34th Overall Pick

[warriorzpath]

Defense wins championships. To take it one step further, great physical secondaries can win championships. Seattle knows it's priorities and they have shown them by paying them well this past week.

[SirLK26]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

Defense wins championships. To take it one step further, great physical secondaries can win championships. Seattle knows it's priorities and they have shown them by paying them well this past week.

Well, great defenses are just a part of one recipe for a SB. Because in addition to a great defense, Seattle has a consistent offense that can score points when they're needed and also run out the clock, as well as a solid special teams unit. And Denver made it to the SB by riding an offense that just crushed everyone with points. Sure, you can argue that they lost in the end, but the most important thing is that they made it there. San Francisco has a great defense, and they lost to the Ravens in the 2012 SB. The Ravens weren't great at anything, but solid everywhere and just got hot at the right time.

That list could go on. The point is that building a great defense isn't the only way to get to the SB. You can get there with pretty much any combination as long as you're solid overall.

That out of the way, I think you know I'll be happy going secondary at #34, especially if it's Verrett. I just want us to take a great player at a position of need who can contribute early and also in the long run. Really, really can't afford to flub this pick up. Honestly, a great RT makes the most sense at #34, because we won't be going to the SB for a few years yet even if things work out like they're supposed to; we might as well protect RG3 as he improves in the meantime and make sure he's still standing 5 years down the road. Please, Allen, just make a smart choice and I'll be happy.

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by SirLK26

Well, great defenses are just a part of one recipe for a SB. Because in addition to a great defense, Seattle has a consistent offense that can score points when they're needed and also run out the clock, as well as a solid special teams unit. And Denver made it to the SB by riding an offense that just crushed everyone with points. Sure, you can argue that they lost in the end, but the most important thing is that they made it there. San Francisco has a great defense, and they lost to the Ravens in the 2012 SB. The Ravens weren't great at anything, but solid everywhere and just got hot at the right time.

That list could go on. The point is that building a great defense isn't the only way to get to the SB. You can get there with pretty much any combination as long as you're solid overall.

That out of the way, I think you know I'll be happy going secondary at #34, especially if it's Verrett. I just want us to take a great player at a position of need who can contribute early and also in the long run. Really, really can't afford to flub this pick up. Honestly, a great RT makes the most sense at #34, because we won't be going to the SB for a few years yet even if things work out like they're supposed to; we might as well protect RG3 as he improves in the meantime and make sure he's still standing 5 years down the road. Please, Allen, just make a smart choice and I'll be happy.

I understand protecting RGIII, but it can only go so far at the expense of your team as a whole. There's a big disparity between the talent level on offense and defense right now. I know it's not a popular opinion (going against upgrading both sides of the lines), but it's a greater upgrade for the team as a whole if the Redskins upgrade secondary versus any other position or part of the team. Neglecting a major need in the secondary year after year to create a stout offensive line - doesn't make sense to me. It's just really unbalanced. And it also indirectly creates undue pressure on RGIII and the Redskins offense by needing to consistently score more points than a weak defense is giving them up.

RGIII will need to adapt to the weak link at the offensive line in Polumbus. And by all accounts by the current and past regimes, the coaches don't feel he's that bad. The Redskins also can't operate like RGIII is as fragile as a china doll.

At least last season's weak link was upgraded with the addition and shuffle at the center and guard positions.

[SirLK26]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

I understand protecting RGIII, but it can only go so far at the expense of your team as a whole. There's a big disparity between the talent level on offense and defense right now. I know it's not a popular opinion (going against upgrading both sides of the lines), but it's a greater upgrade for the team as a whole if the Redskins upgrade secondary versus any other position or part of the team. Neglecting a major need in the secondary year after year to create a stout offensive line - doesn't make sense to me. It's just really unbalanced. And it also indirectly creates undue pressure on RGIII and the Redskins offense by needing to consistently score more points than a weak defense is giving them up.

RGIII will need to adapt to the weak link at the offensive line in Polumbus. And by all accounts by the current and past regimes, the coaches don't feel he's that bad. The Redskins also can't operate like RGIII is as fragile as a china doll.

At least last season's weak link was upgraded with the addition and shuffle at the center and guard positions.

A lot of your first paragraph is true, but to specifically target an area of the team and then to go into the draft and try to fix that area even at the expense of taking better players just isn't smart. I want us to take the highest rated player on our board, that rating obviously taking into account talent and character as well as need. That is the only way to build a team. And apparently our current FO understands that, because they used FA, for the most part, exactly how you're supposed to: a way to build depth. With the additions of Tracy Porter and Ryan Clark, secondary isn't as big of a need as it was when FA started, so now they can go into the draft and take BPA. They don't have to go into pick #34 and say, "Okay, there's a lot of great players available, but our secondary is in such need that let's take this guy even though there's higher rated players at different positions on our board."

If a DB is BPA at #34, I'll be leaping up and down as high as you. Because secondary is a big need and needs to be taken care of, I agree. But not at the expense of a better player at a different position.

About my comment on RTs, I wasn't suggesting that we reach for one or specifically target one with our first pick at all. I was saying that if a RT is BPA, that could be better for our team long-term than if a DB is BPA.

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by SirLK26

A lot of your first paragraph is true, but to specifically target an area of the team and then to go into the draft and try to fix that area even at the expense of taking better players just isn't smart. I want us to take the highest rated player on our board, that rating obviously taking into account talent and character as well as need. That is the only way to build a team. And apparently our current FO understands that, because they used FA, for the most part, exactly how you're supposed to: a way to build depth. With the additions of Tracy Porter and Ryan Clark, secondary isn't as big of a need as it was when FA started, so now they can go into the draft and take BPA. They don't have to go into pick #34 and say, "Okay, there's a lot of great players available, but our secondary is in such need that let's take this guy even though there's higher rated players at different positions on our board."

If a DB is BPA at #34, I'll be leaping up and down as high as you. Because secondary is a big need and needs to be taken care of, I agree. But not at the expense of a better player at a different position.

About my comment on RTs, I wasn't suggesting that we reach for one or specifically target one with our first pick at all. I was saying that if a RT is BPA, that could be better for our team long-term than if a DB is BPA.

The thing about BPA that most fans don't understand though is - most teams don't go about the draft with pure BPA. They create their draft board with the players they rank - relative to their needs. In other words, needs impact player rankings.

[SirLK26]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

The thing about BPA that most fans don't understand though is - most teams don't go about the draft with pure BPA. They create their draft board with the players they rank - relative to their needs. In other words, needs impact player rankings.

Yep, thus this quote from my post, "I want us to take the highest rated player on our board, that rating obviously taking into account talent and character as well as need." If Verrett is available, he'll likely be BPA according to our board. But if a less talented guy like, say, Ward, is available at #34 along with, say, Moses, I'd say it would be quite likely Moses would be BPA on our board.

I think we're basically saying the same thing, it's just that secondary is a bigger need to you than it is to me.

[TenandSix:Unacceptable]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

I understand protecting RGIII, but it can only go so far at the expense of your team as a whole. There's a big disparity between the talent level on offense and defense right now. I know it's not a popular opinion (going against upgrading both sides of the lines), but it's a greater upgrade for the team as a whole if the Redskins upgrade secondary versus any other position or part of the team. Neglecting a major need in the secondary year after year to create a stout offensive line - doesn't make sense to me. It's just really unbalanced. And it also indirectly creates undue pressure on RGIII and the Redskins offense by needing to consistently score more points than a weak defense is giving them up.

RGIII will need to adapt to the weak link at the offensive line in Polumbus. And by all accounts by the current and past regimes, the coaches don't feel he's that bad. The Redskins also can't operate like RGIII is as fragile as a china doll.

At least last season's weak link was upgraded with the addition and shuffle at the center and guard positions.

Umm. Were you alive last year? We drafted amerson, Rambo and Thomas. How'd that turn out? The redskins need large men who can play. Lots of them. A team with a pass rush can get away with smoke and mirrors in the secondary. A team with an OL can protect a lead, get away with average QB play, and make up for a whole host of other problems. Build this team at the point of attack, we've got enough to make hay outside of that. It'll take a couple years. OL, DL, LB and TE are the areas I'd key in on for this years team. If a nice player at another position falls to us by all means take him. We need football players, just focus on the big ones if given the option.

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by TenandSix:Unacceptable

Umm. Were you alive last year? We drafted amerson, Rambo and Thomas. How'd that turn out? The redskins need large men who can play. Lots of them. A team with a pass rush can get away with smoke and mirrors in the secondary. A team with an OL can protect a lead, get away with average QB play, and make up for a whole host of other problems. Build this team at the point of attack, we've got enough to make hay outside of that. It'll take a couple years. OL, DL, LB and TE are the areas I'd key in on for this years team. If a nice player at another position falls to us by all means take him. We need football players, just focus on the big ones if given the option.

Neglect was the wrong word to use - should have said: failed to solve the secondary issues.

It didn't work out because Amerson, Rambo, and Thomas didn't produce for the team. Look at all the great defenses (and as a result great teams) in the league, at the very least their secondaries were solid. The Redskins - not so much. There are question marks everywhere.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

Neglect was the wrong word to use - should have said: failed to solve the secondary issues.

It didn't work out because Amerson, Rambo, and Thomas didn't produce for the team. Look at all the great defenses (and as a result great teams) in the league, at the very least their secondaries were solid. The Redskins - not so much. There are question marks everywhere.

Sherman from the Seahawks was drafted in 2011. He made his mark last year. Maybe a little in 2012.

Can we please give the guys we drafted last year at least 1 year's grace before we throw them out into the muddy river of NFL wannabees?

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Sherman from the Seahawks was drafted in 2011. He made his mark last year. Maybe a little in 2012.

Can we please give the guys we drafted last year at least 1 year's grace before we throw them out into the muddy river of NFL wannabees?

Sherman - Maybe a little in 2012? In 2012 is when he broke through.

I'm hoping Amerson and Thomas prove me wrong and I would be happy, but they didn't show much except flashes here and there.

Rambo's start was so low, I'm surprised he hasn't been cut a long time ago. I would be pleasantly surprised if he wasn't cut before the start of regular season because that would mean that he was playing 100 times better.

Drafting Verrett or Bucannon would be a major upgrade over all 3 players now - even after their rookie season. There's no arguing at the very least that Bucannon is an upgrade over Thomas and Rambo. Thomas might have done well, but there was no telling that for sure before he got hurt. And now he's coming off an injury.

[Alvin Walton]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

Neglect was the wrong word to use - should have said: failed to solve the secondary issues.

It didn't work out because Amerson, Rambo, and Thomas didn't produce for the team. Look at all the great defenses (and as a result great teams) in the league, at the very least their secondaries were solid. The Redskins - not so much. There are question marks everywhere.

Rambo didnt produce.

Thomas was injured.
Amerson looks like a CB starter this year.

And they were r o o k i e s...................

*insert huge roll eyes icon here*

[TenandSix:Unacceptable]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

Neglect was the wrong word to use - should have said: failed to solve the secondary issues.

It didn't work out because Amerson, Rambo, and Thomas didn't produce for the team. Look at all the great defenses (and as a result great teams) in the league, at the very least their secondaries were solid. The Redskins - not so much. There are question marks everywhere.

Guess what? It takes a couple of years for draft pick strapped teams bereft of quality depth to plug all the holes. I'd build around QB, Coaching, point of attack then everything else. We got a new coach, a QB with unlimited potential, and hodge podge up front. We've got Orakpo, Kerrigan and Trent Williams in the trenches. Now you can add Hatcher. Everyone else is solid or worse. That's not enough horses to win the war of attrition of an NFL football season. Think of it like a foundation of a house. You build that before you start painting the walls. The other parts of the team are unimportant until you can beat teams up front. That's why I'd build big and then plug in other players later. I learned my lesson after wanting Laron Landry.

[SirLK26]

Originally Posted by TenandSix:Unacceptable

Umm. Were you alive last year? We drafted amerson, Rambo and Thomas. How'd that turn out?...

We got a new starting CB and a possible starting SS, and Rambo in all likelihood will be better this season. So I wouldn't say it turned out bad, but we still need secondary help; to the tune of a starting FS, slot corner, another outside corner to develop, and more all-around secondary depth. And even if all these DBs we drafted last year were starters, they wouldn't have turned our season around; just like if we had drafted 3 trench guys, they wouldn't have turned our season around. Your point about how a good pass rush can make up for a bad secondary is somewhat true; and I say somewhat because a good secondary is also quite important in today's NFL.

This team has deficiences all around. We can't draft trenches just because that's the correct way to build a team. We need to take BPA, and use FA to build depth so that we can use BPA strategy.

[TenandSix:Unacceptable]

Originally Posted by SirLK26

We got a new starting CB and a possible starting SS, and Rambo in all likelihood will be better this season. So I wouldn't say it turned out bad, but we still need secondary help; to the tune of a starting FS, slot corner, another outside corner to develop, and more all-around secondary depth. And even if all these DBs we drafted last year were starters, they wouldn't have turned our season around; just like if we had drafted 3 trench guys, they wouldn't have turned our season around. Your point about how a good pass rush can make up for a bad secondary is somewhat true; and I say somewhat because a good secondary is also quite important in today's NFL.

This team has deficiences all around. We can't draft trenches just because that's the correct way to build a team. We need to take BPA, and use FA to build depth so that we can use BPA strategy.

This team has failed to draft enough OL and DL repeatedly in the first two rounds. Reverse the trend the team will benefit. We are an injury or two from having the worst LB's in the league too. Draft more of them and draft them higher in the draft. Most will bust you need to take repeated shots at it. I'd love better DB's. We can't fix both issues this draft I'd concentrate on bigs unless someone I truly coveted was available at another area.

[SirLK26]

Originally Posted by TenandSix:Unacceptable

This team has failed to draft enough OL and DL repeatedly in the first two rounds. Reverse the trend the team will benefit. We are an injury or two from having the worst LB's in the league too. Draft more of them and draft them higher in the draft. Most will bust you need to take repeated shots at it. I'd love better DB's. We can't fix both issues this draft I'd concentrate on bigs unless someone I truly coveted was available at another area.

Well, it looks quite likely that you'll get your trenches fix; some great linemen left on both sides of the ball. Can't go wrong with Su'a-Filo if we go OL, but perhaps we'll go RT, in which case I hope we select Moses or Kouandijo. On DL, my preference would be Nix. Don't really want Hageman; he's got a lot of talent, but is too inconsistent.