WFT's Off-Season Thread

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by MTK

Since Kirk left he's 25-21-1 in Minnesota. We're 17-31. Sorry but Kirk wins again.

I think it is ridiculous for people to say that Kirk is a scrub and that Heinecke is better than him.

That being said, I don't think Kirk gets us to 25-21-1 had he stayed in our team. He would have given us stability at the position, but we wouldn't have had the offensive pieces he's had in Minnesota.

[Chief X_Phackter]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

I think it is ridiculous for people to say that Kirk is a scrub and that Heinecke is better than him.

That being said, I don't think Kirk gets us to 25-21-1 had he stayed in our team. He would have given us stability at the position, but we wouldn't have had the offensive pieces he's had in Minnesota.

It's tough to compare QBs since they don't have the same personnel around them.

He's hands down better than anyone we have had since he left though.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

I think it is ridiculous for people to say that Kirk is a scrub and that Heinecke is better than him.

That being said, I don't think Kirk gets us to 25-21-1 had he stayed in our team. He would have given us stability at the position, but we wouldn't have had the offensive pieces he's had in Minnesota.

We'll never know because we let that ship sail. And then we failed to trade him once it was obvious he wasn't coming back. So many mistakes.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by MTK

Since Kirk left he's 25-21-1 in Minnesota. We're 17-31. Sorry but Kirk wins again.

Minnesota was 21 - 11 with Keenum and Bradford. KC was a significant downgrade because of his contract value versus the cap. They had to cut or not sign significant pieces because an average to slightly above average QB demanded and received top 3 salary. Like you said, Dak (and KC at the time) got the pay because that is what you had to do to sign a qb in their market, but I am glad we didn't pay KC, and if AS hadn't gotten hurt, records would bear out that we paid less for a better end result.

The point of all of this isn't to rehash KC - you brought him up, but to look at the effect of paying a non elite qb elite money. Better to roll with a mid level and build up the team around him. No matter what, the qb spot will always be a problem that very few teams find long term elite answers for.

[BaltimoreSkins]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Minnesota was 21 - 11 with Keenum and Bradford. KC was a significant downgrade because of his contract value versus the cap. They had to cut or not sign significant pieces because an average to slightly above average QB demanded and received top 3 salary. Like you said, Dak (and KC at the time) got the pay because that is what you had to do to sign a qb in their market, but I am glad we didn't pay KC, and if AS hadn't gotten hurt, records would bear out that we paid less for a better end result.

The point of all of this isn't to rehash KC - you brought him up, but to look at the effect of paying a non elite qb elite money. Better to roll with a mid level and build up the team around him. No matter what, the qb spot will always be a problem that very few teams find long term elite answers for.

I think alot of that is on the GM though his cap hit wasn't that much in 2020 or now in 2021. It will be a doozy in 2022 though! https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/minnesot...-cousins-9915/

[SkinsGuru]

Originally Posted by MTK

Since Kirk left he's 25-21-1 in Minnesota. We're 17-31. Sorry but Kirk wins again.

Casey Keenum was 11-3 with that roster minus the upgrades they added for Kirk. they had a great defence and kick ass receivers with one of the best running games in the league. Kirk was supposed to be the move to get them over the hump and into the superbowl . . . but instead they regressed BAD with kirk at the helm.

[rocnrik]

Originally Posted by SkinsGuru

Casey Keenum was 11-3 with that roster minus the upgrades they added for Kirk. they had a great defence and kick ass receivers with one of the best running games in the league. Kirk was supposed to be the move to get them over the hump and into the superbowl . . . but instead they regressed BAD with kirk at the helm.

Yep ... that’s the way it is !

[BaltimoreSkins]

Three years later and we are still debating Kirk. IMO no he is not a top 10 QB, but his stats are good and the knock people give him in the 4th quarter I don't get either. Last year he had a 117 rating with 13 TDs and 2 interceptions in the 4th quarter. In close games where margin of victory/defeat was less than 7 points he had a 110 rating and 22 TDs and 6 ints. His salary the thee people closest to him in A/Y are Rodgers, Goff and Wentz. Those three have all played in Super Bowls but I would take KC over Goff and Wentz.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by BaltimoreSkins

Three years later and we are still debating Kirk. IMO no he is not a top 10 QB, but his stats are good and the knock people give him in the 4th quarter I don't get either. Last year he had a 117 rating with 13 TDs and 2 interceptions in the 4th quarter. In close games where margin of victory/defeat was less than 7 points he had a 110 rating and 22 TDs and 6 ints. His salary the thee people closest to him in A/Y are Rodgers, Goff and Wentz. Those three have all played in Super Bowls but I would take KC over Goff and Wentz.

It's not really even a debate anymore, at least not a fair and honest one. He's way better than his haters will ever give him credit for, and we've been worse off since he left and we're still looking for a QB 4 years later. Anyone who wants to say otherwise is just kidding themselves.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by MTK

It's not really even a debate anymore, at least not a fair and honest one. He's way better than his haters will ever give him credit for, and we've been worse off since he left and we're still looking for a QB 4 years later. Anyone who wants to say otherwise is just kidding themselves.

tell that to minnesota fans, who now have exactly the same duality on their message board. KC is KC, he can't/hasn't won anything with any team he has been on, and had we overpaid him, with the train wreck that our club has been, we wouldn't have been in any better place. than we are now.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

tell that to minnesota fans, who now have exactly the same duality on their message board. KC is KC, he can't/hasn't won anything with any team he has been on, and had we overpaid him, with the train wreck that our club has been, we wouldn't have been in any better place. than we are now.

Most fans are dumb and don't even know what they're watching.

Check a GB message board and you'll find your fair share of A-Rod haters.

[Scalper]

Originally Posted by BaltimoreSkins

Three years later and we are still debating Kirk. IMO no he is not a top 10 QB, but his stats are good and the knock people give him in the 4th quarter I don't get either. Last year he had a 117 rating with 13 TDs and 2 interceptions in the 4th quarter. In close games where margin of victory/defeat was less than 7 points he had a 110 rating and 22 TDs and 6 ints. His salary the thee people closest to him in A/Y are Rodgers, Goff and Wentz. Those three have all played in Super Bowls but I would take KC over Goff and Wentz.

WRs hate Cousins. He is Captain checkdown and terrible deep ball accuracy. NEVER going to win the big one.

Goff it just doesn't click mentally and may never come on. McVeigh did everything imaginable to help him succeed on some absolutely stacked Os and he fell flat on his face. McVay trading so much to get rid of him (and get Stafford) and giving up on him says a lot. If you can't succeed with McVeigh calling plays and the embarrassment of riches Rams had, where do you expect to succeed. They need to run a college spread O so Goff can process it, LOL.

Who knows Wentz, LOL. For all the promise, he's rolling up on 30 and hasn't done squat.

Picking among those three like asking which limb to cut off. I'd go Wentz, simply because there is no way Cousins or Goff ever win SB.

[skinsfaninok]

I'd be happy with him at WR2

[MTK]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

I'd be happy with him at WR2

I think he could be another Garcon type of signing here. A guy that was a little under the radar with his first team but could really be ready to take off.

[skinsfaninok]

Originally Posted by MTK

I think he could be another Garcon type of signing here. A guy that was a little under the radar with his first team but could really be ready to take off.

Yeah I'd take him over Fuller for sure