Local Pro Day (VATech/UMD); Looking for comments on these guys:

[That Guy]

NFL | J. Hamilton works out at Pro Day
Sat, 25 Mar 2006 19:19:11 -0800

Gil Brandt, of NFL.com, reports Virginia Tech S Justin Hamilton measured a height of 6-2 1/2 and a weight of 218 pounds at his Pro Day. He ran the 40-yard dash with times of 4.54 seconds and 4.52 seconds while finishing the short shuttle in 4.04 seconds and the three-cone drill in 6.66 seconds. He measured a 42 1/2-inch vertical jump and a 10-foot-6 broad jump while completing 19 repetitions on the 225-pound bench press.

NFL | W. Montgomery works out at Pro Day
Sat, 25 Mar 2006 19:14:32 -0800

Gil Brandt, of NFL.com, reports Virginia Tech OL Will Montgomery measured a height of 6-3 and a weight of 308 pounds at his Pro Day. He ran the 40-yard dash with times of 4.99 seconds and 4.98 seconds while finishing the short shuttle in 4.46 seconds and the three-cone drill in 7.30 seconds. He measured a 26 1/2-inch vertical jump and an 8-foot-4 broad jump, but stood on his bench press numbers from the NFL Combine.

NFL | G. McPhearson works out at Pro Day
Sat, 25 Mar 2006 20:06:19 -0800

Gil Brandt, of NFL.com, reports Maryland CB Gerrick McPhearson measured a weight of 197 pounds and ran the 40-yard dash with times of 4.38 seconds and 4.35 seconds at his Pro Day. He stood on his vertical jump, long shuttle, and bench numbers from the NFL Combine. McPherson ran the short shuttle in 4.07 seconds, the long shuttle in 10.94 seconds, and the three-cone drill in 6.65 seconds.



All three of these guys put up somewhat crazy numbers, and all will be low picks.

J Hamilton - probably undrafted, but could go in the 7th, never paid attention to him, but VA Tech, so if someone actually has a good read on if he sucks or not, i'd like to hear it. If he goes undrafted, he's got better numbers than sean taylor did, with a fast stop/start and would definately be worth a look.

Will Montgomery - C/OG prospect, late rounds (6-7), very athletic and probably the best OL value in the very late rounds. Fast enough that he could do spot work as a blocking TE immediately.

G McPherson - CB (near the 4th round) no one lives and dies by the 40 time as much as a CB. This guy has great shuttle and three cone times as well (same as tye hill) and a 41" vert. That means he should be able to get in position for a lot of picks or pass defenses and recover from double moves well.

After looking through the top CB picks times, I noticed Jonathan Joseph is 2/10ths slower on his shuttle and 3/10ths slower on his triangle than a guy with 4.3 speed should be, which raises some doubts for when he'll need to cover cuts instead of fly routes.

If anyone has watched these guys play for more than a few minutes (JH especially, but WM, GM, and J Joseph as well), I'd like to hear your comments on them.

[Big C]

justin hamilton. seen this guy play a lot. he is not nfl quality. he was a mediocre tailback/wr for most of his career, then switched to safety his senior season. he gives it his all, but hes not real good.

[That Guy]

wow, hamilton's stats suck.

2005 - 35 tackles (15 solo (YIKES)), 3 tackles for loss, 4 PD, 3ints (60yards) as a Safety (nonstarter - i hope)
2004 - 340yards rushing, 3TD, and 34 yards receiving as a RB (nonstarter)
2003 - 282yards 1td as a WR (nonstater)

his measurement numbers are REALLY good, but looks like the guy just can't play. UMD tried moving him around all over the place because of how althletic he was, but he just never stuck (at least, that's what the stats tell).

We saw the same type of thing last year trying to find A. Brown a home, but the guy is straight track and field, not NFL.

[dmek25]

sounds like the mike mumala thing.great workout guy but cant play

[Big C]

in fairness to hamilton when he was a hb, we have done a rb by committie here with imoh, hamilton, and humes so none of them put up great numbers, but together they were good.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by Big C

in fairness to hamilton when he was a hb, we have done a rb by committie here with imoh, hamilton, and humes so none of them put up great numbers, but together they were good.

Thanks for this post BIG C!
I'm a Hokie so I'm biased, but you have to look at JH's other upsides in addition to his workout. He's a total team guy & very well spoken. He played at WR, then HB (his high school position), then moved to safety his senior year and started. To start on a solid defense after never playing on D in one year is pretty impressive. And his stats don't suck, free safeties don't always rack up big tackle #s, especially in VT's defense. He showed a lot of discipline & was rarely caught out of position, especially on long balls. NO he's not the second coming of ST, but who is?
He never complained about his playing time for 3 years & was willing to move to free safety as a senior. The coaching staff said he's such a good athlete that they were confident they could move him into the position & start him w/no game experience. Total team player, would be a great late round pickup as he'll get better quickly. I could see him as a nickel for us & back up at free safety.
Will Montgomery is a solid guy who I'm surprised is projected that low, I thought he was 4th/5th rnd. material. If he's available late, he's exactly what we need - a backup OL who plays a couple positions.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

Thanks for this post BIG C!
I'm a Hokie so I'm biased, but you have to look at JH's other upsides in addition to his workout. He's a total team guy & very well spoken. He played at WR, then HB (his high school position), then moved to safety his senior year and started. To start on a solid defense after never playing on D in one year is pretty impressive. And his stats don't suck, free safeties don't always rack up big tackle #s, especially in VT's defense. He showed a lot of discipline & was rarely caught out of position, especially on long balls. NO he's not the second coming of ST, but who is?
He never complained about his playing time for 3 years & was willing to move to free safety as a senior. The coaching staff said he's such a good athlete that they were confident they could move him into the position & start him w/no game experience. Total team player, would be a great late round pickup as he'll get better quickly. I could see him as a nickel for us & back up at free safety.

except his stats really do suck FS generally DO rack up tackles, and 15 solo tackles is next to nothing. most starters have at least 60, and some have up to 100 solo tackles. He really didn't have much leverage in complaining either cause his production wouldn't have won him any points.

might be worth camp scrub status if undrafted, but with his measureables, he should have been much more productive.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by That Guy

except his stats really do suck FS generally DO rack up tackles, and 15 solo tackles is next to nothing. most starters have at least 60, and some have up to 100 solo tackles. He really didn't have much leverage in complaining either cause his production wouldn't have won him any points.

might be worth camp scrub status if undrafted, but with his measureables, he should have been much more productive.

Not on some good defenses they don't, the exception is in defensive schemes that use the FS to blitz or play in the box, which VT doesn't do much w/the free saftey. The other factor is that VT blew some teams out early last year and was able to rest starters, Hamilton included. My point is the stats won't dictate his draft status, only the quality will, e.g. if on tape he's a poor tackler. I'll concede that its not his strong point, but its a matter of form - he didn't miss many.
Tackles can be a seriously misleading stat. If your defense is on the field a lot & getting beaten everybody will log more tackles. If you play FS & your D gets beat in the passing game a lot you'll get more tackles. On the other hand, if you force a lot of 3 & outs & your O controls clock, everybody will get fewer tackles on your D.
So that's 60 solo tackes in how many games?

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

Not on some good defenses they don't, the exception is in defensive schemes that use the FS to blitz or play in the box, which VT doesn't do much w/the free saftey. The other factor is that VT blew some teams out early last year and was able to rest starters, Hamilton included. My point is the stats won't dictate his draft status, only the quality will, e.g. if on tape he's a poor tackler. I'll concede that its not his strong point, but its a matter of form - he didn't miss many.
Tackles can be a seriously misleading stat. If your defense is on the field a lot & getting beaten everybody will log more tackles. If you play FS & your D gets beat in the passing game a lot you'll get more tackles. On the other hand, if you force a lot of 3 & outs & your O controls clock, everybody will get fewer tackles on your D.
So that's 60 solo tackes in how many games?

generally 11 games. with 3 and outs, your DBs still get more PDs though.

[That Guy]

he might get drafted on those workout numbers alone. he's projected right around the wrong edge of the 7th round as of now.

[Big C]

hamilton wasnt really a starting FS. he was in on some packages. parker and rouse were our starting safeties

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by Big C

hamilton wasnt really a starting FS. he was in on some packages. parker and rouse were our starting safeties

thats what i figured.

[freddyg12]

hamilton started 6 games, parker 5
Hamilton started at the end of the season w/one exception as he was hurt
he was also coming off an inury at the beginning of 05 when parker started

[Big C]

seemed to me that parker saw more field time tho

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by Big C

seemed to me that parker saw more field time tho

As I recall Parker was getting a lot of playing time in a couple of positions. I think they used him as a nickel & back up corner later in the season.
Anyway, Hamilton doesn't seem to have great football instincts but that could be in part due to his learning a position in 1 season. Give him some time & he's definitely smart & athletic enough to develop. Would be great for us as a special teamer too as he's played a lot in that role. He's worth a 6th or 7th rnd pick.