Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes

JWsleep · 07-30-2007, 06:01 PM

I found this interesting, from Ryan O'Halloran at the Times. Turns out, CR wasn't so bad, if you buy the stats here. Still, he dropped a mad number of potential INTs, no doubt:

Clarifying Carlos' campaign [Ryan O'Halloran]

Today, I wrote a story on Redskins cornerback Carlos Rogers' second season. I included a couple stats from the Pro Football Prospectus.

A few minutes ago, I got off the phone with the PFP's editor, Aaron Schatz, who at my request explained some of Rogers' stats from 2006.

The bottom line: Rogers wasn't as bad as some might think.

"It was a fine, reasonable season by a second-year corner," Schatz said. "Not everybody can be Pacman Jones and turn into Superman in two seasons ... The problems for Washington was the amount of injuries, the lack of a pass rush, Shawn Springs' injury and that the third cornerback (Kenny Wright) was terrible and the fourth cornerback (Mike Rumph) made you want to slit your wrists."

Rogers ranked 25th among cornerbacks with 36 "stops," which come from the play-by-play books distributed by each team. A stop is any play that prevents the offense from a successful play - 45 percent of the yards on first down, 60 percent of the yards on second down and 100 percent of the yards on third/fourth down. It refers to tackles, interceptions, passes defended and sacks. It does not include a play, for example, on which Rogers had good coverage on a receiver, forcing the quarterback to intentionally overthrow or throw away.

Rogers' breakdown was 10 running "stops" and 26 passing "stops."

Schatz said Denver cornerback Champ Bailey was first in stops with 53.

Rogers was targeted (thrown at) 103 times, or 25 percent of all opponent's passing plays. That ranked fourth in the league, behind only Fred Thomas, Charles Tillman and Anthony Henry.

"I don't know if that was people picking on him or that on the entire pass defense, he was the only one to stay healthy most of the time and play most of the time," Schatz said.

Schatz added, "He was middle-of-the-road in terms of our success rate stat and a little better on yards per completion (6.9). But Washington had so many problems on defense, particularly on third down, teams didn't need to throw as long downfield."

Compared to the two cornerbacks drafted ahead of him in 2005 - Arizona's Antrel Rolle and Tennessee's Jones, Schatz said Rogers trails slightly. Rolle had 39 stops and was targeted 100 times, allowed 6.3 yards per reception and had one interception; Jones had 36 stops, was targeted 69 times, allowed 5.4 yards per reception and had four interceptions.

The Washington Times, America's Newspaper

wilsowilso · 07-30-2007, 06:15 PM

Rogers was top five in the NFL in passes defended. If I'm not mistaken top three. That is a good thing. He has all the tools and nobody ever accused him of not working hard so I think he will be ok.

jamf · 07-30-2007, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilsowilso

Rogers was top five in the NFL in passes defended. If I'm not mistaken top three. That is a good thing. He has all the tools and nobody ever accused him of not working hard so I think he will be ok.

Actually Springs, Prieloue(How ever you spell it) and Vincent said that he wasn't the hardest worker and never took advice from the vets.

Hopefully with smooty breathing down his neck, He will take more time learning how to play.

BigSKINBauer · 07-30-2007, 06:26 PM

yeah, a similar discussion came up in the never ending thread. THe fact of the matter is, he is going to get 'stops' if he is thrown at so many times. Rolle had a few more stops on a couple less passes. That means rolle did better. Pacman had had the same amount of stops but had a shit less passes his way. Change the number around--- passes given up, i am sure that moves adam around in the league rankings. Now obviously some people don't even play enough to get the amount of passes thrown to as him. A percentage of stops vs passes to is what we need. THat is the true ranking. Then interceptions come in after but they are huge too and we all know rogers couldn't catch a cold.

FRPLG · 07-30-2007, 06:38 PM

I have said it in other threads. CR was de cent last year. Everyone focuses on the dropped INTs but at the end of the day those plays only account for a small percentage of plays. Otherwise he didn't get torched every other play. Some people seem to think he was horrible when I'd say he was better than average for our defense last year. It also doesn't account for how poorly we played our CBs last year. They had to cushion 10 yards most plays because our line was so bad.

wolfeskins · 07-30-2007, 06:49 PM

i think he's better then some people give him credit for and i think he'll have a pretty good season this year now that the entire defense has been improved.

SmootSmack · 07-30-2007, 06:49 PM

He still needs to catch those interceptions though. If you hit the rim in basketball on 10 3-pointers bottom line is you missed 30 points. If you launch 10 flyballs that are caught at the warning track, bottom line is you were out 8 times.

So anyway, bottom line...he needs to catch the ball. Otherwise he's great.

wolfeskins · 07-30-2007, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

He still needs to catch those interceptions though. If you hit the rim in basketball on 10 3-pointers bottom line is you missed 30 points. If you launch 10 flyballs that are caught at the warning track, bottom line is you were out 8 times.

So anyway, bottom line...he needs to catch the ball. Otherwise he's great.

i definately agree he needs to hang on to those interceptions.

hooskins · 07-30-2007, 06:52 PM

Where is Hess and her haterade now?

wilsowilso · 07-30-2007, 06:57 PM

One other thing about Rogers I remember was that when he was drafted the rundown on his college career went like this. Had so much talent that he made it on the field as an underclassman, but didn't really figure the game out until a few years later when he began dominating in the SEC. Maybe it just takes him a few years.

djnemo65 · 07-30-2007, 08:08 PM

The problem I had with Rogers was not his ability but his attitude and unwillingness to take responsibility for failures on the field. I hope Springs is finally getting through to him because he has the tools to be something special.

firstdown · 07-31-2007, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djnemo65

The problem I had with Rogers was not his ability but his attitude and unwillingness to take responsibility for failures on the field. I hope Springs is finally getting through to him because he has the tools to be something special.

Not sure that he did not take responsibility for failures on the field or rather he had a short memory. If a corner starts dwelling on the plays they get beat then its not long until they loose confidence i their ability. I just hope that they have him doing some catching drills with the WR coach so he can hang on to a few of those balls he droped last year.

Crat92 · 07-30-2007, 08:27 PM

Hope he doesn't play 10 yards off the reciever as much this year!

Daseal · 07-31-2007, 02:49 PM

Right on, firstdown. If a cornerback doesn't have a ton of confidence, I don't want him on my team. CB is one of the hardest positions in football (in my opinion, 2nd behind QB) and he's still a young guy. You need to have a CB that can get beat, and still talk trash because he knows he won't make that mistake again. The CB who gets down or acts like the guy owned him is the guy that worries me.

Rogers was in position for a good amount of INTs last year, that's more than I can say for anyone else on the team.

NYCSkin · 08-01-2007, 12:37 AM

"Going against the fastest guy in the league and running [cover-0] and you don't get there [with the blitz], there's nothing you can do about it," Rogers said. "The only thing I can do is line up and play the call that's being made and try to execute to the best of my ability. He's a fast guy, and there ain't too much I can do."
That's Carlos after last year's Tampa game talking about the TD he gave up to Joey Galloway. Sound like the type of cornerback you want starting for your team???

07-30-2007, 06:01 PM	#1
JWsleep Propane and propane accessories Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Houston, TX Age: 55 Posts: 4,717	Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes I found this interesting, from Ryan O'Halloran at the Times. Turns out, CR wasn't so bad, if you buy the stats here. Still, he dropped a mad number of potential INTs, no doubt: Clarifying Carlos' campaign [Ryan O'Halloran] Today, I wrote a story on Redskins cornerback Carlos Rogers' second season. I included a couple stats from the Pro Football Prospectus. A few minutes ago, I got off the phone with the PFP's editor, Aaron Schatz, who at my request explained some of Rogers' stats from 2006. The bottom line: Rogers wasn't as bad as some might think. "It was a fine, reasonable season by a second-year corner," Schatz said. "Not everybody can be Pacman Jones and turn into Superman in two seasons ... The problems for Washington was the amount of injuries, the lack of a pass rush, Shawn Springs' injury and that the third cornerback (Kenny Wright) was terrible and the fourth cornerback (Mike Rumph) made you want to slit your wrists." Rogers ranked 25th among cornerbacks with 36 "stops," which come from the play-by-play books distributed by each team. A stop is any play that prevents the offense from a successful play - 45 percent of the yards on first down, 60 percent of the yards on second down and 100 percent of the yards on third/fourth down. It refers to tackles, interceptions, passes defended and sacks. It does not include a play, for example, on which Rogers had good coverage on a receiver, forcing the quarterback to intentionally overthrow or throw away. Rogers' breakdown was 10 running "stops" and 26 passing "stops." Schatz said Denver cornerback Champ Bailey was first in stops with 53. Rogers was targeted (thrown at) 103 times, or 25 percent of all opponent's passing plays. That ranked fourth in the league, behind only Fred Thomas, Charles Tillman and Anthony Henry. "I don't know if that was people picking on him or that on the entire pass defense, he was the only one to stay healthy most of the time and play most of the time," Schatz said. Schatz added, "He was middle-of-the-road in terms of our success rate stat and a little better on yards per completion (6.9). But Washington had so many problems on defense, particularly on third down, teams didn't need to throw as long downfield." Compared to the two cornerbacks drafted ahead of him in 2005 - Arizona's Antrel Rolle and Tennessee's Jones, Schatz said Rogers trails slightly. Rolle had 39 stops and was targeted 100 times, allowed 6.3 yards per reception and had one interception; Jones had 36 stops, was targeted 69 times, allowed 5.4 yards per reception and had four interceptions. The Washington Times, America's Newspaper __________________ Hail from Houston!

07-30-2007, 06:15 PM	#2
wilsowilso Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Los Angeles Age: 51 Posts: 2,841	Re: Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes Rogers was top five in the NFL in passes defended. If I'm not mistaken top three. That is a good thing. He has all the tools and nobody ever accused him of not working hard so I think he will be ok.

07-30-2007, 06:26 PM	#4
BigSKINBauer Pro Bowl Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Washington, DC Age: 36 Posts: 5,688	Re: Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes yeah, a similar discussion came up in the never ending thread. THe fact of the matter is, he is going to get 'stops' if he is thrown at so many times. Rolle had a few more stops on a couple less passes. That means rolle did better. Pacman had had the same amount of stops but had a shit less passes his way. Change the number around--- passes given up, i am sure that moves adam around in the league rankings. Now obviously some people don't even play enough to get the amount of passes thrown to as him. A percentage of stops vs passes to is what we need. THat is the true ranking. Then interceptions come in after but they are huge too and we all know rogers couldn't catch a cold.

07-30-2007, 06:38 PM	#5
FRPLG MVP Join Date: May 2004 Age: 46 Posts: 10,164	Re: Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes I have said it in other threads. CR was de cent last year. Everyone focuses on the dropped INTs but at the end of the day those plays only account for a small percentage of plays. Otherwise he didn't get torched every other play. Some people seem to think he was horrible when I'd say he was better than average for our defense last year. It also doesn't account for how poorly we played our CBs last year. They had to cushion 10 yards most plays because our line was so bad.

07-30-2007, 06:49 PM	#6
wolfeskins The Starter Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: chesapeake,va. Posts: 2,160	Re: Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes i think he's better then some people give him credit for and i think he'll have a pretty good season this year now that the entire defense has been improved. __________________ Hail to Allen/Shanahan .... bring in some baby hogs and load up on diesel fuel !!! (budw38)

07-30-2007, 06:49 PM	#7
SmootSmack Uncle Phil Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 45,256	Re: Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes He still needs to catch those interceptions though. If you hit the rim in basketball on 10 3-pointers bottom line is you missed 30 points. If you launch 10 flyballs that are caught at the warning track, bottom line is you were out 8 times. So anyway, bottom line...he needs to catch the ball. Otherwise he's great. __________________ You're So Vain...You Probably Think This Sig Is About You

07-30-2007, 06:52 PM	#9
hooskins Most Interesting Man in the World Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Chantilly, VA Age: 37 Posts: 8,606	Re: Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes Where is Hess and her haterade now? __________________ Vacancy

07-30-2007, 06:57 PM	#10
wilsowilso Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Los Angeles Age: 51 Posts: 2,841	Re: Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes One other thing about Rogers I remember was that when he was drafted the rundown on his college career went like this. Had so much talent that he made it on the field as an underclassman, but didn't really figure the game out until a few years later when he began dominating in the SEC. Maybe it just takes him a few years.

07-30-2007, 08:08 PM	#11
djnemo65 Playmaker Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,836	Re: Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes The problem I had with Rogers was not his ability but his attitude and unwillingness to take responsibility for failures on the field. I hope Springs is finally getting through to him because he has the tools to be something special.

07-30-2007, 08:27 PM	#13
Crat92 Special Teams Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Nashville,TN Age: 51 Posts: 474	Re: Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes Hope he doesn't play 10 yards off the reciever as much this year! __________________ BEWARE THE MIDDLE............LaRON LANDRY IS LURKING!

07-31-2007, 02:49 PM	#14
Daseal Puppy Kicker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Arlington, Virginia Age: 41 Posts: 8,341	Re: Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes Right on, firstdown. If a cornerback doesn't have a ton of confidence, I don't want him on my team. CB is one of the hardest positions in football (in my opinion, 2nd behind QB) and he's still a young guy. You need to have a CB that can get beat, and still talk trash because he knows he won't make that mistake again. The CB who gets down or acts like the guy owned him is the guy that worries me. Rogers was in position for a good amount of INTs last year, that's more than I can say for anyone else on the team. __________________ Best. Player. Available.

08-01-2007, 12:37 AM	#15
NYCSkin Impact Rookie Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: San Diego, CA Age: 53 Posts: 513	Re: Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes "Going against the fastest guy in the league and running [cover-0] and you don't get there [with the blitz], there's nothing you can do about it," Rogers said. "The only thing I can do is line up and play the call that's being made and try to execute to the best of my ability. He's a fast guy, and there ain't too much I can do." That's Carlos after last year's Tampa game talking about the TD he gave up to Joey Galloway. Sound like the type of cornerback you want starting for your team???

Interesting Breakdown of Carlos Rogers' 2nd year--WashTimes

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