Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by Bucket

You guys comparing KC to Beck and Rex is just ridiculous. The guy hasn't even played half of an NFL season yet lol.

So then explain to me why Andrew Luck, Andy Dalton, Russell Wilson, RG3, Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, and so many others never had a clunker of a game like that in their rookie seasons?

Because I look at QBs like this: if you don't have a chance to be one of the best then you're not the answer.

Every QB in the league can carve up a defense if he's given time to throw and his receivers are capable of getting open. See Foles, Nick circa 2013, Grossman, Rex circa 2006, McCown, Josh circa 2013. What separates the championship-capable QBs from the rest is how they perform under pressure. Can they escape, can they elude, can they get rid of the ball quickly, do they make sound decisions under pressure?

Foles is being exposed behind that line. So is Cousins. See, Kirk Cousins is a guy that if you can protect him all season, he might be able to get you to the playoffs. But once there and you're facing better pass rushes, he won't get you past the first round because even the best line is going to give up some pressure. That's not the answer. I don't think handling pressure is something you get better at. QBs are either born with a knack for handling pressure or they weren't - it's a personality thing. Do you get frazzled and anxious or don't you. That's why we see some young QBs succeed and others do what Kirk did.

[mredskins]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

So then explain to me why Andrew Luck, Andy Dalton, Russell Wilson, RG3, Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, and so many others never had a clunker of a game like that in their rookie seasons?

Because I look at QBs like this: if you don't have a chance to be one of the best then you're not the answer.

Every QB in the league can carve up a defense if he's given time to throw and his receivers are capable of getting open. See Foles, Nick circa 2013, Grossman, Rex circa 2006, McCown, Josh circa 2013. What separates the championship-capable QBs from the rest is how they perform under pressure. Can they escape, can they elude, can they get rid of the ball quickly, do they make sound decisions under pressure?

Foles is being exposed behind that line. So is Cousins. See, Kirk Cousins is a guy that if you can protect him all season, he might be able to get you to the playoffs. But once there and you're facing better pass rushes, he won't get you past the first round because even the best line is going to give up some pressure. That's not the answer. I don't think handling pressure is something you get better at. QBs are either born with a knack for handling pressure or they weren't - it's a personality thing. Do you get frazzled and anxious or don't you. That's why we see some young QBs succeed and others do what Kirk did.

Hmmm...Rivers keeps getting better and it is his 10th year. I think a lot of what you are saying is "crystal balling".


1. Philip Rivers, quarterback, San Diego. He just keeps getting better. Building on last year’s 5% improvement in completion percentage—stunning for a 10-year vet—Rivers came back after a one-point loss to unbeaten Arizona to strafe three straight foes, most impressivly leading the Chargers to 30 points in a Week 2 win over Seattle. The thing you notice about Rivers now is that his confidence isn’t getting him in trouble the way it did under Norv Turner—he’s forcing very few passes. He’s a 74.5% passer during the three-game streak, with no interceptions.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by mredskins

Hmmm...Rivers keeps getting better and it is his 10th year. I think a lot of what you are saying is "crystal balling".


1. Philip Rivers, quarterback, San Diego. He just keeps getting better. Building on last year’s 5% improvement in completion percentage—stunning for a 10-year vet—Rivers came back after a one-point loss to unbeaten Arizona to strafe three straight foes, most impressivly leading the Chargers to 30 points in a Week 2 win over Seattle. The thing you notice about Rivers now is that his confidence isn’t getting him in trouble the way it did under Norv Turner—he’s forcing very few passes. He’s a 74.5% passer during the three-game streak, with no interceptions.

Rivers is such a good QB. Love watching that guy play.

[donofriose]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

So then explain to me why Andrew Luck, Andy Dalton, Russell Wilson, RG3, Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, and so many others never had a clunker of a game like that in their rookie seasons?

Because I look at QBs like this: if you don't have a chance to be one of the best then you're not the answer.

Every QB in the league can carve up a defense if he's given time to throw and his receivers are capable of getting open. See Foles, Nick circa 2013, Grossman, Rex circa 2006, McCown, Josh circa 2013. What separates the championship-capable QBs from the rest is how they perform under pressure. Can they escape, can they elude, can they get rid of the ball quickly, do they make sound decisions under pressure?

Foles is being exposed behind that line. So is Cousins. See, Kirk Cousins is a guy that if you can protect him all season, he might be able to get you to the playoffs. But once there and you're facing better pass rushes, he won't get you past the first round because even the best line is going to give up some pressure. That's not the answer. I don't think handling pressure is something you get better at. QBs are either born with a knack for handling pressure or they weren't - it's a personality thing. Do you get frazzled and anxious or don't you. That's why we see some young QBs succeed and others do what Kirk did.

Both of them didn't play their rookie season.

Manning's first three games were terrible, 8 ints 2 touchdowns. Andrew Luck's rookie season had stretches where he threw 5 interceptions and only 3 touchdown passes.

Give Kirk a chance.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by donofriose

Give Kirk a chance.

There's no choice but to do anything but for the next six weeks.

But I'm not expecting to find a hero. All I'm saying is don't get your hopes up.

[donofriose]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

There's no choice but to do anything but for the next six weeks.

But I'm not expecting to find a hero. All I'm saying is don't get your hopes up.

I would agree. Griffin was high hope for me and now that is pretty much over.

[skinsguy]

Guys,

It all starts up front. I don't care who the quarterback is, ultimately, you win and lose based upon your protections. We all know how porous that offensive line is.

I subscribe to the theory that a great offensive line creates a domino effect across the board. With a great offensive line, you can control the clock, you can wear down opposing defenses, and you can have time to set up the big plays downfield. Moreover, you can keep your defense rested on the side lines, and healthy.

A great offensive line can do more to cover up deficiencies on the other side of the ball, as well as who your quarterback is, than the other way around in my opinion.

Put Kirk Cousins or RGIII behind a great offensive line, and either are good enough to take you deep into the playoffs. That is where, if I'm the GM, I'm placing all of my attentions on next offseason. That offensive line is going to have to be greatly upgraded for any quarterback to be successful in Washington. I don't understand why the offensive line has been basically ignored all these years. Seems like we draft one great lineman, with nobody else anywhere close to him in regards to talent, and no depth behind him. Makes no sense to me.

Mark Rypien would have never sniffed the playoffs behind this offensive line.

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

Guys,

It all starts up front. I don't care who the quarterback is, ultimately, you win and lose based upon your protections. We all know how porous that offensive line is.

I subscribe to the theory that a great offensive line creates a domino effect across the board. With a great offensive line, you can control the clock, you can wear down opposing defenses, and you can have time to set up the big plays downfield. Moreover, you can keep your defense rested on the side lines, and healthy.

A great offensive line can do more to cover up deficiencies on the other side of the ball, as well as who your quarterback is, than the other way around in my opinion.

Put Kirk Cousins or RGIII behind a great offensive line, and either are good enough to take you deep into the playoffs. That is where, if I'm the GM, I'm placing all of my attentions on next offseason. That offensive line is going to have to be greatly upgraded for any quarterback to be successful in Washington. I don't understand why the offensive line has been basically ignored all these years. Seems like we draft one great lineman, with nobody else anywhere close to him in regards to talent, and no depth behind him. Makes no sense to me.

Mark Rypien would have never sniffed the playoffs behind this offensive line.

Id like to know why we dont have the ability to draft olinemen and then coach them up into starters. We spent alot of draft picks on back ups...that shit needs to change. Bruce, talent evaluators in the fo and the coaches need to answer for those fuck ups.

i hope to god we play both Long and Moses durning this losing season to see what they have. Experience is key, especially along the oline. Legrimace needs to play as well.

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Id like to know why we dont have the ability to draft olinemen and then coach them up into starters. We spent alot of draft picks on back ups...that shit needs to change. Bruce, talent evaluators in the fo and the coaches need to answer for those fuck ups.

i hope to god we play both Long and Moses durning this losing season to see what they have. Experience is key, especially along the oline. Legrimace needs to play as well.

That is where we saw the genius of Bobby Beathard back in the day. He was able to find great talent through free agency and the draft. He helped Buges build that great offensive line that the 'skins enjoyed having throughout the 80's. And even later on, the 'skins were able to draft a Jim Lachey to compliment guys like Jacoby, Grimm, and Bostic. But the biggest thing was not only were these guys solid, but they had staying power. That offensive line rarely changed except for the gradual change from '81 to '91. There were no wholesale changed to that offensive line. Consistency, continuity, and solid talent is what drove Washington throughout the 80's, and it all started up front.

I think the issues are, however, that you don't see a plethora of great offensive linemen in the draft. You might be able to pick up a guy here or there, but it takes awhile to really get a solid offensive line built. And you have to take some skilled players as well. At least the Redskins, for the moment, are pretty good at the skilled positions. They can focus completely on the offensive line and the secondary.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

Guys,

It all starts up front. I don't care who the quarterback is, ultimately, you win and lose based upon your protections. We all know how porous that offensive line is.

I subscribe to the theory that a great offensive line creates a domino effect across the board. With a great offensive line, you can control the clock, you can wear down opposing defenses, and you can have time to set up the big plays downfield. Moreover, you can keep your defense rested on the side lines, and healthy.

A great offensive line can do more to cover up deficiencies on the other side of the ball, as well as who your quarterback is, than the other way around in my opinion.

Put Kirk Cousins or RGIII behind a great offensive line, and either are good enough to take you deep into the playoffs. That is where, if I'm the GM, I'm placing all of my attentions on next offseason. That offensive line is going to have to be greatly upgraded for any quarterback to be successful in Washington. I don't understand why the offensive line has been basically ignored all these years. Seems like we draft one great lineman, with nobody else anywhere close to him in regards to talent, and no depth behind him. Makes no sense to me.

Mark Rypien would have never sniffed the playoffs behind this offensive line.

This and them some. You win in the trenches. Protect your QB and sack the other teams QB. This is what won 3 SB's here. I look at Seattle right now and they kind of remind me of some of the old Redskin teams. Part of the problem I think is we simply don't have a blueprint.

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

This and them some. You win in the trenches. Protect your QB and sack the other teams QB. This is what won 3 SB's here. I look at Seattle right now and they kind of remind me of some of the old Redskin teams. Part of the problem I think is we simply don't have a blueprint.

I've been arguing against our FO philosophy for YEARS. Under Snyder's leadership, we have tried to build from the outside-in, meaning we have given little draft priority to building up strength in the trenches. Since taking Chris Samuels with the 3rd pick of the 2000 Draft, the FO has drafted only ONE O-linemen in the 2nd round or higher: Trent Williams (1st Round, 2010). That is a joke. During that same period, Jarvis Jenkins (2nd Round, 2011) is the ONLY D-lineman selected in the first two rounds. Compare this to the draft history of our division rivals, and it becomes obvious why we can't consistently protect our QBs, nor sack theirs.