Basically, it all starts with Portis

[That Guy]

sounds like you should get a job a GM, since everyone else (besides you) is obviously an idiot.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by That Guy

sounds like you should get a job a GM, since everyone else (besides you) is obviously an idiot.

While he may not have any business being a GM, his post was exactly right. We overpay, give up draft picks, have no depth on the D-line, and if one player goes down, there's no one who can adequately replace him -- see Boschetti, Killings, and Aki Jones. Gibbs, Snyder, and Cerrato cannot escape blame for that.

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

While he may not have any business being a GM, his post was exactly right. We overpay, give up draft picks, have no depth on the D-line, and if one player goes down, there's no one who can adequately replace him -- see Boschetti, Killings, and Aki Jones. Gibbs, Snyder, and Cerrato cannot escape blame for that.

I get your point..................but, If he doesn't have any business being GM, it would tend to discount the accuracy of his argument.
In a perfect world some of these things may be true. However, when Gibbs and his team took the skins, as we all know, the team had been in COMPLETE disarray for some time. When you must make radical player changes immediately, and the timing is not of your choosing, you make the best deal you can. It may not be the deal you want. Being in a weak bargaining position, makes it impossible to drive a really good deal, so you do the best you can.
Additionally, it is real easy to blow up a speculative, foundationless commentary when the author has no skin on the table.

[offiss]

Originally Posted by Hog1

I get your point..................but, If he doesn't have any business being GM, it would tend to discount the accuracy of his argument.
In a perfect world some of these things may be true. However, when Gibbs and his team took the skins, as we all know, the team had been in COMPLETE disarray for some time. When you must make radical player changes immediately, and the timing is not of your choosing, you make the best deal you can. It may not be the deal you want. Being in a weak bargaining position, makes it impossible to drive a really good deal, so you do the best you can.
Additionally, it is real easy to blow up a speculative, foundationless commentary when the author has no skin on the table.

Relying on another posters ignorant comment as the basis to discredit a post you don't agree with is as baseless as it gets, why don't you go ahead and explain how we are better off for having all 4 of those players, all 4 of which I said we shouldn't either extend their contracts, or trade for, before their signings became reality, now my evaluation of these players are starting to become more and more apparent, and yet so long as they play for the skins they are somehow better than what they really are because their redskins.


You make it sound as if we were pigeonholed into the Portis trade, or the Brunell trade, or resigning Samuels, what about Lavar?

Portis- 50.mil
Lavar- 68mil
Samuels- 47mil
Brunell- 43mil

Thats 208 million dollar's between 4 players, I want to hear which individual believes that these are deal's that are, decent, or even liveable, those salaries are disgusting for what they bring to the table, DISGUSTING!

No 208 million minus those 4 wouldn't go towards vastly improving our team? NOOOOOOOOO?

Further more if you can't get the deal you want don't go out and break the bank to do so.

[FirstandTen]

Were not the only team making mistakes. Here's a list of the top 25 player salaries in 2004.

Manning, Peyton $ 35,037,700 Indianapolis Colts
2 Pennington, Chad $ 19,004,000 New York Jets
3 Kearse, Jevon $ 16,536,500 Philadelphia Eagles
4 Tomlinson, LaDainian $ 16,000,000 San Diego Chargers
5 Wistrom, Grant $ 15,503,200 Seattle Seahawks
6 Portis, Clinton $ 13,380,000 Washington Redskins
7 Tait, John $ 13,085,000 Chicago Bears
8 Vick, Michael $ 12,502,400 Atlanta Falcons
9 Winfield, Antoine $ 12,500,000 Minnesota Vikings
10 Arrington, LaVar $ 11,835,000 Washington Redskins
11 Walker, Gary $ 11,804,000 Houston Texans
12 Clifton, Chad $ 11,536,500 Green Bay Packers
13 Woody, Damien $ 11,504,000 Detroit Lions
14 McNabb, Donovan $ 11,002,300 Philadelphia Eagles
15 Springs, Shawn $ 10,910,000 Washington Redskins
16 Ogden, Jonathan $ 10,660,299 Baltimore Ravens
17 Harrison, Marvin $ 10,560,165 Indianapolis Colts
18 Wade, Todd $ 10,539,800 Houston Texans
19 McAlister, Chris $ 10,534,906 Baltimore Ravens
20 Robertson, Dewayne $ 10,516,250 New York Jets
21 Ogunleye, Adewale $ 10,455,000 Chicago Bears
22 Rogers, Shaun $ 9,480,000 Detroit Lions
23 Bulger, Marc $ 9,459,200 St. Louis Rams
24 Brunell, Mark $ 9,364,300 Washington Redskins
25 Gallery, Robert $ 9,300,016 Oakland Raiders

[Southpaw]

Originally Posted by offiss

Portis- 50.mil
Lavar- 68mil
Samuels- 47mil
Brunell- 43mil

Thats 208 million dollar's between 4 players, I want to hear which individual believes that these are deal's that are, decent, or even liveable, those salaries are disgusting for what they bring to the table, DISGUSTING!

No 208 million minus those 4 wouldn't go towards vastly improving our team? NOOOOOOOOO?

So you're suggesting we could've taken all that money and done what with it? If Snyder had not spent the money on those players, he would've done the exact same thing, but with different players. So instead of paying our current stars, three of which are in the prime of their careers, we'd have 100 million plus locked up in the 2005 versions of Deion Sanders, Bruce Smith, and Jeff George.

Every team in the league pays big bucks to it's stars. If you want a team with a bunch of low payed nobodies, become an Arizona Cardinals fan.

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by offiss

Relying on another posters ignorant comment as the basis to discredit a post you don't agree with is as baseless as it gets, why don't you go ahead and explain how we are better off for having all 4 of those players, all 4 of which I said we shouldn't either extend their contracts, or trade for, before their signings became reality, now my evaluation of these players are starting to become more and more apparent, and yet so long as they play for the skins they are somehow better than what they really are because their redskins.


You make it sound as if we were pigeonholed into the Portis trade, or the Brunell trade, or resigning Samuels, what about Lavar?

Portis- 50.mil
Lavar- 68mil
Samuels- 47mil
Brunell- 43mil

Thats 208 million dollar's between 4 players, I want to hear which individual believes that these are deal's that are, decent, or even liveable, those salaries are disgusting for what they bring to the table, DISGUSTING!

No 208 million minus those 4 wouldn't go towards vastly improving our team? NOOOOOOOOO?

Further more if you can't get the deal you want don't go out and break the bank to do so.

What you are trying to pass as an arguement is ABSURD! What NFL contract goes to completion without restructure? Who would you have replace Brunell, and for what price? Do you suggest he is not doing the job? What do you envision as a legitimate, realistic salary for a starting NFL QB? More importantly, WHAT could POSSIBLY make you BELIEVE YOUR opinion is anything more than that????? I ask this question because I CANNOT POSSIBLY imagine!

[STPainmaker]

Mind your words your post is no better than anyone elses.


[QUOTE=offiss]Relying on another posters ignorant comment as the basis to discredit a post

[offiss]

Originally Posted by That Guy

sounds like you should get a job a GM, since everyone else (besides you) is obviously an idiot.

It's not like I would expect you to understand what I am talking about, there is a difference between a football man, and a football fan, I never called anyone an idiot, but if lack of understanding and insight on the breakdown of the game makes you feel like one, that's something you will have to deal with.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by offiss

It's not like I would expect you to understand what I am talking about, there is a difference between a football man, and a football fan, I never called anyone an idiot, but if lack of understanding and insight on the breakdown of the game makes you feel like one, that's something you will have to deal with.

apparently understanding isn't really your forte, since a simple post seems to have gone way over your head. better luck next time.

Your post was just another I told you so based on nothing... I see no facts that in any way prove you could have done better or that the redskins would be better without those players... who'd replace CS, how much would he cost? what about portis? what's hiss replacements price tag? you think betts would have performed nearly as well? if so i'd say you'd be in a small minority there. Next time before busting out the holier-than-thou, look-how-smart-i-am, I-told-you-so, the-FO-sucks-because-they're-not-doing-what-i-told-them-to-do-in-hindsight
crap, maybe you should take a deep breathe and not be so reactionary.

how come you didn't make such a big f**cking deal about this last week? or the week before? all of a sudden we lose and suprise, we've got a home grown genius with enough hindsight to tell us all why life isn't worth living if not done his way.

what you offered wasn't a breakdown (those contain facts and analysis) - it was another pointless convenient rant following a loss.

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by That Guy

apparently understanding isn't really your forte, since a simple post seems to have gone way over your head. better luck next time.

Your post was just another I told you so based on nothing... I see no facts that in any way prove you could have done better or that the redskins would be better without those players... who'd replace CS, how much would he cost? what about portis? what's hiss replacements price tag? you think betts would have performed nearly as well? if so i'd say you'd be in a small minority there. Next time before busting out the holier-than-thou, look-how-smart-i-am, I-told-you-so, the-FO-sucks-because-they're-not-doing-what-i-told-them-to-do-in-hindsight
crap, maybe you should take a deep breathe and not be so reactionary.

how come you didn't make such a big f**cking deal about this last week? or the week before? all of a sudden we lose and suprise, we've got a home grown genius with enough hindsight to tell us all why life isn't worth living if not done his way.

what you offered wasn't a breakdown (those contain facts and analysis) - it was another pointless convenient rant following a loss.

NUF' SAID!

[MTK]

Originally Posted by That Guy

how come you didn't make such a big f**cking deal about this last week? or the week before? all of a sudden we lose and suprise, we've got a home grown genius with enough hindsight to tell us all why life isn't worth living if not done his way.

what you offered wasn't a breakdown (those contain facts and analysis) - it was another pointless convenient rant following a loss.

Haven't you picked up on this pattern yet?

After a loss that's when all the armchair GMs come out to play.

Boring and predictable.

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Haven't you picked up on this pattern yet?

After a loss that's when all the armchair GMs come out to play.

Boring and predictable.

AMEN!

[offiss]

Originally Posted by That Guy

apparently understanding isn't really your forte, since a simple post seems to have gone way over your head. better luck next time.

Your post was just another I told you so based on nothing... I see no facts that in any way prove you could have done better or that the redskins would be better without those players... who'd replace CS, how much would he cost? what about portis? what's hiss replacements price tag? you think betts would have performed nearly as well? if so i'd say you'd be in a small minority there. Next time before busting out the holier-than-thou, look-how-smart-i-am, I-told-you-so, the-FO-sucks-because-they're-not-doing-what-i-told-them-to-do-in-hindsight
crap, maybe you should take a deep breathe and not be so reactionary.

how come you didn't make such a big f**cking deal about this last week? or the week before? all of a sudden we lose and suprise, we've got a home grown genius with enough hindsight to tell us all why life isn't worth living if not done his way.

what you offered wasn't a breakdown (those contain facts and analysis) - it was another pointless convenient rant following a loss.

How ignorant can you be I have been saying it for a year and a half, the fact is you have offered no solution other than Lavar, Portis, Samuels, and Brunell are great and deserve the money they are getting because we would have paid someone else who can't play that kind of money so might as well be them.

The fact is teams who know what they are doing personel wise do it through the draft so they don't blow the roof off their cap, so they do have enough money to add the right veteran to put the team over the hump.

The fact is the facts are right in front of you every sunday, but apparently you ain't watching.

So I am to surmise that Portis is every bit the 50 million $ back in your eyes, I am to surmise that Samuels is an elite left tackle? Your buddy Lavar is without question an elite LB? And Brunell who has lost 3 of our last 4 games, 2 of which were winnable is worth every penny? Brunell is the only one that a case can be remotly made, take a good look at what happened against the Giants they pressured him he didn't have a huge buffer to get comfortable with, and so from the very first pass play he had major happy feet, Brunell has proven he can be very effective against teams that don't pressure the QB, he needs to show he can do it when the going gets rough.


Life is not worth living aaay, kind of funny that the problem here is that my opinion differs with yours, so in other words everyone should listen to your opinion for the same reasons you say not listen to mine, the only difference is you make it personal, why? Because we both no your nothing more than a wannabe football man who has made his own evaluations about these players in the past and can't handle watching those evaluations blow up in your face.

By the way I have been sick for 2 weeks, so I wasen't posting regardless, but just for the record I said we shouldn't use San fran as a barometer for our team, and correct me if I am wrong but we did lose the 2 previous games before that didn't we?

Bottom line I am real tired of educating you on the game, you can continue to believe that there is no way to replace the big$ 4 with better players, apparently they are the best in the NFL at their perspective positions so theres no way to find players for elite contracts to replace them, you know like Lamar a journeyman scrub did for Lavar last season, and I will believe that we could have done a heck of a lot better with that kind of money if we evaluate properly, will we still make mistakes? Sure, all teams no matter how good make mistakes, but they don't have to be as often and to the magnitude that we have done!

Further more lets hear your opinion on whats wrong, I want to know how you would go about fixing our problems, and until you come up with your own opinion [other than I trust Gibbs] don't mock those who do.

This is a message board, in which wouldn't exsist if it wasen't for peoples opinions, that's what this is all about, it's not written anywhere that you have to agree with anyone here, if you don't agree and would like to express that then do so with what you believe to be true, not with personel attacks, have the guts to open yourself up to critisism.

I would love to see your your short list of players that those 4 are better than, or who's better than they at their positions, and then compare their salaries, would you at least do that for me?

[Southpaw]

Originally Posted by offiss

How ignorant can you be I have been saying it for a year and a half, the fact is you have offered no solution other than Lavar, Portis, Samuels, and Brunell are great and deserve the money they are getting because we would have paid someone else who can't play that kind of money so might as well be them.

The fact is teams who know what they are doing personel wise do it through the draft so they don't blow the roof off their cap, so they do have enough money to add the right veteran to put the team over the hump.

I don't think one person said that any of those players are worth the money they're being paid. Most of us have just learned to accept the fact that our franchise's current owner is going to give insanely large contracts to whoever the hell he wants, with no regard to actual market value.

All of your comments are basically just a stab at Snyder and his loose checkbook, but really, what's the point? Bashing Snyder is like shooting fish in a barrel. You make the comment that "good teams do this and that", but when was the last time that this was a "good team", especially on the organizational level? And as far as building the team through the draft, maybe you don't recall, but we drafted Arrington and Samuels.