Do You Unequivocally Believe RG3 Is Our Franchise QB?

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

This is why it's so mind blowing that so many are ready to write off Griffin as a potential bust or ready to make a change/want a "true QB competition". Not only is the younger but he also has the least experience playing the position in the traditional way and the least time for development due to his injury. I think he's going to take all of this as ammo into next offseason. There's no question inside the building about his dedication, intelligence, acumen and work ethic so given the time and reps, he's poised for a quantum leap next season with proper coaching.

Agreed! I'd say it's better to judge Griffin after he has had a full off season to work on his craft.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

Agreed! I'd say it's better to judge Griffin after he has had a full off season to work on his craft.

And he has a decent team around him.

[Bucket]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

And he has a decent team around him.

Agreed. Luck loses his #1 WR and now look at him? 58% completion rating, 15 TD's, lower QB rating than RG3

Also, let's be glad we didn't pay someone so much money that we lost half the team and he's performing like Flacco right now.

RG3 will be fine. He was checking down last night, and looking off the safety. Something he hasn't done well in the past. He'll learn fast, and people will be surprised when the knee brace comes off.

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by Bucket

Agreed. Luck loses his #1 WR and now look at him? 58% completion rating, 15 TD's, lower QB rating than RG3

Also, let's be glad we didn't pay someone so much money that we lost half the team and he's performing like Flacco right now.

RG3 will be fine. He was checking down last night, and looking off the safety. Something he hasn't done well in the past. He'll learn fast, and people will be surprised when the knee brace comes off.

TY Hilton is talented. I'd blame the addition of Trent Richardson more for the Colts' demise.

Cleveland has come out of this looking like geniuses somehow.

[Green Monk Machine]

We have discussed, debated, and argued over Dobert this year.
With all the perspectives involved, what is really the best for the team, fans, and future?
To me, it's embracing the nfl. Either accept it for what it is, or suffer and be left out 4 weeks into and 4 weeks before the regular season ends.

The way the conversation has continued, it seems many of you have accepted read option and want to see more of that. The endless problems I see with the read option begin with mind numbing blatant issues. Alfred is the RB and a very capable one at that. Historically what team has get won a Super Bowl with what Kyle is trying to establish? Often times Robert or WR's are getting carries- this is risk outweighing reward. We don't have 4 Roberts on the bench in case one breaks and opposing defenses are celebrating when we eat clock up, expose our QB to hits every play and take little nibbles of yardage. The real teams that are able to succeed have a passing attack. Ours is predicated on play action. It's predictable. We've seen 90% of passes be play action, not including when it is 2mins left in 4thqtr and trailing by 18, which seems to be the only times when no play action is used.
The rules of the game are geared to protect the QB. We have chosen to forfeit that proceed w/o caution. WR's have nearly all advantage against defenses and get flags in their favor now more than ever. We don't take any advantage of that and chose to keep them running short routes or lining up in the backfield.

Look at how horribly the team has become on offense. Sure they have their moments- we have potential. Kyle's approach and philosophy is....too many words to convey.

Supporters of Read Option...will say, yeah in 2012 we won the division. But opposition will say, yeah and the teams mgt helped get him hurt and have been blinded by read option so much and gotten away from real football, that w/o Robert at full health, they have no clue how to win a game.

What are we building? A team that can only win if our QB is 100% healthy and playing like a madden player? No man is ahead of his teammates.

I think of supporters of the read option and how other teams in the nfl run it with success. Well they had coaches who are careful and it works for them. They also use it drastically less and sparingly. It's great to have your QB tuck and run when it's open, it's effective to have the QB keep defenses aware he can run here and there. The Kyle approach is f'kn dangerous. 1 concussion, 1 major surgery, 1 blown home playoff game, and 1 2013 season ruined from a commitment to the read option.

We could have lost or won with Kirk. The team chose to proceed with Robert and not to give him experience in the pocket but running the same detrimental offense.

It is not all that impressive to see garçon approach 100, I expect that from him. That is what we paid him for. With all the busts at WR, we need him. But sadly we've seen how he can do more. And if we had a better system, we could have another 100 receiver.

The nfl is passing. The defense is handcuffed to play the passing game. The ass backward redskin approach goes against the grain and continues to be a laughing to the world to not get on board.

Lets stop the nonsense and adopt a pocket passer system. The discussion that 2013 was b/c Robert was hurt really needs to end b/c we had Kirk and even now that rob looks healthy, we play like 2012 can happen again but overlook the concussion and surgery b/c it's been accepted that the division ttle is equivalent to the Super Bowl.

That's thinking small and short range ie Read Option.

[HailGreen28]

Originally Posted by Green Monk Machine

(snip part I'm not sure where you're coming from.)The way the conversation has continued, it seems many of you have accepted read option and want to see more of that. The endless problems I see with the read option begin with mind numbing blatant issues. Alfred is the RB and a very capable one at that. Historically what team has get won a Super Bowl with what Kyle is trying to establish?

Things change in the NFL. Case in point, historically superbowl winners weren't pass happy compared to today. Didn't stop teams adopting new trends in winning. And San Fran just made it to the SB with a RO QB.

Originally Posted by Green Monk Machine

Often times Robert or WR's are getting carries- this is risk outweighing reward. We don't have 4 Roberts on the bench in case one breaks and opposing defenses are celebrating when we eat clock up, expose our QB to hits every play and take little nibbles of yardage. The real teams that are able to succeed have a passing attack. Ours is predicated on play action. It's predictable. We've seen 90% of passes be play action, not including when it is 2mins left in 4thqtr and trailing by 18, which seems to be the only times when no play action is used.

Again, San Fran isn't a real team? How about the 11-1 Seahawks this season? The RO is a valuable part of today's NFL offense if you have a QB that can run it.

Originally Posted by Green Monk Machine

The rules of the game are geared to protect the QB. We have chosen to forfeit that proceed w/o caution. WR's have nearly all advantage against defenses and get flags in their favor now more than ever. We don't take any advantage of that and chose to keep them running short routes or lining up in the backfield.

No we haven't chosen to forfeit anything. When we choose to run, the RO works well for us, better than that darn pitch sweep ZB we keep trying. Because of poor line play, and Robert missing seeing open WRs, traditional drop back isn't working as well for us as play-action.

The one thing you said I agree with, yeah WRs regularly in the backfield seems weird. The rest is completely wrong, IMO.

Originally Posted by Green Monk Machine

Look at how horribly the team has become on offense. Sure they have their moments- we have potential. Kyle's approach and philosophy is....too many words to convey.

I can summarize: Worked fine with RG3 last season. Until an open field hit on a scramble.

Originally Posted by Green Monk Machine

Supporters of Read Option...will say, yeah in 2012 we won the division. But opposition will say, yeah and the teams mgt helped get him hurt and have been blinded by read option so much and gotten away from real football, that w/o Robert at full health, they have no clue how to win a game.

Robert wasn't hurt on RO plays. The injuries you refer to happened on scrambles, which will happen more using more traditional drop back passing. Robert's improved on the fix for that though, by heading OB and sliding more.

Originally Posted by Green Monk Machine

What are we building? A team that can only win if our QB is 100% healthy and playing like a madden player? No man is ahead of his teammates.

Not sure where you're going with the last line, but I say go with what worked for us last season, and for the Niners and seachickens last season and now. The RO is a valuable asset to any QB that can run it.

Originally Posted by Green Monk Machine

I think of supporters of the read option and how other teams in the nfl run it with success. Well they had coaches who are careful and it works for them. They also use it drastically less and sparingly. It's great to have your QB tuck and run when it's open, it's effective to have the QB keep defenses aware he can run here and there. The Kyle approach is f'kn dangerous. 1 concussion, 1 major surgery, 1 blown home playoff game, and 1 2013 season ruined from a commitment to the read option.

Again, we didn't run the RO most of the time, and RG3 wasn't injured on any RO play. I'm surprised you aren't saying that drop back passing and scrambling isn't "f'kn dangerous". You'd be more accurate describing this team.

Originally Posted by Green Monk Machine

We could have lost or won with Kirk. The team chose to proceed with Robert and not to give him experience in the pocket but running the same detrimental offense.

After the first sentence, everything above is wrong and addressed already. IMO.

Originally Posted by Green Monk Machine

It is not all that impressive to see garçon approach 100, I expect that from him. That is what we paid him for. With all the busts at WR, we need him. But sadly we've seen how he can do more. And if we had a better system, we could have another 100 receiver.

Last season, Garcon was slowed by injury. Dunno if you blame that on the RO too. This season I think Garcon's less than stellar performances are due to: Robert playing his way back into shape and trying to learn how to be a drop back passer.

Originally Posted by Green Monk Machine

The nfl is passing. The defense is handcuffed to play the passing game. The ass backward redskin approach goes against the grain and continues to be a laughing to the world to not get on board.

Funny, San Fran, Seattle, (to an extent some of the stuff GB and others do), and the teams they play against would beg to differ. Remember that SF and Sea started running more RO last season and still do BECAUSE they saw how effective it was for us.

Originally Posted by Green Monk Machine

Lets stop the nonsense and adopt a pocket passer system. The discussion that 2013 was b/c Robert was hurt really needs to end b/c we had Kirk and even now that rob looks healthy, we play like 2012 can happen again but overlook the concussion and surgery b/c it's been accepted that the division ttle is equivalent to the Super Bowl.

That's thinking small and short range ie Read Option.

Faulty opinion based on false assumptions, see above. We should work on adopting what system works with our current personnel. And that means including the RO, and the play action, and drop back passing, and feeding Alfmo the ball.

(screens and pitch sweeps should be minimized IMO. I think when we've run sweeps where Robert hands the ball off, it works better because D's have to respect the possible bootleg.)

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by Green Monk Machine

We have discussed, debated, and argued over Dobert this year.
With all the perspectives involved, what is really the best for the team, fans, and future?
To me, it's embracing the nfl. Either accept it for what it is, or suffer and be left out 4 weeks into and 4 weeks before the regular season ends.

The way the conversation has continued, it seems many of you have accepted read option and want to see more of that. The endless problems I see with the read option begin with mind numbing blatant issues.....

The NFL is an evolving game that brings about new wrinkles in the offense and defense with each passing decade. Knowing this, you might want to go back and rethink your post. Secondly, Griffin was not hurt on a read-option play against Baltimore. He was hurt simply trying to scramble.

I basically want to see more of whatever is successful. If it's smash mouth football, I want to see more of that. If it's the read option, bring it on. If it's bombs away - as long as the freakin' wide receiver catches the ball. You guys argue way too much about things you have no control over.

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

And he has a decent team around him.

At least some better pass protection.