What's wrong with our Red Zone offense?

[KI Skins Fan]

I wanted to start this thread so we could discuss the Skins' Red Zone offense and only the Skins' Red Zone offense because I think that's our primary problem right now.

I'm a fan but I'm no football expert, so I'm hoping that some of the experts here can illuminate what's really going wrong for us in the Red Zone and how it can be fixed.

Would anyone like to take the first shot at it?

[Longtimefan]

Originally Posted by KI Skins Fan

I wanted to start this thread so we could discuss the Skins' Red Zone offense and only the Skins' Red Zone offense because I think that's our primary problem right now.

I'm a fan but I'm no football expert, so I'm hoping that some of the experts here can illuminate what's really going wrong for us in the Red Zone and how it can be fixed.

Would anyone like to take the first shot at it?

Maybe we should drect that question to the coach, and I'm not so sure even he knows. I do know it's a question he's been trying to answer since the midway point of last season, and he's been flooded with since Sunday's game.

[irish]

Originally Posted by KI Skins Fan

I wanted to start this thread so we could discuss the Skins' Red Zone offense and only the Skins' Red Zone offense because I think that's our primary problem right now.

I'm a fan but I'm no football expert, so I'm hoping that some of the experts here can illuminate what's really going wrong for us in the Red Zone and how it can be fixed.

Would anyone like to take the first shot at it?

See Boswell's article in yesterday's Wash Post. It does a pretty good job of answering your question.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by irish

See Boswell's article in yesterday's Wash Post. It does a pretty good job of answering your question.

Boswells' article doesn't answer anything, it's simply a summation of what's happened. No suggestions, no solutions, generalizations. He's a writer, writers write. I'd rather have someone providing suggestions/solutions rather than equating the Skins to the mule vs. a thoroughbred. As a fan of the Skins it's pretty insulting, but that's standard WP fare.

A couple of thoughts on the article:
- As a player who really gives a flying "F" what the fans or media think. All that matters is getting wins and what the coaches & owner thinks.

-From the article: "Get better again?
Actually, the Redskins -- especially Zorn's offense -- haven't improved at all, instead falling backwards since midseason last year. Once again, just as in '08, Zorn's biggest problem is the inability of his offensive coordinator to design plays, then call them appropriately, to score inside the 20-yard line. But Zorn is essentially his own final word on all offensive matters. So why yell at his team until he finishes berating himself?"

This is why the players, coaches and owner shouldn't give a flying "F" what the media thinks, because outside of the better analysts, they know next to nothing about what it takes to execute in a football game and they only speak/write in general terms and make assumptions that are often wrong. The Skins' biggest problem on offense in the second half of 2008 was injuries on the OL (which we only found out the true extent of after the season) not RZ playcalling.

- From the article: "In the most vivid symbol of his frustration, Zorn made as dubious a decision as you'll see, going for it on fourth and one at the Rams 2 with two minutes remaining. The conventional -- some would say "sane" -- reasoning is that you take the easy field goal for a five-point lead and force your foe to go all the way for a touchdown to win. Why get stopped, surrender the ball and risk losing the game on a long field goal -- which statistically is far easier to get than a touchdown in a short amount of time."

Maybe Boswell should read Warpath and get some real statistical analysis on that playcall, which was correct.

- Boswell putting the blame on JC for this???? Yes I understand the % of TD passes stat, but it's not like JC is missing throws consistently. The coaches calling the plays down there have a lot more to do with this stat than any inefficiencies by JC.

- No tall, talented WR. Kelly, Thomas, Mitchell come to mind as being big enough, Zorn needs to find out if they're "talented" enough. Give them a shot at the fades.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

My feelings on whats wrong with the red zone offense are summed up nicely here:

washingtonpost.com

For Jim Zorn, there is always an explanation for why a specific play didn't work, and each day that follows a game during the Redskins' season, he spends time investigating the particulars on every snap...

...During his tenure overseeing the Redskins' offense, Zorn has professed confidence in his ability as a play-caller, even though he had never held the job in the NFL before Washington hired him from the Seattle Seahawks, where he had served as quarterbacks coach under offensive whiz Mike Holmgren.

Zorn's dellusional. He thinks he's a good play-caller, when he's not.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

My feelings on whats wrong with the red zone offense are summed up nicely here:

washingtonpost.com



Zorn's dellusional. He thinks he's a good play-caller, when he's not.

You don't have four drives of 13+ plays and one of 9 plays and convert 46% of 3rd downs by being a bad playcaller.

This quote in the article is the most important, "
"We have to pay attention to the detail of the work," Zorn said. "That is what it's going to take for us to continue to improve."

Zorn must look at his calls in the RZ and make the adjustments. Zorn must do his part to put the players in the right position to be successful and not be afraid to let them be successful...or fail.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

My feelings on whats wrong with the red zone offense are summed up nicely here:

washingtonpost.com



Zorn's dellusional. He thinks he's a good play-caller, when he's not.

If Sellers could catch the damn ball, Zorn looks like a much better play caller.

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by Lotus

If Sellers could catch the damn ball, Zorn looks like a much better play caller.

By how much though? If you take away one field goal and replace with a TD and extra point we score 13 points. If I remember correctly we had 5 red zone trips. At the very least we should have had 27 points.

[Skinz4Lyfe]

Originally Posted by Lotus

If Sellers could catch the damn ball, Zorn looks like a much better play caller.

I wouldn't fully blame sellers on that play, JC continues to rocket the ball in any situation. Wheres the touch on the ball?

[MTK]

Bad play calling, bad execution. There's no simple answer.

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Bad play calling, bad execution. There's no simple answer.

I'll add bad personnel groupings. How have we gone 2 games and not once used Kelly, Thomas, Mitchell, Cooley & Davis as a RZ package? When we trot 3 TE out there that gives away that we're going to run the ball.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

I'll add bad personnel groupings. How have we gone 2 games and not once used Kelly, Thomas, Mitchell, Cooley & Davis as a RZ package? When we trot 3 TE out there that gives away that we're going to run the ball.

Yeah no doubt. Get all those big targets on the field at once and take your best shot. We have the horses, for whatever reason they're not being used.

[roth74va]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Yeah no doubt. Get all those big targets on the field at once and take your best shot. We have the horses, for whatever reason they're not being used.

Im tired of seeing two TE's and Moss split wide at the 5 yard line. Why did we get these big receivers if we arent gonna use them? The fact that we cannot run right sure hurts when we get down there as well. Zorn is the biggest problem IMO, but he is too busy defending his calling a RB pass from the 7 yard line.....what a dumbass!

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by roth74va

Im tired of seeing two TE's and Moss split wide at the 5 yard line. Why did we get these big receivers if we arent gonna use them? The fact that we cannot run right sure hurts when we get down there as well. Zorn is the biggest problem IMO, but he is too busy defending his calling a RB pass from the 7 yard line.....what a dumbass!

He's too busy thinking...

It seems we also call a lot of plays, on both sides of the ball, that require far too much exact execution, to succeed. Maybe it isn't reasonable to expect 100% proper technique and execution play after play. Maybe working some plays/schemes in there that allow a little more wiggle room could help. Like I don't know, roll the f*cking QB out once in a while to give the play time to develop. Stop being a slave to the WC theory...or whatever theory.

[dmvskinzfan08]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Yeah no doubt. Get all those big targets on the field at once and take your best shot. We have the horses, for whatever reason they're not being used.

I agree. We were longing for some tall receivers for the redzone for years. Now that we have them we dont use them. Doesn't make any sense. We have 3 receivers over 6'2. 2 Good tight ends. I just dont get it. But I am not a coach. Hopefully Zorn figures it out. But Gibbs couldn't even figure it out. But we do need our O-line to make some holes down there.