option at some point could be added, the repeal is the higher priority to me. For my family, I would be content going back to the health care of the past, at least I could afford that. (selfish bastard that I am that I want to be able to cover myself and my kids first).[/quote]

DO you actually think repealing the ACA is going to lower your costs? You sir have been duped into buying fools gold. Here is a spoiler for you. It's not. In fact, it's going to rise and rise fast. As noted in the article below, those uninsured health costs are going to have to absorbed by somebody. Those somebodies are you and me the insurance buyers.

[url]https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/17/us/politics/congressional-budget-office-affordable-care-act.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur&_r=0[/url]


I really suggest you research the rise of insurance rates prior and during the ACA. You'll notice the ACA actually slowed down the rate of growth on insurance rates. But hey.....fuck Obamacare right?

[url=http://www.factcheck.org/2015/02/slower-premium-growth-under-obama/]Slower Premium Growth Under Obama[/url]

The problem isn't insurance rates rising, it's that wages are stagnant.
[url=http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2016/09/27/health-insurance-premiums-have-continued-to-rise-faster-than-worker-wages-under-obamacare/#49b095603606]Forbes Welcome[/url]



[quote=CRedskinsRule;1163297]2) making a unjustified deal with Russia. I don't think we should be Ukraine's protector, but we definitely should be committed to NATO. Any deal that trades any NATO member's security for Russian cooperation would break my faith in him.[/quote]

Would him removing sanctions against Russia break your faith? I highly suspect that is going to happen. No we aren't Ukraine's protectors, but you can't allow him to take over that area where are NATO allies are.

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1163297]3) a lack of efforts that specifically target improving the life of urban US cities. Both parties ignore the real needs of these populations, the democrats take them for granted, and republicans see them as unswerving opponents. I want to see Trump move beyond that dilemna.[/quote]

Some many factors go into this and they go well beyond even Trump or any President. Many of these areas need to improve educationally, socio-economically, and culturally to improve. Some of it is going to have to come from within those very communities in order to break the cycle.


[quote=CRedskinsRule;1163297]the least important thing that Trump promised - the wall. If it's built fine, if not, make immigration attainable, deport criminals here illegally and call it a job well done.[/quote]

A wall is going to be as effective as a shredded condom. It's just a huge waste of money, and it's going to keep nobody out.I have no issues with deporting criminals here illegally or even jailing those that commit crimes.

Re: What would it take?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1163359]Thanks for playing NC. enjoy the resistance.

So for you, I ask [I]what would it take[/I] for you to accept any government at all?[/quote]


I do accept government. In a fantasy land, we wouldn't need government. Everybody would act accordingly, be fair, be responsible, respect each others opinions/lifestyles and help each other out to further humanity. The difference between you and me are vastly different because you think no further than your nose on your face. You make decisions based on what's going to affect you and your family's immediate future. I make mine based on all of humanity. Why have kids if you are just fucking the world for the future generations?

[IMG]http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/La_Resistance.jpg[/IMG]

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1163359]In all seriousness, I get punch, and others, but I have no idea what form of government/political structure you would support. If you think that government hasn't always formed around the rich/powerful people of a country that's simply crazy.[/quote]


Ah yes. SO we should just readily accept that the rich and powerful should rule us and move along because of history? Be a good servant and go fetch these rich assholes their slippers. Maybe the blacks should have said the same thing when they were slaves as well. History of humanity has been about man fighting to make things an equal playing field. There may never be some fantasy land Utopia, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive for it. (much like anything in our lives) We should be learning from history, not repeating it.

Re: What would it take?
 

Let me be clear, since Schneed and NC both hit. There is a place for the government to fix healthcare in this country. The affordable care act is NOT it. I'm not going to say I can write a better plan, I can't. But there are people who can, and I'm not talking about ideologues on either side of the aisle.

Things I think would make a difference (that will probably never happen):
putting reasonable limits on lawsuits
setting up a medical academy (or 2) like the military academies that produce medical doctors who commit to years of post college service
allowing cross state insurance pools
making larger use of both cataclysmic insurance pools, and minimum care guidelines
doing something, i don't know what, on prescription drugs

Like I said I don't know the best plans so whenever you want to write a primer on what are the best practices Schneed, I would love to learn.

Re: What would it take?
 

[quote=NC_Skins;1163366]I do accept government. In a fantasy land, we wouldn't need government. Everybody would act accordingly, be fair, be responsible, respect each others opinions/lifestyles and help each other out to further humanity. The difference between you and me are vastly different because you think no further than your nose on your face. You make decisions based on what's going to affect you and your family's immediate future. I make mine based on all of humanity. Why have kids if you are just fucking the world for the future generations?

[IMG]http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/La_Resistance.jpg[/IMG]




Ah yes. SO we should just readily accept that the rich and powerful should rule us and move along because of history? Be a good servant and go fetch these rich assholes their slippers. Maybe the blacks should have said the same thing when they were slaves as well. History of humanity has been about man fighting to make things an equal playing field. There may never be some fantasy land Utopia, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive for it. (much like anything in our lives) We should be learning from history, not repeating it.[/quote]

So what is your answer for government?

You spew out a lot of idealistic bs but reality is that history shows how all the governments progress. There is no utopian government that is going to suddenly appear but we do have a rich human history of what makes better, and worse, governments.

Re: What would it take?
 

Was Trump just doing his best Namath/Kolber imitation? Wtf was that? This is surreal.

Re: What would it take?
 

right now the mall at the inauguration looks empty. Trump may have to change from "record attendees" to "record greenspace" in his inauguration speech.

Re: What would it take?
 

Cred ,Sneed and Punch I agree will all of what you say. Personally I want him to stop the tweeting act, like you belong in the Office ....you represent this country.

Re: What would it take?
 

[url=http://www.cnn.com/]CNN - Breaking News, Latest News and Videos[/url]

just look at that picture on the front of cnn. lol first lady trying to look like Jackie O...Trump looks like he is about to tell someone they are fired. simply amazing folks

Re: What would it take?
 

[quote=Chico23231;1163466][url=http://www.cnn.com/]CNN - Breaking News, Latest News and Videos[/url]

just look at that picture on the front of cnn. lol first lady trying to look like Jackie O...Drumpf looks like he is about to tell someone they are fired. simply amazing folks[/quote]

[IMG]https://s29.postimg.org/lor9f44jr/Untitled_1.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]https://i.ytimg.com/vi/RLwaM-tTiXo/mqdefault.jpg[/IMG]

Whew.

Re: What would it take?
 

My mind is blown watching trump walk into the White House. Jeez wtf acid tripping...this is the same guy that talked dick size during the debates:

[YT]DrSRjGMBNa8[/YT]

Re: What would it take?
 

Pretty striking difference

[url]https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-draws-far-smaller-inaugural-crowd-obama-202245491--politics.html[/url]

Re: What would it take?
 

When did double down become a popular phrase?

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Re: What would it take?
 

Man the entertainment at this inaugural ball is serious weak sauce, it's like getting stuck watching the 49ers v Browns

Re: What would it take?
 

[quote=MTK;1163492]Pretty striking difference

[url]https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-draws-far-smaller-inaugural-crowd-obama-202245491--politics.html[/url][/quote]



Better pic....


[url=http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/comparison-president-trump-and-barack-obamas-inauguration-crowds/]Comparison: Donald Trump and Barack Obama’s inauguration crowds | PBS NewsHour[/url]

Re: What would it take?
 

[QUOTE=MTK;1163505]Man the entertainment at this inaugural ball is serious weak sauce, it's like getting stuck watching the 49ers v Browns[/QUOTE]



Embarrassing!

Re: What would it take?
 

[quote=MTK;1163492]Pretty striking difference

[url]https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-draws-far-smaller-inaugural-crowd-obama-202245491--politics.html[/url][/quote]

Obama drew way more votes than Trump so don't get me wrong, he definitely drew more excitement and hope...

But the weather is the biggest factor here. Sunny vs dreary and rainy.

Same thing happens at Fed Ex.

Re: What would it take?
 

[quote=Schneed10;1163511]Obama drew way more votes than Trump so don't get me wrong, he definitely drew more excitement and hope...

But the weather is the biggest factor here. Sunny vs dreary and rainy.

Same thing happens at Fed Ex.[/quote]

I wouldn't expect you of all people to try to sell me a bullshit story like the weather.

Re: What would it take?
 

This dance is painful to watch, Melania looks like she's being held hostage.

Re: What would it take?
 

Well gosh. I guess our next president should win dancing with stars. First?!? He's the commander in chief not a pop star. I know that's hard for obama fans to grasp since he had the roles reversed in his mind and actions.

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Re: What would it take?
 

He was trying to ride her like a bitch. That's all I'm saying.

Re: What would it take?
 

All I'm saying is who effin cares. That's like when Obama haters mocked his wife. We are adults I think, and its the president and first lady not Fred Astaire or Paula Abdul etc. But whatever.

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Re: What would it take?
 

I thought the bitch part would have given it away as a joke but ok. I can see there's a little sensitivity here when commenting on awkward white people dancing.

Re: What would it take?
 

[QUOTE=MTK;1163539]I thought the bitch part would have given it away as a joke but ok. I can see there's a little sensitivity here when commenting on awkward white people dancing.[/QUOTE]
Lol. Yeah i missed the bitch joke but you hit a home run with "awkward white people dancing"

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Re: What would it take?
 

[quote=MTK;1163492]Pretty striking difference

[url]https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-draws-far-smaller-inaugural-crowd-obama-202245491--politics.html[/url][/quote]

I was listening to wbal on Thursday and someone for the city they were interviewing said they were expecting a bigger turn out for the March on Saturday than inauguration. They said the district filed 250 bus permits for the inauguration but over 1200 for the March.

Re: What would it take?
 

[quote=MTK;1163512]I wouldn't expect you of all people to try to sell me a bullshit story like the weather.[/quote]

Why wouldn't it have an impact??

I can't fathom why anybody would suggest otherwise. There are diehards that would brave any weather, and then there are some that just don't care enough.

I fully acknowledged that Obama drew more votes and was far more inspiring. But really, dismissing weather as a factor at all isn't intellectually honest, we all know seats to ANY event are empty more often on rainy days. Football, baseball, outdoor concerts, everything.