Time to revisit my April post...
 

In April, I suggested that we try and trade Patrick Ramsey while we could still get some value for him. I still feel like it's a good idea, especially at this point. It is very well known that Detroit is looking for a QB... maybe we can ship him off to there for one of their receivers...

I'm sure there are other teams looking for a potential starter, too. (Or at least an experience backup.) He's not the future here, and barring a major injury, it won't be a good sign for the team if he goes into play anyway. (It likely means a losing streak of some magnitude for that to happen...) Even then, I think we're more likely to see Campbell if we really struggle at some point anyway.

I just don't know. It's just my 2 cents and I thought I'd throw it out there for discussion.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

I doubt a deal would happen during the season.

That would really leave us thin at QB.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

It would be nice if they would unload one of those receivers - God knows they need a quaterback. But which one of those 1st rounders would they give us for Ramsey? Rodgers, Roy Williams, Mike Williams.....don't see it happening.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=BigRed]In April, I suggested that we try and trade Patrick Ramsey while we could still get some value for him. I still feel like it's a good idea, especially at this point. It is very well known that Detroit is looking for a QB... maybe we can ship him off to there for one of their receivers...

I'm sure there are other teams looking for a potential starter, too. (Or at least an experience backup.) He's not the future here, and barring a major injury, it won't be a good sign for the team if he goes into play anyway. (It likely means a losing streak of some magnitude for that to happen...) Even then, I think we're more likely to see Campbell if we really struggle at some point anyway.

I just don't know. It's just my 2 cents and I thought I'd throw it out there for discussion.[/QUOTE]

because of the different systems, mid-season QB trades are extremely rare, and its very hard to insert them immediately into the lineup.

plus, detriot will have garcia back in a couple weeks, and he knows that offense extremely well and he's a better QB for them right now.

baltimore, detroit, cleveland and possibly miami will need a QB for next year though.

detroit really needs to upgrade its oline and playcalling though, those are bigger problems than their QB.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=BigRed]In April, I suggested that we try and trade Patrick Ramsey while we could still get some value for him. I still feel like it's a good idea, especially at this point. It is very well known that Detroit is looking for a QB... maybe we can ship him off to there for one of their receivers...

I'm sure there are other teams looking for a potential starter, too. (Or at least an experience backup.) He's not the future here, and barring a major injury, it won't be a good sign for the team if he goes into play anyway. (It likely means a losing streak of some magnitude for that to happen...) Even then, I think we're more likely to see Campbell if we really struggle at some point anyway.

I just don't know. It's just my 2 cents and I thought I'd throw it out there for discussion.[/QUOTE]
I heard a tease on Fox Sports Radio that there was a potential suitor for Ramsey, but the signal faded before I got the story. Detroit would be a good fit for him, if Mooch thinks he can make it work. I doubt they'd be willing to part with one of their top three receivers, though, and I don't see a pressing need for Kevin Johnson on our roster.

Given the loss of Brandon Noble for this season, maybe we should press for a d-lineman? Marcus Bell is a five year veteran DT who is probably 4th in the Lions depth chart, and doesn't suck outright. Either line depth or a draft pick, in my eyes.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

There was a report on NFL channel a few weeks ago(when we benched ramsey) that said the dolphins offered their number 1 this year. 3 or 4th overall!!!!! we really messed that one up...

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=jamf]There was a report on NFL channel a few weeks ago(when we benched ramsey) that said the dolphins offered their number 1 this year. 3 or 4th overall!!!!! we really messed that one up...[/QUOTE]

That offer was made over a year ago after the skins signed Brunell and before the phins traded for AJ Feeley. Ramsey has no where near that kind of value now.

As for a lions trade that would really surprise me since Ramsey has shown not much more promise than Harrington since coming into the league. I would even trade Ramsey for Harrington in hopes that a change of scenery will help both of them. there is no way detroit would trade one of those WR's for Ramsey.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

i agree with celt32, also if you remember the opinion of ramsey sounded out be the nfl after his latest benching seems to have really dropped, potential yea but a real lack of progress and bad choices have hurt his value to us as well as the rest of the league.i still really like him but i wonder if he just needs a change. really hope it works out.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

Nah...I don't see a trade of Ramsey in the works this year. Maybe next year, but I wouldn't be surprised if he isn't back on the team.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

I still dont know why the media hasnt jumped on this. On monday night countdown a reporter came from the skins locker room and said if MB gets hurt PR will finish the game, but if MB is out for any lenght of time J Cambell will get the start. If that isnt enough proof of PR tenure I dont know what is.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

Whether it happens this season or next off-season is inconsequential. Patrick Ramsey has all the trade value that Rod Gardner did after the 2004 season. Everybody knows he's damaged goods, that Gibbs doesn't want him, that he has no future with this team.

That translates to a 5th to 7th round pick in exchange at best.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]I doubt a deal would happen during the season.

That would really leave us thin at QB.[/QUOTE]

Ahh, heck trade him and we can sign 'ol Vinny Testaverde, lol

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=Summo]Ahh, heck trade him and we can sign 'ol Vinny Testaverde, lol[/QUOTE]


Yea, we can give him 43 mil as well. :)


Every scout in the league knows we are running a joke of an offensive scheme, and Patricks demise is a product of the inability of Gibbs to coach offense in today's game, so I believe there are plenty of teams who would love to get their hands on Ramsey, Gus Ferotte is starting in miami, you can't tell me they aren't interested, I do not believe Tampa is sold on there QB situation, You also have the Cardinals, Bears, Detroit, Browns, Ravens, all need an upgrade at QB, if Patrick went on the market I believe we could get decent value, not because Gibbs know's what he has in Ramsey, but because of the competition between potential suiters will drive up his price.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Every scout in the league knows we are running a joke of an offensive scheme, and Patricks demise is a product of the inability of Gibbs to coach offense in today's game, so I believe there are plenty of teams who would love to get their hands on Ramsey, Gus Ferotte is starting in miami, you can't tell me they aren't interested, I do not believe Tampa is sold on there QB situation, You also have the Cardinals, Bears, Detroit, Browns, Ravens, all need an upgrade at QB, if Patrick went on the market I believe we could get decent value, not because Gibbs know's what he has in Ramsey, but because of the competition between potential suiters will drive up his price.[/QUOTE]

heh, but how do you really feel?

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

I think it's hard to say what Ramsey's value would be.

Despite the fact he's been yanked in and out of our lineup, there's also a view out there that he's simply not very good.

Scouts have said that he holds on to the ball too long, he doesn't read defenses all that well, he has problems with accuracy & touch, and he's simply not progressing. Kinda hard to argue with those opinions, we've seen all of that in his 4 years here.

I think a first rounder is definitely out of the question, a 2nd rounder maybe... but more likely a 3rd or lower.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

IMO a trade at this point would be worth about nothing. There's not much faith at all in PR around the NFL, and I would bet that most coaches trust in what Joe Gibbs thinks. It won't suprise me at all to see him gone from the NFL next season for good.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

He's too talented to be out of the league. Somebody will gladly scoop him up.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

There is no way we'd trade him for a 7th rounder. There is no way we'd get a first rounder. There is no way he will be out of the league. In my opinion, Ramsey will command a mid round draft pick or an average starting player if traded next offseason (probably a low 3rd rounder or high fourth rounder).

His trade value is decent because, although he has a lot of problems with touch and holding onto the ball, he still has great talent and the consensus around the league is that his woes in Washington are partly attributable to the lack of stability in D.C.

Ultimately though, we are going to get something for him next offseason because he will not be a Redskin. The writing is on the wall that Gibbs doesn't think that Ramsey is in the team's future ... our future lies in Mark Brunell (for next season) and Jason Campbell beyond that.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

TAFKARF already?

nah i know, sad but true. wonder who will be our 3rd QB next year.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=illdefined]TAFKARF already?

nah i know, sad but true. wonder who will be our 3rd QB next year.[/QUOTE]

I'm going to have to choose between "TAFKAR" or "Warhog."

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]
I think a first rounder is definitely out of the question, a 2nd rounder maybe... but more likely a 3rd or lower.[/QUOTE]


I agree. Ramsey's a good guy and I think he still has a chance to be a heck of a player in this league no matter if it's with the Redskins or not. Though, I think right now, we're still talking about potiential and potiential isn't worth much if it doesn't turn into fact.

I think a 3rd rounder is pretty safe.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

Ramsey blows goats. We'd be lucky to get a 2nd rounder for him.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

I do believe the question has to be asked, why has Ramsey's value plumeted so much in 1 year? We were being offered a high #1 pick when he wasen't available a year ago, now after 1 year with Gibbs he's not worth anything significant? The question is why? What did he do his first 2 years that raised his value, to what happened over the coarse of the past year to lower it? Not only has Gibbs IMO railroaded this kid, he has played this situation so ignorantly that he has just about sucked away any value Patrick would have had in a trade, at least on the surface.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

not trading him early or not starting him after practicing him all off-season is a stumble either way you look at it. Gibbs will recover of course, but its one more thing we've had to overcome.

and yes, at Ramsey's expense. hasn't been fair for the kid being drafted here.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=offiss]I do believe the question has to be asked, why has Ramsey's value plumeted so much in 1 year? [/QUOTE]

Simply that being good enough to start and being a true take charge leader are two different things. I think Ramsey is still good enough to start for us or any team in the league, but he hasn't proven to be a take charge leader like a P. Manning, McNabb, or Farve. I haven't seen any evidence that Patrick is good enough to warrant a trade for a number one pick. If so, great..that's good for us and I'd be happy knowing I was wrong about Ramsey.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

Ramey had value before he played many games because he had POTENTIAL as a young strong armed QB. But then he played enough games for anyone not blinded by burgundy colored glasses to see that he was nothing special at best and a slow, inaccurate INT machine at worst. Gibbs didn't make Ramsey's value plummet, Ramsey did by playing like crap. Teams that were once willing to gamble a higher pick on Ramsey's potential now realize that his actual value is far less. Again, not Gibb's fault, Ramsey's. If you play like a fair-to-middlin' QB, your value is fair-to-middlin'.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

Yeah, like I said....potential doesn't get you anywhere until it turns into fact.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=Balmerskinsfan]Ramey had value before he played many games because he had POTENTIAL as a young strong armed QB. But then he played enough games for anyone not blinded by burgundy colored glasses to see that he was nothing special at best and a slow, inaccurate INT machine at worst. Gibbs didn't make Ramsey's value plummet, Ramsey did by playing like crap. Teams that were once willing to gamble a higher pick on Ramsey's potential now realize that his actual value is far less. Again, not Gibb's fault, Ramsey's. If you play like a fair-to-middlin' QB, your value is fair-to-middlin'.[/QUOTE]

really shouldn't start this again. as 'bad' as Ramsey played last year, Brunell played unequivocally worse.

as for potential, in a working offense in real games, can't prove potential without a chance. a chance he was supposed to get but didn't.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=Balmerskinsfan]Ramey had value before he played many games because he had POTENTIAL as a young strong armed QB. But then he played enough games for anyone not blinded by burgundy colored glasses to see that he was nothing special at best and a slow, inaccurate INT machine at worst. Gibbs didn't make Ramsey's value plummet, Ramsey did by playing like crap. Teams that were once willing to gamble a higher pick on Ramsey's potential now realize that his actual value is far less. Again, not Gibb's fault, Ramsey's. If you play like a fair-to-middlin' QB, your value is fair-to-middlin'.[/QUOTE]

Exactly... I agree, Ramsey has had a part in his stock dropping, let's not kid ourselves.

The knocks on him from earlier in his career still remain. He holds on to the ball too long, he doesn't have great touch, and he still makes too many silly mistakes.

That's not Gibbs' fault.

I still think he has some potential and somebody out there will undoubtedly take a chance on him to see if they can tap in to that potential.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

if it was so plain to see last season and before, why did Gibbs not only hold on to him, but make him a starter and dedicate the off-season to him?

whatever he was worth at the end of last season, he's certainly not worth that now.

that said, can you imagine the luck of having your first NFL coach being a rookie NFL college coach who didn't believe in tight ends? that wasn't his fault. he's had it very raw here.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

No shit idiot, but its rather stupid to assume that because I'm bashing Ramsey I must be all about Brunell, don't you think? The real point is that neither of these players have much value. No one is going to give the skins a first round pick for either of these guys. If you read the posts before mine, someone raised the question what did GIBBS do to decrease Ramsey's value. I was simply stating that Ramseys previously inflated value was due to the feeling that he had POTENTIAL. His subsequent play has proven this perception WRONG. RAMSEY decreased his own value by playing medicore, mistake-ridden football. Gibbs had nothing to do with this.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=Balmerskinsfan]If you read the posts before mine, someone raised the question what did GIBBS do to decrease Ramsey's value.[/QUOTE]

he pulled him after 3 drives, that's what he did to decrease any value he had.
nice language by the way prick.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

3 drives, 0 tds, and how many ints again? Face it, Ramsey has shown himself to be not worth the previous hype. No team in their right mind is going to give up serious value for a guy who plays like a backup QB. This is because he doesn't play particularly well. Whether or not he plays better than Brunell (another mediocre QB) is a separate argument. Look, Ramsey is not good enough to warrant another team giving up a 1st round pick for him, period. Gibbs played him for half a season last year and people saw enough to realize he is not that great. Maybe not a BAD qb, but NOT VERY GOOD. Playing another year of int riddled football would not have suddenly increased his value. And yeah, I thought my language was pretty appropriate given the idiocy of your inital reply.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

Assuming we might be able to get a 2nd rounder or a 3rd rounder for Patrick Ramsey isn't a knock on the guy at all. I think that speaks rather well for him.

I think feeling we deserve a first rounder is being a bit unrealistic, but I'll say it again. If we can get a 1st rounder for him, fine with me, I won't complain.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

don't think anybody would consider the first 3 drives of the season against a fresh, amped Bears defense a reasonable chance. guess that's where we differ.

don't forget last year those INTs came with game winning TDs. with fifty-fifty Gardner and Toeless Coles as his targets. Ramsey singlehandedly made Cooley a star.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

hope wherever he goes it's not in this division, just imagine the chip on his shoulder (and his knowledge of the Skins, he was supposed to be the starter after all)

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=Ramseyfan]I'm going to have to choose between "TAFKAR" or "Warhog."[/QUOTE]

Go with "Warhog"

TAFKAR will just confuse the hell out of me

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=illdefined]don't think anybody would consider the first 3 drives of the season against a fresh, amped Bears defense a reasonable chance. guess that's where we differ.


No, we differ in that you seem to have forgotten about 7 stinky starts last year and an entire stinky preseason this year. Unlike you, other teams in the league havn't forgotten Ramseys past. This is what has decreased his value.

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=TAFKAS]Go with "Warhog"

TAFKAR will just confuse the hell out of me[/QUOTE]


LOL!!!! Warhog would be pretty cool! :headbange

Re: Time to revisit my April post...
 

[QUOTE=Balmerskinsfan]And yeah, I thought my language was pretty appropriate given the idiocy of your inital reply.[/QUOTE]

illdefined knows that I disagree with him on Ramsey. I believe that Ramsey is no better than when last season ended. That even though it's true he only played a quarter and change this season, he had all of minicamps, OTAs, training camp, and preseason to work on his weaknesses-telegraphing passes, reading defenses, forcing plays-and whether he did or not, he just didn't improve on them.

He was given the starter's job and seemed to take it for granted, in my opinion. And, we probably can't afford to have him "learn on the job" during the regular season.

HOWEVER, while I don't agree with illdefined there was nothing idiotic about his post. And no, that language is not appropriate, nor is the personal attack you made on him.