Redskins Free Agent Contracts vs. League

[SKINSnCANES]

So this is a topic that has been discussed in probably every thread recently in some capacity, but I want to address it on its own.

Recently there is a lot of discussion on how everyone is glad we arent over paying, talking about how normally its us that gives out big deals, etc. But I was thinking back to all the deals we made, and really they dont seem that big.

We have Clinton Portis a 50 million dollar contract, that really wasnt that long ago ya know. There have been dozens of threads over the years saying how we paid him so much money, and gave up a pick, etc. My point is though, 50 million seems cheap now.

Turner got 35 million after being a backup, Lamont Jordon got a big pay day as a back up. Jevon Walker just got over 50 million. All the offensive linemen are getting atleast 30 million. Nate Clemons got over 80 million.

The last few years salaries have skyrocketed. If I could poll on this, I would ask if you think Dan Snyder is to blame for the high salaries of today?

He really started this trend of big spending to bring in guys.

If you look at all the guys we signed, like Springs, Washington, Moss, Randle El, even llyod, which were all in recent years, and look at the market the last two years, we really didnt overpay at all. Jevon Walker was hurt and got over 50 million!

Weve been an easy target for many years when it comes to free agency, even though we always have no problem staying under the cap. Remember when Gibbs had those conferences saying that we are paying to bring top young talent, and if you wait a few years youll see that we are getting a great deal and saving money? I think Gibbs was dead on. All those guys we overpaid for are really bargins right now, and for whatever reasons Redskins more than anyone else constantly rework contracts to help the team out. Dan made his mistakes the first couple years with the older guys that got big money, but recently I think his been doing well with signing, I still wish we grew through the draft a lot more, but I like that we have gone after what was considered top young talent to fill needs so we can draft best available instead of need.

So what do you guys think, here are the questions I posted:

Do you think the Redskins are to blame for the new high salaries?
Do you think our recent high priced players turned out to be value, instead of over paying?
Do you think its best to fill all needs via free agency, so at the draft you always pick best available and arent handicapped by any needs?

[MTK]

-The Skins definitely aren't to blame for what's going on now. The rise in the cap is what's to blame.

-Some of the contracts we have now certainly don't look that bad compared to what's currently being dished out.

-I think you still have to strike a balance between filling needs in free agency and the draft. The draft is great for filling your roster with cheap young depth.

[SKINSnCANES]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

-The Skins definitely aren't to blame for what's going on now. The rise in the cap is what's to blame.

-Some of the contracts we have now certainly don't look that bad compared to what's currently being dished out.

-I think you still have to strike a balance between filling needs in free agency and the draft. The draft is great for filling your roster with cheap young depth.

yea that new Direct TV contract helped bump the cap up a ton, it probably also saved us from being in cap hell, somethign Im sure Snyder took into account when he made the contracts

[MTK]

Originally Posted by SKINSnCANES

yea that new Direct TV contract helped bump the cap up a ton, it probably also saved us from being in cap hell, somethign Im sure Snyder took into account when he made the contracts

Yeah the Skins have a rolling 3 year plan when it comes to the cap, so they are always aware of cap implications down the road.

[BleedBurgundy]

Originally Posted by SKINSnCANES

Do you think the Redskins are to blame for the new high salaries?
Do you think our recent high priced players turned out to be value, instead of over paying?
Do you think its best to fill all needs via free agency, so at the draft you always pick best available and arent handicapped by any needs?

I think it would be somewhat naive to think that DS's early bouts of free spending didn't have at least some effect on the current contracts being paid out. The skins raised the bar when it came to what a FA could expect, not to mention that for a few years every agent used the Skins as leverage to get bigger and better contracts.

I think that some of our high-priced players have turned out well, others obviously not so much. I believe that when you look back with a broader frame of reference that our free agent signings have been less ludicrous than they initially appeared, but only because of the continually sliding scale.

Best way to build is through the draft and fill one or two glaring needs through Free Agency only if a good fit is available. Reaching and overspending is almost always catastrophic.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

I think it would be somewhat naive to think that DS's early bouts of free spending didn't have at least some effect on the current contracts being paid out. The skins raised the bar when it came to what a FA could expect, not to mention that for a few years every agent used the Skins as leverage to get bigger and better contracts.

I think that some of our high-priced players have turned out well, others obviously not so much. I believe that when you look back with a broader frame of reference that our free agent signings have been less ludicrous than they initially appeared, but only because of the continually sliding scale.

Best way to build is through the draft and fill one or two glaring needs through Free Agency only if a good fit is available. Reaching and overspending is almost always catastrophic.

But at the same time shouldn't teams have learned a thing or two from watching the Redskins swing and miss on several guys? The Skins were trail blazers when it came to aggressively attacking the FA market and giving up picks for RFA's, but it wasn't exactly a huge success but here we are seeing contracts going through the roof while the Skins are sitting back and watching.

[hooskins]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

I think it would be somewhat naive to think that DS's early bouts of free spending didn't have at least some effect on the current contracts being paid out. The skins raised the bar when it came to what a FA could expect, not to mention that for a few years every agent used the Skins as leverage to get bigger and better contracts.

I think that some of our high-priced players have turned out well, others obviously not so much. I believe that when you look back with a broader frame of reference that our free agent signings have been less ludicrous than they initially appeared, but only because of the continually sliding scale.

Best way to build is through the draft and fill one or two glaring needs through Free Agency only if a good fit is available. Reaching and overspending is almost always catastrophic.

Well you could spin that back around, and say DS gave out huge contracts in anticipation of an increase of the cap by owners. he projected it and saw that renegotiations could be done to get big name players in, without killing us cap-wise. The rest of the league did not make such moves in the past, and is now doing.

[BeastsoftheNFCeast]

I think there are some things being overlooked here, the fact that these huge contracts that are being signed today are huge now, but 3 years down the road they won't be due to the rising salary cap, so thinking along those lines, you can't ever overpay players. Also its not just the amount we paid, but it's also the quality of the player that we got, arch? Lloyd? Randle El? None of these guys could get the contracts that we gave them even if they hit the market today. Smoot got a contract about the same size as the others, and nobody has complained about it because he has preformed well so far. Also, some of the contracts being given out are just plain stupid, just because some other teams are being stupid doesn't mean that we're not, I mean seriously, Javon Walker 55 mil? Hes getting more money than Moss, that's not the market, it's just the raiders being dumb

[FRPLG]

This has been part of what has driven me crazy. Before the new CBA everyone was talking about how our team was going to have to field 20 rookies to make the cap work and everything when it was totally ignored that our contracts were designed to take advantage of the fact that the cap was going to clearly jump a bunch in a new CBA. Those contracts now seem very reasonable when measured in the proper context.

[SKINSnCANES]

I wonder how many agents/players are in a meeting trying to get a contract and go, 'Man, Synder paid him 35 million and he didnt do shit, youre getting a better player in me, now pay me the money'

its probably good we dont get big players this year, if anything so internally we dont have to pay our performing players more than the expensive ones that dont perform. For years Renaldo Wynn had a big contact and didnt do much

[Schneed10]

I have to say though, that it is entirely inappropriate to compare a contract signed 3 or 4 years ago, such as Clinton Portis's, to a contract signed today, like Javon Walker's.

Naturally as the cap has gone up, so should player contracts. You must compare contracts issued that year against one another, you can't really compare across years.

The Redskins did overpay for their players based on where contracts were valued at the time. That said, they were the only team in the NFL that projected the cap limit successfully and managed their cap figures to maximize that space.

I have no doubt we're the top cap management team in the NFL. Where we haven't been so great is getting the most talent for our money. That comes down to picking players. Thankfully, I think we're on the right track with that now, and I'm hopeful for some great results over the next few years.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

I have to say though, that it is entirely inappropriate to compare a contract signed 3 or 4 years ago, such as Clinton Portis's, to a contract signed today, like Javon Walker's.

Naturally as the cap has gone up, so should player contracts. You must compare contracts issued that year against one another, you can't really compare across years.

The Redskins did overpay for their players based on where contracts were valued at the time. That said, they were the only team in the NFL that projected the cap limit successfully and managed their cap figures to maximize that space.

I have no doubt we're the top cap management team in the NFL. Where we haven't been so great is getting the most talent for our money. That comes down to picking players. Thankfully, I think we're on the right track with that now, and I'm hopeful for some great results over the next few years.

I 100% agree. Our problem has been talent evaluation and not talent compensation. The structure of deals matter too. Maybe Portis' contract looks bad when valued as a whole but if it structured properly then it probably fit just fine with the cap situation in the league at the time and was increased accordingly with projected cap increases. Total value of contracts means nothing in the NFL.

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

I have no doubt we're the top cap management team in the NFL. Where we haven't been so great is getting the most talent for our money. That comes down to picking players. Thankfully, I think we're on the right track with that now, and I'm hopeful for some great results over the next few years.

Yeah, but if the Redskins swing and miss on guys like Thomas, Carter, ARE, M. Washington, L Fletcher, S. Springs, and Fred Smoot then managing the cap becomes a hell of a lot harder due to the fact that you're going to have to rebuild.

Part of the reason the Redskins are able to restructure deals is because a lot of the players they have brought in have been good, and keeping the core group in tact has contributed to the two playoff runs in 05 and 07.

I know thats kind of vauge but I think you guys get where I'm going with this.

[firstdown]

It was a plan devised by Snyder when he took over the team. He would paly all of these players these big deals to drive up the cost of signing free agents. When the prices went through the roof he backed out of signing any big name FA's. This going to but teams in cap problems so they will have to dump a bunch of players. The market will get over run with top players and we can cherry pick these guys to fill our needs. We do this for three years then the cycle starts all over again. This time we are smarter and will bring home a SB within a year or two or three or sometime this century.

[Schneed10]

There's an article on SI's Truth and Rumors today about how the veteran Jet players are upset about the money just handed out to the new free agent class. They're wondering when they're going to get theirs. You can see the kind of angst a free agent binge causes in the locker room, same thing was happening to us every time we went on a binge. I think it affects team chemistry, besides the fact that new players have a learning curve. You end up with a tough season.

You're best off drafting guys into the program and letting them earn their stripes on the field, and then get paid. It helps breed a blue-collar, hard work equals financial reward kind of mentality.

Work and deserve it, earn it to own it.