(Merged Threads) LaVar Arrington and Gregg Williams

[EternalEnigma21]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Could LaVar help with turnovers and pressure?

Sure he could.

But, can you LaVar supporters also entertain the notion that he could also contribute to the 'D' giving up big plays? With his reluctance to play within the system, perhaps Williams thinks he's more of a liability to a 'D' that is already being stretched thin because of the injuries in the secondary.

I'm guessing Williams doesn't see LaVar as part of the solution right now and thinks of him as only being part of the problem.

You hear alot about overpersuit, but Sean Taylor is playing and I've seen him cost us 14 points this year overpersuing and getting duped out of position.

That shit happens to everyone, its not like we only sucked before williams and gibbs because Lavar gave up big plays.

I watched NFL replay of our game against the Seahawks a couple of years ago, and all Hasslebeck could talk about to his line was to "keep Lavar Arrington away from me." We won that game. The freaking QB was scared, and he's a good QB. If you can break someone's confidence behind center, you break the offense (except in the bronco's case).

Lavar overruns sometimes, but not anymore than anyone else, and his instincts are usually correct. I can understand if WILLIAMS gave him a shot and he lost a game for us, but that shit hasnt happened yet.

[gortiz]

[QUOTE=canthetuna]You hear alot about overpersuit, but Sean Taylor is playing and I've seen him cost us 14 points this year overpersuing and getting duped out of position.

That shit happens to everyone, its not like we only sucked before williams and gibbs because Lavar gave up big plays.QUOTE]

Never really reaized that enough, Taylor has been burnt by over pursuit, you just forget that crap cause Williams loves him so much...

okay ON TOP OF THAT COMPARISON, don't you think that Taylor would have pissed off the team/Williams with the crap he pulled by not showing up at all this last off-season, and then he pulled his best Dirty Harry impersonation in Miami? I mean him and Lavar have pretty much pulled the same crap, the only difference is I think Lavar is/was bigger than Williams and Williams couldn't handle that on his team.

Kind of similiar to how the Tuna got rid of Emmit as soon as he got to the Cowboys ....

[NYCSkin]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Could LaVar help with turnovers and pressure?

Sure he could.

But, can you LaVar supporters also entertain the notion that he could also contribute to the 'D' giving up big plays? With his reluctance to play within the system, perhaps Williams thinks he's more of a liability to a 'D' that is already being stretched thin because of the injuries in the secondary.

I'm guessing Williams doesn't see LaVar as part of the solution right now and thinks of him as only being part of the problem.

The solution is to create some takeaways. This might be accomplished by putting some pressure on the QB. Pressure on the QB is particularly effective on say 3rd and long situations, where assignments are not that much of an issue. You essentially need someone to just go out and get the ball. I think Jared Allen did a hell of a job today doing just that for the Chiefs. He was the difference in this game. It's too bad our difference maker, or "part of the solution", was on the sideline all day...

[Southpaw]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

But, can you LaVar supporters also entertain the notion that he could also contribute to the 'D' giving up big plays? With his reluctance to play within the system, perhaps Williams thinks he's more of a liability to a 'D' that is already being stretched thin because of the injuries in the secondary.

So why is no one else on the team having a finger pointed directly at them for the increasing number of big plays being given up by the defense? If every big play that was given up while LaVar was the starter was his fault, who's fault are they now that he doesn't play? Why isn't Brian Mitchell saying things like "Holdman missed this tackle, and lost them the game by giving up a 50 yard run" like he was so willing to say about LaVar?

I suppose none of these questions seem the least bit strange to Gibbs and Williams camp, but you don't have to be a detective to figure out there's something more than what the coaching staff is saying. The thing is, I'd be willing to accept the reason for his benching is his attitude or other off the field issues. If they want to cut off their nose to spite their face, than more power to them, but I will not accept the bold faced lie, which is the staff telling me LaVar is the worst linebacker on the team.

UPDATE: Warrick Holdman had an impressive 2 tackles today, no picks, and no sacks, which brings his season total to 12 tackles and 0 picks and sacks from the weak side linebacker position through 5 games. To put that in perspective, Marcus Washington had 11 tackles in the Dallas game alone, but hey, I'm sure Holdman was exactly where he was supposed to be on those two tackles. On a side note, Gregg Williams made the comment in a post game interview that he cannot get LaVar more playing time because Holdman has been playing extremely well. It's hard to argue his genius when Holdman puts up numbers like that...

[RiggosRanger]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Could LaVar help with turnovers and pressure?

Sure he could.

But, can you LaVar supporters also entertain the notion that he could also contribute to the 'D' giving up big plays? With his reluctance to play within the system, perhaps Williams thinks he's more of a liability to a 'D' that is already being stretched thin because of the injuries in the secondary.

I'm guessing Williams doesn't see LaVar as part of the solution right now and thinks of him as only being part of the problem.

But we're already giving up big plays with the guys who are out there. While I'd like to see LaVar, I'm not saying he's the most disciplined player. I know that's a concern, but why not let him get in on the passing downs and get after the QB? Who do we take out? Killings or Boschetti, and move Wynn over to tackle, he's played there before. I'm not going to completely slam GW, he's done a great job for us. But I still think LaVar can contribute to the D's biggest (only) deficiency, getting turnovers, and there's a way that he can do it (pass rush) that will minimize the concern over undiciplined play.

[NYCSkin]

I think Ray Rhodes, Kurt Schottenheimer, and Marvin Lewis all had the Skins D in the top 5 or 10 when they were here. And they all were able to use LaVar effectively. Part of what makes a great coach is the ability to harness the talented players while getting the most out of those less talented. I think Williams has clearly demonstrated only the latter thus far...

[MTK]

Originally Posted by NYCSkin

I think Ray Rhodes, Kurt Schottenheimer, and Marvin Lewis all had the Skins D in the top 5 or 10 when they were here. And they all were able to use LaVar effectively. Part of what makes a great coach is the ability to harness the talented players while getting the most out of those less talented. I think Williams has clearly demonstrated only the latter thus far...

What about Springs? Griffin? Taylor?

Has he had nothing to do with these more talented players developments?

[NYCSkin]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

What about Springs? Griffin? Taylor?

Has he had nothing to do with these more talented players developments?

By no means do I think that Williams has done NOTHING to get these players to perform better. I never said that. I just am not drinking the Gregg Williams Kool Aid yet--that LaVar is such a liability (that he can't even be out there on 3rd and long!).
Marvin Lewis also thinks that LaVar is a huge freelancer but managed to utilize him to the tune of 11 sacks.
Now I will give Williams some credit: Griffin for one was a bit of an underachiever with the Giants. However, the point is that LaVar is our Kobe, our Iverson, our Garnett. He is the player that strikes fear in the opposing offense and their QB. Trent Green basically admitted to this in Wilbon's postgame article. I haven't heard opposing offenses gameplan against Springs, Griffin, or Taylor.

[saskin]

Originally Posted by NYCSkin

I think Ray Rhodes, Kurt Schottenheimer, and Marvin Lewis all had the Skins D in the top 5 or 10 when they were here. And they all were able to use LaVar effectively. Part of what makes a great coach is the ability to harness the talented players while getting the most out of those less talented. I think Williams has clearly demonstrated only the latter thus far...

But like an article said...they let Arrington become a freelancer and do whatever he wanted....Williams is different, he wants blind alleigance. Unless Arrington can play in the system...I say sit him down.

[BigSKINBauer]

I can't believe we are turning on GW

[drew54]

I just watched 60 seconds with Gregg Williams on RedskinTV, and he said he favorite movie was A few good men with Jack Nicholson, so you know what that means. On the Lavar situation "We can't handle the EFFING truth."

[BigSKINBauer]

while i disagree, that is a very good point, if lavar had given up some of the plays that have been given up the past two weeks everyone would be yelling about it being lavar's fault for overpersuing. If lavar took the place of just daniels and lavar got beat by tatum bell the way he daniels got beat on that first TD in the denver game we would be going crazy on lavar

[DirtBagZ]

I think it is time for management to step in, and force GW to put LaVar in, for one reason, and one reason only, zero turnovers by the defence in four games. Like someone else pointed out Warrick Holdman has all of twelve tackles in five games. I think some of the issues that we have seen in these two losses is because Shawn Springs is injured, but if there is one way to make average or back-up corners look good it is with a pass rush.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by DirtBagZ

I think it is time for management to step in, and force GW to put LaVar in, for one reason, and one reason only, zero turnovers by the defence in four games. Like someone else pointed out Warrick Holdman has all of twelve tackles in five games. I think some of the issues that we have seen in these two losses is because Shawn Springs is injured, but if there is one way to make average or back-up corners look good it is with a pass rush.

So now we're in favor of Snyder meddling with the team?

Wow, what a great idea that is!

[DirtBagZ]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

So now we're in favor of Snyder meddling with the team?

Wow, what a great idea that is!

Management is ALSO Gibbs the TEAM President...I swear if you were not an Admin and could get me banned I would really tell you what I think of your ....opinions. That is an uncalled for personal attack...which I think you get away with too much of since you are an admin.

But I guess that cannot happen since Gibbs is also the head coach, he cannot over rule or undermine his staff. This is yet another reason why the headcoach/GM/Team President all in one person does not work. Why would the team invest $60+ Million in a guy if he is going to ride the pine?