My 1st anti-coaching thread
 

I've been one that's preached 'trust the coaches' all season and that I trusted Gibbs judgment explicitly but today's loss and the last month in general I think it's time to really question some things..

Playcalling-Terrible decisions on offense with the plays.. Too many conservative playcalls. It seems like there are like 8 total plays in the playbook. When I can sit on my couch in Miami and call the plays before they happen an NFL coach can surely predict the same. Too conservative, playing not to lose=losing football. I'm [b]convinced[/b] that this coaching staff is not the right group to get us back to the top. We have better offensive talent than teams scoring 24-31 pts a week but we are not getting it done. That's flat out coaching and execution but it all starts on the sidelines.

Defensive playcalling-Same thing, why did we stop blitzing? 3 & 4 man rushes against an offensive line that was allowing pressure all day when the blitz came? Other than Harris the DBs played exceptionally well for most of the game, why not let them give them a chance to make a play?

Roster decisions-Derrick Frost is awful, worst punter in the league.. Walt Harris has been terrible since October, why is he still playing?? WR depth was a problem coming out of training camp but how can we not have a WR on the practice squad instead of Jimmy Farris who was out of football last week and the #3 WR this week?

Very frustrated and with no #1 pick and up against the cap this offseason I can't say that I'm even looking forward to that anymore..

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Portis is suppose to be making the plays L.T. did today. That is my biggest dissapointment from the coaching staff. They are obviously not using him wisely.

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yeah i have noticed the same thing about the play calling. seems like they only have a hand full of plays in their playbook. It's either run the ball, play action pass roll out to the tightend or shotgun formation and thats it. I like you if we can see it on tv i know the oppenents have to see it by watching the film each week. not to hard to figure us out.

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blitzing let lt break free for the td in reg and the td in ot dumbass

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When a team gets the ball on the enemy 30 and can't get their kicker close enough to win the game, the playcalling is officially shit.

Yes, the execution was poor, but the calls were limp wristed too.

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[QUOTE=RedskinRat]When a team gets the ball on the enemy 30 and can't get their kicker close enough to win the game, the playcalling is officially shit.

Yes, the execution was poor, but the calls were limp wristed too.[/QUOTE]
unfortunately we were 3 yards away and we got a holding penalty not exactly easy to get 13 yards i will take 2nd and 3 any day

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It's not like it's all that different from Gibbs' first run as coach. I mean you knew when they were going to go with the Jumbo offense, or run the counter-tre, or do a bootleg. Not the most extensive playbook, but with a lot of motion and different formations. The key is to execute it well enough that even if they know it's coming they can't stop it. Like Stockton-Malone's pick-and roll

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[QUOTE=Redskin]blitzing let lt break free for the td in reg and the td in ot dumbass[/QUOTE]
I was talking about in obvious passing situations.. Williams stopped coming after Brees which allowed him to convert some 3rd and longs..

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So, I suppose what the key to us winning is to get rid of this coaching staff after two years and once again jump back on the coaching carousel? As long as we keep doing that, this franchise will never have another winning team.

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TAFKAS, it's a different NFL and he cant hold all the talent he had before thanks to the salary cap. There was a time when we had a dominant O line which we simply don't have anymore. I think Gibbs needs to learn to adapt, because whats happening now obviously isn't working.

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I am not ready to say Gibbs should call it quits. I'm taking a wait and see approach. If, after we add a wideout and defensive end in the offseason we still lose, then I'll be ready to turn on Gibbs. Until then, I withhold any comments about the coaching staff.

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[QUOTE=Daseal]TAFKAS, it's a different NFL and he cant hold all the talent he had before thanks to the salary cap. There was a time when we had a dominant O line which we simply don't have anymore. I think Gibbs needs to learn to adapt, because whats happening now obviously isn't working.[/QUOTE]

You're right, it is much harder. But the team is making efforts to adapt. I mean case in point, the shotgun

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you guys act like we are getting destroyed in these games when they are all close down to the wire we have a good team here we are making stupid mistakes

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[QUOTE=Redskin]you guys act like we are getting destroyed in these games when they are all close down to the wire we have a good team here we are making stupid mistakes[/QUOTE]

You are right, it is kind of weird to be acting so negatively when we are loosing these games so closely. Redskins could easly be 9-2 team, just as easy as they could be a 2-9 team.

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It's time for the youth movement on the coaching staff. As much as we all love Joe Gibbs, at this point in his return, he has the exact same record as Steve Spurrier had after 27 games. And Gregg Williams is showing why his stint was so short in Buffalo: he couldn't hold the lead. Let's start anew next year.
We should have two goals for the rest of the season: beat Dallas and see what J. Campbell can do. It can't hurt at this point, when we're a less-than-average team.

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Wow, same record as Steve? Now that is pathetic...

Acutally Gibbs and Steve have some things in common, they both start out very quickly. Didn't Spurrier have a 3 -1 start, and the one loss was very close to a win?

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[QUOTE=Redskin]you guys act like we are getting destroyed in these games when they are all close down to the wire we have a good team here we are making stupid mistakes[/QUOTE]
Call me crazy but I would rather get blown out than lose games like this.. If we get blown out then that shows that our talent level isn't what our opponents is. The way we are losing games, playcalling, turnovers, penalties, means that we are beating ourselves. The coaches have to have some accountablity with that as do the players..

I don't think another coaching turnover is the answer, but I think they need to catch up with today's NFL or we will continue to be mired in the same disappointment that has been our existence for the past 14 years.

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[QUOTE=Paintrain]Call me crazy but I would rather get blown out than lose games like this.. If we get blown out then that shows that our talent level isn't what our opponents is. The way we are losing games, playcalling, turnovers, penalties, means that we are beating ourselves. The coaches have to have some accountablity with that as do the players..

I don't think another coaching turnover is the answer, but I think they need to catch up with today's NFL or we will continue to be mired in the same disappointment that has been our existence for the past 14 years.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, who cares if we stay close. A loss is a loss, and we now have more of those than we have wins. Hell, the Vikings are now ahead of us in the NFC.

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Yep, a new coaching staff every season is definitely the key to success.

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maybe its the coaching staff keeping us close and we dont have great talent you ever think of that paintrain?

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[QUOTE=Bushead]Portis is suppose to be making the plays L.T. did today. That is my biggest dissapointment from the coaching staff. They are obviously not using him wisely.[/QUOTE]

I thought of this driving home today. It's what I've said all along: Portis has been a disappointment. We gave up Champ Bailey and a second round pick for Clinton Portis to do the type of things that L.T. did against us. He hasn't come close. Maybe last year the offensive line wasn't good enough, but with a couple of exceptions, the line is clearly better this time around -- while Portis is just plain average.

He had 3 yards per carry today. And I don't want to hear any crap about the Chargers having a good run-d. The reason we brought Portis in was to beat teams that have a good run-d.

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Every March, who doesn't look at the Redskins and say "wow , they have a bunch of talent! " I mean remeber the linebackers core of Trotter, Armstead, and Arrington. The Redskins have Clinton Portis, Santana Moss, Jansen , Samuels, Thomas, Sean Taylor, Washington, Lavar. I mean the list goes on and on and on. I've heard numerous people over the years talk about each and everyone of them being a GREAT talent.

It just never translates to wins. You have to blame the coaches when that happens. What about the Chicago Bears? Their defense is taking them to the playoffs, unlike the redskins last year.

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We all know what we really need: a new owner.

And that ain't gonna happen. I know Snyder is a big fan, but he really has screwed up this team with all his coaching changes and by meddling in personnel decisions. I know he's been more hands-off lately, but his actions during the first years as owner will take several years to undo.

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I thought this site was for knowledgeable fans not for bad losers.

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If you're referring to my post, I've watched every game since 1972 and have seen too much of the same over the past 10 years. How would you describe going 2-6 in the past eight games?

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[QUOTE=Twilbert07]We all know what we really need: a new owner.

And that ain't gonna happen. I know Snyder is a big fan, but he really has screwed up this team with all his coaching changes and by meddling in personnel decisions. I know he's been more hands-off lately, but his actions during the first years as owner will take several years to undo.[/QUOTE]

Which is it then? You way that the team is screwed up with the coaching changes, but earlier you said it's time for a youth movement on the coaching staff

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[QUOTE=davy]I thought this site was for knowledgeable fans not for bad losers.[/QUOTE]

All opinions are welcome. However, when posts become big and egregious personal attacks, we delete the posts and "observe" the offending poster. People can be disappointed and vent their disappointment. Only when it "crosses the line" do we mods take action.

See, Brunell2Moss.

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I wasn't referring to your post in particular, I'm just tired of all the knee jerk reactions every time we lose a game. Today's loss was not about play calling it was about execution. Their guys made plays when they had to, ours didn't.

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[QUOTE=TAFKAS]Which is it then? You way that the team is screwed up with the coaching changes, but earlier you said it's time for a youth movement on the coaching staff[/QUOTE]
It's this way: I hated all the coaching changes during the past five or six years. Now we have a 65-year-old coach, who, even if he turns it around, will need to be replaced within a couple years. Let's hire someone in their 40s who will bring in a new enthusiasm. Living in Atlanta, I see the Falcons doing just that under Jim Mora, and they go to the playoffs while we go home.

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[QUOTE=Twilbert07]It's this way: I hated all the coaching changes during the past five or six years. Now we have a 65-year-old coach, who, even if he turns it around, will need to be replaced within a couple years. Let's hire someone in their 40s who will bring in a new enthusiasm. Living in Atlanta, I see the Falcons doing just that under Jim Mora, and they go to the playoffs while we go home.[/QUOTE]

Do you think it was a mistake for him to come back in the first place? Just curious

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[QUOTE=Bushead]Every March, who doesn't look at the Redskins and say "wow , they have a bunch of talent! " I mean remeber the linebackers core of Trotter, Armstead, and Arrington. The Redskins have Clinton Portis, Santana Moss, Jansen , Samuels, Thomas, Sean Taylor, Washington, Lavar. I mean the list goes on and on and on. I've heard numerous people over the years talk about each and everyone of them being a GREAT talent.

It just never translates to wins. You have to blame the coaches when that happens. What about the Chicago Bears? Their defense is taking them to the playoffs, unlike the redskins last year.[/QUOTE]

I've tried to understand why all those big names never give us wins, too. Either they're not coached right, or they're just not that good. I know some may disagree and cringe at that remark, but what have they done for us?

Portis is overrated. Santana Moss can't do it all by himself. Sean Taylor is still young, at times too aggressive, and isn't a complete player yet. Marcus Washington is a legitimate star, but like Moss, one star player can't do it alone. LaVar Arrington has a big hit every game or so, but it's never enough.

I think it all starts with both lines. Thomas, Rabach, and Dockery are not dominant interior players. Samuels struggles against top notch defenders, and is otherwise just good enough, but he's no Jim Lachey. Jansen is solid, and he is simply the best player lined up with players who are not as good.

The defensive line is terrible, and will be that way as long as this team continues to neglect it.

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[QUOTE=Beemnseven]
I think it all starts with both lines. Thomas, Rabach, and Dockery are not dominant interior players. Samuels struggles against top notch defenders, and is otherwise just good enough, but he's no Jim Lachey. Jansen is solid, and he is simply the best player lined up with players who are not as good.

The defensive line is terrible, and will be that way as long as this team continues to neglect it.[/QUOTE]

The world is coming to an end, I actually agree with you, Beemnseven. Both lines are missing that extra ingredient for success - with the defensive line being further away from turning it around.

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[QUOTE=TAFKAS]Do you think it was a mistake for him to come back in the first place? Just curious[/QUOTE]

If I could just jump in here, I think the critical mistake started when Snyder kicked out Schottenheimer. With just a few better offensive playmakers, that could have been a playoff year. He just may have had this team on the right track.

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[QUOTE=TAFKAS]Do you think it was a mistake for him to come back in the first place? Just curious[/QUOTE]
Unfortunately, yes, only because there's no real way to improve on what he did during his first tenure. I was excited as hell when it was announced Gibbs was coming back, but it obviously is very tough to come back and win Super Bowls. I hope he can turn it around, and I'll be cheering for the Skins every week regardless.

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[QUOTE=Twilbert07]Unfortunately, yes, only because there's no real way to improve on what he did during his first tenure. I was excited as hell when it was announced Gibbs was coming back, but it obviously is very tough to come back and win Super Bowls. I hope he can turn it around, and I'll be cheering for the Skins every week regardless.[/QUOTE]

We are not a terrible team. We are an average team that played against a great team and got beaten. I'm going to give Gibbs et al more time than Snyder gives most of his coaches.

I too will be cheering for the Skins every week, regardless of their record.

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It does start at the Lines. If you have dominant lines, you can do anything you want. Just looking at the Offensive line though, what could be the problem? I think pass protection has been wonderful, but of course Gibbs has extra blockers everywhere making it hard to judge.

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[QUOTE=Beemnseven]If I could just jump in here, I think the critical mistake started when Snyder kicked out Schottenheimer. With just a few better offensive playmakers, that could have been a playoff year. He just may have had this team on the right track.[/QUOTE]

I love Schott, my favorite coach ever (not named Gibbs) and I think he had things going in the right direction. But I don't think Snyder ever wanted him here. It's almost like he brought him here just to prove that he could.

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[QUOTE=skinsguy]The world is coming to an end, I actually agree with you, Beemnseven. Both lines are missing that extra ingredient for success - with the defensive line being further away from turning it around.[/QUOTE]

I thought this was the year for the offensive line to finally come together. Chris Samuels, an up-and-coming Derrick Dockery, a solid right guard in Randy Thomas alongside Jon Jansen, with the best available center in the free agent market in Casey Rabach -- all blocking for Clinton Portis? I was practically drooling after hearing that lineup.

But it just hasn't happened. Rabach was supposed to be the final piece of the puzzle. Portis was supposed to be making plays like L.T. is making. Gibbs and Bugel were supposed to resurrect the Hogs and call the plays that pound opponents into submission. Nope. It just ain't happenin'.

The D-line on the other hand, well ... let's just say I saw this coming.

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snyder is an intersting fellow

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[QUOTE=Beemnseven]If I could just jump in here, I think the critical mistake started when Snyder kicked out Schottenheimer. With just a few better offensive playmakers, that could have been a playoff year. He just may have had this team on the right track.[/QUOTE]


I do agree. That was a boneheaded move by Synder. However, it's would've, should've, could've. The present situation finds us with Joe Gibbs as our head coach and our team still not being where we would hope they would be at. However, I would worry more about this coaching staff if all of our loses have been by 10 points or more. The fact of the matter is, losing by 2 or 3 points in most of our losses really doesn't tell us much as to if we're closer to being that great team, or if we're just not there yet. Optimistically, I would like to think we're closer to being a good team, but close only counts in horse shoes.