Did Gibbs Make the Wrong Call?

[BigSKINBauer]

Originally Posted by Gmanc711

Hey Guys, was able to get to a comp real quick, I'll have a full thread on my experiance in Tampa, which was incredible, loss aside ,when I go home Wen.

yeah i heard you were in a VERY good position to see the action on the field

[railcon56]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

usually you and I see eye to eye on things, but this time I have to disagree. You run the ball in that situation 99% of the time, or atleast Gibbs does. He always has been this way and probably always will. He won 3 super bowls with his "conservative" calls. we are too deep in our own territory to rish a throw. He may get sacked, fumble, int, what ever. too many risk factors involved to throw. Fact remains, the skins should have been able to run the ball to get two yards. We didn't , so we punted. What I am failing to hear is the fact the punter hit another bad punt. where is Tupa when you need him. the punt was only a net of about 30 yards, beside the fact it was a line drive punt. If he punts the ball deeper, we may be able to hold on. The whole team lost this game, but the punter seems to be getting a free ride here. He has not been a good punter up to this game and I dont see him changing anytime soon. Field position is key in that situation, and he blew it first, then the D blew it big at the end.

Oh that play didn't lose the game .... but I hate that thing where we play for the last possesion ...offense or defense and win it...we need to put people away...but that 1 play didn't lose the game...and i think the NFL is far more explosive than when gibbs won his superbowls...step on their necks and shoot them in the head..kick em when they are down!!!!

[firstdown]

Wrong call, every team knows Gibbs is going to run the ball in that situation. He has had very little success running on third and short when we have the lead late in the game. If we looked up the stat for three and outs late in a game I think we would find they are very high. Back when we had the Hogs and the could run at will it was the right call. D lineman have become bigger and quicker making that play alot tougher. I'm not saying always pass in that situation but mix it up some so th D's are not sure what we are going to do.

[#56fanatic]

Originally Posted by firstdown

Wrong call, every team knows Gibbs is going to run the ball in that situation. He has had very little success running on third and short when we have the lead late in the game. If we looked up the stat for three and outs late in a game I think we would find they are very high. Back when we had the Hogs and the could run at will it was the right call. D lineman have become bigger and quicker making that play alot tougher. I'm not saying always pass in that situation but mix it up some so th D's are not sure what we are going to do.

I dont know if it was the wrong call, my opinion is it wasn't. However, one part we all may agree on is maybe the wrong guy running the ball. If you need to grind out a measly 2 yards, put somebody in there that is going to fall forward for 2 yards after getting hit. Betts, Sellers, maybe even rock or broughton. Portis just needs a little more of a hole to make yards than those guys. those guys can plow forward and push the pile a few yards.

[Redskins_P]

We were having so much success running the ball throughout the entire game, so in my mind it was the logical thing to do.

If we would've passed and not made it....probably half of the people here would've been calling for Gibbs head.

Its all hindsight....

[FirstandTen]

Take a look at what happened to PHilly last night when they passed in the same situation.

[Redskins_P]

Originally Posted by FirstandTen

Take a look at what happened to PHilly last night when they passed in the same situation.

Thank you!!!

[skins052bgr8]

Originally Posted by FirstandTen

Take a look at what happened to PHilly last night when they passed in the same situation.

What does the Philly game have to do with our game, you have to play the game we could have fumbled on the run, we could have had the pass intercepted if we passed. Look at the two point conversion in our game is that the norm, but doing something risky can also win you the game so look at the Tampa game. If I have learned anything when you start doing things different than you have done the whole game like we were mixing it up high percentage passes, some stretch plays, hitting the middle, spreading the ball around you lose. Then we go three straight plays nose dive into the guard and tackle when we had been converting first downs all game with what we were doing. Similar to the way some defenses do it and we did for many years in the past shut teams down and then go to a prevent defense and we would lose. To say three straight runs was the answer you are wrong we needed a first down, call plays to do that not run additional 25 seconds off the clock. As we have seen it was two minutes plus on the clock all the Bucs needed and many NFL teams is about in this case 58 seconds. All we did was give them time to drive the field twice on us so thank heavens we saved the 25 seconds. You can accomplish all the above if you can keep a defense on it's toes which we have not in this exact same situation in numerous games. Luckily the Eagles could not get in last week ina very similar situation with us. Luckily the Seahawks missed the field goal, we put the ball back in the Cowboys hands, we put the ball back in Tampas hands. If you look back at those stalled drives you will see very simialr play calling I call that predictable in that situation.

[#56fanatic]

Originally Posted by skins052bgr8

What does the Philly game have to do with our game, you have to play the game we could have fumbled on the run, we could have had the pass intercepted if we passed. Look at the two point conversion in our game is that the norm, but doing something risky can also win you the game so look at the Tampa game. If I have learned anything when you start doing things different than you have done the whole game like we were mixing it up high percentage passes, some stretch plays, hitting the middle, spreading the ball around you lose. Then we go three straight plays nose dive into the guard and tackle when we had been converting first downs all game with what we were doing. Similar to the way some defenses do it and we did for many years in the past shut teams down and then go to a prevent defense and we would lose. To say three straight runs was the answer you are wrong we needed a first down, call plays to do that not run additional 25 seconds off the clock. As we have seen it was two minutes plus on the clock all the Bucs needed and many NFL teams is about in this case 58 seconds. All we did was give them time to drive the field twice on us so thank heavens we saved the 25 seconds. You can accomplish all the above if you can keep a defense on it's toes which we have not in this exact same situation in numerous games. Luckily the Eagles could not get in last week ina very similar situation with us. Luckily the Seahawks missed the field goal, we put the ball back in the Cowboys hands, we put the ball back in Tampas hands. If you look back at those stalled drives you will see very simialr play calling I call that predictable in that situation.

I have the feeling that if we would have attempted a pass and had it intersepted, or a sack and fumble or incomplete people would be bitching about not running the ball and taking more time off the clock. Joe knows what the hell he's doing, see the 3 trophies in the showcase at redskin park. If we get the first down on the run everyone would be saying what a call, the defense was looking for the pass and we ran. So I think its damn if you do and damn if you dont. Joe has won almost more than any coach in the NFL by calling games the same way he did last Sunday. the fact is, the O line could not get the tough yards at the end of the game, which good O lines and teams do. The Hogs use to tell people they were coming right at them, and dare you to stop them. This team does not have that mentality or confidence, YET!! When we do, we will be running the ball down peoples throat at the end of games. Our defense should have played a little more conservative and not given up the big play. If anyone is at fault, fault Greg Williams for calling the same defensive plays that we were getting burned on all day long.

[FirstandTen]

Originally Posted by skins052bgr8

What does the Philly game have to do with our game, you have to play the game we could have fumbled on the run, we could have had the pass intercepted if we passed. Look at the two point conversion in our game is that the norm, but doing something risky can also win you the game so look at the Tampa game. If I have learned anything when you start doing things different than you have done the whole game like we were mixing it up high percentage passes, some stretch plays, hitting the middle, spreading the ball around you lose. Then we go three straight plays nose dive into the guard and tackle when we had been converting first downs all game with what we were doing. Similar to the way some defenses do it and we did for many years in the past shut teams down and then go to a prevent defense and we would lose. To say three straight runs was the answer you are wrong we needed a first down, call plays to do that not run additional 25 seconds off the clock. As we have seen it was two minutes plus on the clock all the Bucs needed and many NFL teams is about in this case 58 seconds. All we did was give them time to drive the field twice on us so thank heavens we saved the 25 seconds. You can accomplish all the above if you can keep a defense on it's toes which we have not in this exact same situation in numerous games. Luckily the Eagles could not get in last week ina very similar situation with us. Luckily the Seahawks missed the field goal, we put the ball back in the Cowboys hands, we put the ball back in Tampas hands. If you look back at those stalled drives you will see very simialr play calling I call that predictable in that situation.

Its predictable because its the right call. Eat as much time off the clock try to get a 1st down. If not punt and force the team to go the length of the field with little time on the clock. Its not like weren't able to run on them all game.

[onsidekick]

Originally Posted by FirstandTen

Its predictable because its the right call. Eat as much time off the clock try to get a 1st down. If not punt and force the team to go the length of the field with little time on the clock. Its not like weren't able to run on them all game.

Sunday was our best rushing performance of the season. We dominated the line of scrimmage when we ran but really ONLY when we ran. Our pass blocking was admittedly suspect and helped in causing a turnover earlier in the game. The fact that we didn't get the most important 1st down sucks but our run blocking and Portis earned the coaches' trust all game.

[skins052bgr8]

Originally Posted by FirstandTen

Its predictable because its the right call. Eat as much time off the clock try to get a 1st down. If not punt and force the team to go the length of the field with little time on the clock. Its not like weren't able to run on them all game.

I'm not saying we did not run on them all game because we did, I am saying that still mix it up even if we ran the ball all game I can bet we never did that same play 3 times in a row. I don't question Gibbs, just my opinion that we handled that drive different than we did all other drives. Predictable does not get you wins in today's NFL, so please how many times have we compared the 80's and ninties game to today's personnel and game. You can't and I think we learned that last year when we ran the 80's and ninties offense last year and had the lowest production in almost all the NFL. So I don't care if it worked for the Hogs it has not worked for us in 2005 in quite a few games. I would not have questioned the call because 3rd and inches is sometimes hard to get in that situation let alone third and two. We got 6yards then 2 yards then 0 maybe 1 yard on third. We have been successful on a lot of our third down conversions this year I would be curious how many were pass and how many were run. It is all hindsight and would be different if we won, but we did not so it leaves it open for discussion and opinion correct. If the run was so solid I can recall our two point conversion was a pass, I can recall another short third down conversion pass to Cooley, another third down for a touchdown to Sellers a pass. Everyone is hung up on that 25 seconds we ran off the clock and if we threw a int.

[FirstandTen]

Originally Posted by skins052bgr8

I'm not saying we did not run on them all game because we did, I am saying that still mix it up even if we ran the ball all game I can bet we never did that same play 3 times in a row. I don't question Gibbs, just my opinion that we handled that drive different than we did all other drives. Predictable does not get you wins in today's NFL, so please how many times have we compared the 80's and ninties game to today's personnel and game. You can't and I think we learned that last year when we ran the 80's and ninties offense last year and had the lowest production in almost all the NFL. So I don't care if it worked for the Hogs it has not worked for us in 2005 in quite a few games. I would not have questioned the call because 3rd and inches is sometimes hard to get in that situation let alone third and two. We got 6yards then 2 yards then 0 maybe 1 yard on third. We have been successful on a lot of our third down conversions this year I would be curious how many were pass and how many were run. It is all hindsight and would be different if we won, but we did not so it leaves it open for discussion and opinion correct. If the run was so solid I can recall our two point conversion was a pass, I can recall another short third down conversion pass to Cooley, another third down for a touchdown to Sellers a pass. Everyone is hung up on that 25 seconds we ran off the clock and if we threw a int.

Wow ur furious ! I never said anything about 80's or 90's or the Hogs where did that come from? You dusted them off for no reason. Scoring 35pts I think the O is fine. Everyone's not just hung up on the 25 sec's everyone just knows that there were 5 or 6 reasons we lost this game.
Running the ball on third down was guaranteed to keep the clock moving, and a high percentage to get the first down considering how were running the ball. A pass could be incomplete stopping the clock, picked off, or Brunell could get sacked and loose yardage. Oline had to chance to step up and win the game and they did not. That still left our Def with a good chance to stop them.

[skins052bgr8]

Originally Posted by FirstandTen

Wow ur furious ! I never said anything about 80's or 90's or the Hogs where did that come from? You dusted them off for no reason. Scoring 35pts I think the O is fine. Everyone's not just hung up on the 25 sec's everyone just knows that there were 5 or 6 reasons we lost this game.
Running the ball on third down was guaranteed to keep the clock moving, and a high percentage to get the first down considering how were running the ball. A pass could be incomplete stopping the clock, picked off, or Brunell could get sacked and loose yardage. Oline had to chance to step up and win the game and they did not. That still left our Def with a good chance to stop them.

Not furious just responding to an earlier reply about four or five previous that commented 56fanatic check them out there are other opinions than mine or yours. His just happened to be about about Gibbs and three trophies and the Hogs, not attacking you or anybody. I didn't say this was the only reason we lost only commenting on this post that is in reference to Gibbs call on the last drive. There are plenty of other posts questioning turnovers, Alstott, and the other reasons we lost the game, just keeping with the theme. What was Tampa Bay thinking when they threw on that last drive didn't they know it could have been picked off, the clock stopped we drove down the field and scored with time on the clock, or Simms been sacked. These things can happen on any play of the game why alter that because it is the last drive or the second to last drive, etc...

[offiss]

Originally Posted by FirstandTen

Wow ur furious ! I never said anything about 80's or 90's or the Hogs where did that come from? You dusted them off for no reason. Scoring 35pts I think the O is fine. Everyone's not just hung up on the 25 sec's everyone just knows that there were 5 or 6 reasons we lost this game.
Running the ball on third down was guaranteed to keep the clock moving, and a high percentage to get the first down considering how were running the ball. A pass could be incomplete stopping the clock, picked off, or Brunell could get sacked and loose yardage. Oline had to chance to step up and win the game and they did not. That still left our Def with a good chance to stop them.

Well the flow of the game was defiently tilting towards Tampa, they found our week spot down the middle and we weren't stopping them, so the correct call is to get a first down, the key in that situatuation is not to run one minute off the clock, the key is to not allow Tampa an opportunity on offense, without a firstdown Tampa gets the ball back with enough time to drive the length of the field, considering how fast they were carving up our secondary at that point we should have played desperate for a 1st down, not go into a shell worried about a possible TO, or stoppage of the clock.

But I guess we don't learn, Gibbs is bent on proving Portis is the all around back that he keeps telling us he is, Portis is not going to make yards on his own powering the ball, then consider our line and the lack of push and there it is, we can't run the ball in obvious running situations, so why try when the game is on the line? That is the weekest part of our offense and yet at the most crucial point in the game we go to our weekest link to win it, kind of like Mariano Rivera throwing 3 changeup's in a row with the bases loaded up 3 in the 9th, just doesn't make sense.