No indictment in the mike brown case

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by over the mountain

1. every parent of a black male should talk with their son at a very early age about what to do if they are stopped by a police officer. talk to them about how officers have a heightened sense of "danger and fear for their life" when an officer is near a black male such as themselves. Tell them to not give an overly nervous officer any reason what-so-ever. And then tell them that despite all of this .. they could still be shot or killed because the officer "saw the perpetrator reach for his waist band" line. <SNIP>.

You know what? Here's what I constantly tell my (white) son:

If you are being stopped by the police, do what they say. Don't argue, don't contradict them, don't think to yourself "He can't tell me that" - particularly if there is any reason to suspect that the cop thinks you or the situation poses danger. De-escalate first by doing exactly what he/she says. Make sure the officer sees you complying and, if necessary tell him what you are doing and how you are intending to do it and then ask him for permission. Make no sudden moves!! If the officer says not to do something, then don't do it - even it means standing there and pissing your pants.

The officer has a badge, a gun, and the inherent right to be confrontational - you do not!!

I don't care if he insults your manhood and calls you every dirty name in the book (Which by the way, happened to me in my teen years - more than once. I grew up in PG County in the 70's/80's - need I say more?). No matter how he provokes you, say and do nothing that could be deemed an aggressive action. Shut up, take it, and return indignity with civility. Do everything in your power to get to the end of the tunnel until you can call me, a lawyer or peacefully appeal to a judge. Until then, the officer has complete, unchallengable authority - act accordingly.

BTW - When I was 16, my dad told me the same damn thing after I got picked up and taken to the station for not doing exactly what the cop told me to do, the second he told me to do it. [Picking up litter I dropped as the officer happened to be driving by - I did or said something to piss him off, don't even remember what, just know my first response was nothing akin to "Yes Sir!"]

Every parent needs to have this conversation with their kids. Period. I KNOW that there are bad cops - particularly, bad beat cops. I get that there are racist cops out there. With that said, it's the bad cops to whom you need to "Listen & Obey" the most because they are the ones looking for an excuse to abuse you AND will be the ones most experienced at covering it up.

Obey first, seek redress later. AND, recognize you may never get the redress to which you believe you are entitled. It's not right, it's not fair but it's life. At the appropriate time, and in the appropriate manner, try to change it.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

You know what? Here's what I constantly tell my (white) son:

If you are being stopped by the police, do what they say. Don't argue, don't contradict them, don't think to yourself "He can't tell me that" - particularly if there is any reason to suspect that the cop thinks you or the situation poses danger. De-escalate first by doing exactly what he/she says. Make sure the officer sees you complying and, if necessary tell him what you are doing and how you are intending to do it and then ask him for permission. Make no sudden moves!! If the officer says not to do something, then don't do it - even it means standing there and pissing your pants.

The officer has a badge, a gun, and the inherent right to be confrontational - you do not!!

I don't care if he insults your manhood and calls you every dirty name in the book (Which by the way, happened to me in my teen years - more than once. I grew up in PG County in the 70's/80's - need I say more?). No matter how he provokes you, say and do nothing that could be deemed an aggressive action. Shut up, take it, and return indignity with civility. Do everything in your power to get to the end of the tunnel until you can call me, a lawyer or peacefully appeal to a judge. Until then, the officer has complete, unchallengable authority - act accordingly.

BTW - When I was 16, my dad told me the same damn thing after I got picked up and taken to the station for not doing exactly what the cop told me to do, the second he told me to do it. [Picking up litter I dropped as the officer happened to be driving by - I did or said something to piss him off, don't even remember what, just know my first response was nothing akin to "Yes Sir!"]

Every parent needs to have this conversation with their kids. Period. I KNOW that there are bad cops - particularly, bad beat cops. I get that there are racist cops out there. With that said, it's the bad cops to whom you need to "Listen & Obey" the most because they are the ones looking for an excuse to abuse you AND will be the ones most experienced at covering it up.

Obey first, seek redress later. AND, recognize you may never get the redress to which you believe you are entitled. It's not right, it's not fair but it's life. At the appropriate time, and in the appropriate manner, try to change it.

D*** my dad told me to out shout the bastards, or maybe that's just what I heard after I stopped listening.

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

You know what? Here's what I constantly tell my (white) son:

If you are being stopped by the police, do what they say. Don't argue, don't contradict them, don't think to yourself "He can't tell me that" - particularly if there is any reason to suspect that the cop thinks you or the situation poses danger. De-escalate first by doing exactly what he/she says. Make sure the officer sees you complying and, if necessary tell him what you are doing and how you are intending to do it and then ask him for permission. Make no sudden moves!! If the officer says not to do something, then don't do it - even it means standing there and pissing your pants.

The officer has a badge, a gun, and the inherent right to be confrontational - you do not!!

I don't care if he insults your manhood and calls you every dirty name in the book (Which by the way, happened to me in my teen years - more than once. I grew up in PG County in the 70's/80's - need I say more?). No matter how he provokes you, say and do nothing that could be deemed an aggressive action. Shut up, take it, and return indignity with civility. Do everything in your power to get to the end of the tunnel until you can call me, a lawyer or peacefully appeal to a judge. Until then, the officer has complete, unchallengable authority - act accordingly.

BTW - When I was 16, my dad told me the same damn thing after I got picked up and taken to the station for not doing exactly what the cop told me to do, the second he told me to do it. [Picking up litter I dropped as the officer happened to be driving by - I did or said something to piss him off, don't even remember what, just know my first response was nothing akin to "Yes Sir!"]

Every parent needs to have this conversation with their kids. Period. I KNOW that there are bad cops - particularly, bad beat cops. I get that there are racist cops out there. With that said, it's the bad cops to whom you need to "Listen & Obey" the most because they are the ones looking for an excuse to abuse you AND will be the ones most experienced at covering it up.

Obey first, seek redress later. AND, recognize you may never get the redress to which you believe you are entitled. It's not right, it's not fair but it's life. At the appropriate time, and in the appropriate manner, try to change it.

Well said ,you need to go on tour .

[mlmdub130]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

You know what? Here's what I constantly tell my (white) son:



If you are being stopped by the police, do what they say. Don't argue, don't contradict them, don't think to yourself "He can't tell me that" - particularly if there is any reason to suspect that the cop thinks you or the situation something, then don't do it - even it means standing there and pissing your pants.



The officer has a badge, a gun, and the inherent right to be confrontational - you do not!!

So you tell your son he should sit there and piss his pants because the officer had the inherent right to be confrontational? Sorry but that doesn't fly. No one has the inherent right to be confrontational and that's the main problem in my eyes.

My belief is that at the end of the day these are kids, and it is up to the officer of the law to be responsible for keeping control of the situation. After all that is what their job is all about. It's to protect and serve, not harass and embarrass.

With this situation in Ferguson I think the officer failed his job when he got into the initial confrontation with Brown. He felt the need to establish dominance over the younger Brown. Brown being young and not really understanding the totality of his actions decided he wasn't going to be "punked" by some cop.

Both parties acted poorly in this instance, but I believe it's the officers responsibility to maintain his emotions and not let the situation get the better of him. He failed to do so and thus here we are, another youth shot dead from a simple misunderstanding and miscommunication.

I hope at the end of the day some good comes from this and the Brown's family wishes come true and all police officers are mandated to wear a camera on their person.

[HailGreen28]

Originally Posted by mlmdub130

So you tell your son he should sit there and piss his pants because the officer had the inherent right to be confrontational? Sorry but that doesn't fly. No one has the inherent right to be confrontational and that's the main problem in my eyes.

My belief is that at the end of the day these are kids, and it is up to the officer of the law to be responsible for keeping control of the situation. After all that is what their job is all about. It's to protect and serve, not harass and embarrass.

With this situation in Ferguson I think the officer failed his job when he got into the initial confrontation with Brown. He felt the need to establish dominance over the younger Brown. Brown being young and not really understanding the totality of his actions decided he wasn't going to be "punked" by some cop.

Both parties acted poorly in this instance, but I believe it's the officers responsibility to maintain his emotions and not let the situation get the better of him. He failed to do so and thus here we are, another youth shot dead from a simple misunderstanding and miscommunication.

I hope at the end of the day some good comes from this and the Brown's family wishes come true and all police officers are mandated to wear a camera on their person.

what the heck? Being non-confrontational = pissing pants? Attitudes like not wanting to get "punked" when confronted by someone, are childish and may have gotten Brown killed. What you describe is Brown's fault. Not the officer.

Cant stand being harrassed and embarrased, and not mature enough to handle it without getting physical? Thats troubled child in elementary school behavior, not average high school or older behavior.

Agreed on one thing: GoPros. Protect the good cops and expose the bad cops.

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by mlmdub130

So you tell your son he should sit there and piss his pants because the officer had the inherent right to be confrontational? Sorry but that doesn't fly. No one has the inherent right to be confrontational and that's the main problem in my eyes.

My belief is that at the end of the day these are kids, and it is up to the officer of the law to be responsible for keeping control of the situation. After all that is what their job is all about. It's to protect and serve, not harass and embarrass.

With this situation in Ferguson I think the officer failed his job when he got into the initial confrontation with Brown. He felt the need to establish dominance over the younger Brown. Brown being young and not really understanding the totality of his actions decided he wasn't going to be "punked" by some cop.

Both parties acted poorly in this instance, but I believe it's the officers responsixbility to maintain his emotions and not let the situation get the better of him. He failed to do so and thus here we are, another youth shot dead from a simple misunderstanding and miscommunication.

I hope at the end of the day some good comes from this and the Brown's family wishes come true and all police officers are mandated to wear a camera on their person.

This. Well said