Redskins fire GM Scot McCloughan

[MTK]

If his ceiling is nearly 5000 yards and 25 TDs sign me up.

[SkinsGuru]

Originally Posted by MTK

If his ceiling is nearly 5000 yards and 25 TDs sign me up.

i agree with SM that cousins needs a stellar team around him to succeed instead of (like brady, manning, rogers, brees, etc.) being able to elevate whoever gets put around them . . . hence why paying him more than those others is a lot more difficult

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by MTK

If his ceiling is nearly 5000 yards and 25 TDs sign me up.

Yeah exactly, and here's the thing about McCloughan's comments. When you take Cousins's performance in a vacuum, I don't think he's too far off in saying he has hit his ceiling. Meaning Cousins's mobility, arm talent, mechanics, and accuracy are all pretty much maxed.

But that doesn't mean his production is maxed, and I think McCloughan would say the same.

If the Redskins get more consistent running, especially in short yardage situations, then Cousins's production should improve because he should reach the red zone more often. And if the Redskins get more out of their WRs in the red zone because of the improved size and hops at the position, that should lead to more TDs.

So Cousins could perform at his personal ceiling this year, yet put up 4900 yards and 32 TDs. It's a reminder that this is a team sport, and your production is at least partially dependent on those around you.

Rather than thinking about where his ceiling is, and what that's worth, I'd think about whether this team could win a title with him if we surround him with the right pieces. I believe it can. The defense is still a long way but I think he fits as a piece of a championship puzzle. If I were GM I'd be making a long term offer in the $22M - $23M range. Hopefully that's what they plan on doing in July.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Yeah exactly, and here's the thing about McCloughan's comments. When you take Cousins's performance in a vacuum, I don't think he's too far off in saying he has hit his ceiling. Meaning Cousins's mobility, arm talent, mechanics, and accuracy are all pretty much maxed.

But that doesn't mean his production is maxed, and I think McCloughan would say the same.

If the Redskins get more consistent running, especially in short yardage situations, then Cousins's production should improve because he should reach the red zone more often. And if the Redskins get more out of their WRs in the red zone because of the improved size and hops at the position, that should lead to more TDs.

So Cousins could perform at his personal ceiling this year, yet put up 4900 yards and 32 TDs. It's a reminder that this is a team sport, and your production is at least partially dependent on those around you.

Rather than thinking about where his ceiling is, and what that's worth, I'd think about whether this team could win a title with him if we surround him with the right pieces. I believe it can. The defense is still a long way but I think he fits as a piece of a championship puzzle. If I were GM I'd be making a long term offer in the $22M - $23M range. Hopefully that's what they plan on doing in July.

How high would you go? I don't think he will sign for less than 24 maybe 25 would you go to 26 if that's what it took?

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[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

How high would you go? I don't think he will sign for less than 24 maybe 25 would you go to 26 if that's what it took?

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Well I guess I see that part of it differently. I really don't think he'll make a fuss over $25M or $23M per year, I think where he would get concerned is on the guaranteed portion. So far the Skins have been downright insulting on that side of it.

I think if you offer him 5 years $115M with $60M of it guaranteed, I think he takes it. I don't think he's out to milk the team out of every last dollar, he just wants the guarantee he deserves and that makes sense to sign a long termer instead of taking it year to year.

[SkinsGuru]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Well I guess I see that part of it differently. I really don't think he'll make a fuss over $25M or $23M per year, I think where he would get concerned is on the guaranteed portion. So far the Skins have been downright insulting on that side of it.

I think if you offer him 5 years $115M with $60M of it guaranteed, I think he takes it. I don't think he's out to milk the team out of every last dollar, he just wants the guarantee he deserves and that makes sense to sign a long termer instead of taking it year to year.

his agent said he wants 25 per and 75 gauranteed

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by SkinsGuru

his agent said he wants 25 per and 75 gauranteed

Agents say a lot of things. If he insists on that much, and won't sign with us for any less, I would have to see what I could get in a trade, honestly.

But like I said, I truly think if it comes down to it, he won't try to suck every last dollar out. I do believe he wants to be here.

[SkinsGuru]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Agents say a lot of things. If he insists on that much, and won't sign with us for any less, I would have to see what I could get in a trade, honestly.

But like I said, I truly think if it comes down to it, he won't try to suck every last dollar out. I do believe he wants to be here.

i hope your right, but i am not counting on it . . . i know i wouldn't give a upper middle tier QB the highest paying contract in the history of the sport

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Well I guess I see that part of it differently. I really don't think he'll make a fuss over $25M or $23M per year, I think where he would get concerned is on the guaranteed portion. So far the Skins have been downright insulting on that side of it.

I think if you offer him 5 years $115M with $60M of it guaranteed, I think he takes it. I don't think he's out to milk the team out of every last dollar, he just wants the guarantee he deserves and that makes sense to sign a long termer instead of taking it year to year.

He is guaranteed 24M this year and barring injury and/or a complete breakdown of his game this year he is guaranteed a minimum of 29M (transition tag) next year. I think for him to sign a long term deal before July 15 the Skins would have to offer at least 75 guaranteed or basically 3 years at 24M. I also think he has very little desire to stay a Skin and would prefer to see where the free agent market would set his salary.

I think the contract KC would sign is in the range of Luck's contract. If the Skins offer a "fair" contract and he rejects it than I have no problem not paying him top 3 money for what his performance has been.

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[KI Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

He is guaranteed 24M this year and barring injury and/or a complete breakdown of his game this year he is guaranteed a minimum of 29M (transition tag) next year. I think for him to sign a long term deal before July 15 the Skins would have to offer at least 75 guaranteed or basically 3 years at 24M. I also think he has very little desire to stay a Skin and would prefer to see where the free agent market would set his salary.

I think the contract KC would sign is in the range of Luck's contract. If the Skins offer a "fair" contract and he rejects it than I have no problem not paying him top 3 money for what his performance has been.

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I couldn't care less if the Skins were to overpay to keep Kirk Cousins. I don't care one iota how his contract compares to any other player's contract. They can pay him twice as much as Tom Brady makes for all I care. I just want them to sign him to a long-term contract.

We all know our history with QB's and, with that in mind, I have no desire to see the Skins gamble once again at that critical position. I believe that Kirk is good enough now to get us where we want to go and he gets even better every season.

To the Skins management I say this: "We have a QB we can win with for the next 5 to 10 years. That QB is Kirk Cousins. So just shut up and pay up!

[mredskins]

Originally Posted by KI Skins Fan

I couldn't care less if the Skins were to overpay to keep Kirk Cousins. I don't care one iota how his contract compares to any other player's contract. They can pay him twice as much as Tom Brady makes for all I care. I just want them to sign him to a long-term contract.

We all know our history with QB's and, with that in mind, I have no desire to see the Skins gamble once again at that critical position. I believe that Kirk is good enough now to get us where we want to go and he gets even better every season.

To the Skins management I say this: "We have a QB we can win with for the next 5 to 10 years. That QB is Kirk Cousins. So just shut up and pay up!

You will care when they can't afford to put anyone around him. That is the foundation of the argument. Is Kirk good enough that you can over pay him a bit and his talent makes up for the lost of potential players we could have had if not for his salary. B-more some what has that problem now with Joe F. and his contract.