WFT's Off-Season Thread

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by AnonEmouse

Agreed, and the difference between then and now I suspect, is BA was always negotiating in bad faith (or incompetence), whereas I suspect RR et al are putting up the tag to buy time for a deal to be signed and probably in constant dialogue with his agent. Didn't BA just walk away from the table with KC instead of negotiate a reasonable deal?

Again, not to revisit the topic, but between BA negotiating in bad faith and Cousins not wanting to be here, nothing was getting done in that situation.

But you are right, I believe that RR is negotiating in good faith and the tag gives him time.

[sdskinsfan2001]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

Again, not to revisit the topic, but between BA negotiating in bad faith and Cousins not wanting to be here, nothing was getting done in that situation.

But you are right, I believe that RR is negotiating in good faith and the tag gives him time.

I don't want them to negotiate anymore. Unless somehow Scherff decides he will take way less than 18 million, which why would he, any contract he signs is gonna be absurd for a G.

I wish they made their best offer and left it on the table thru today, and if Scherff didn't want it, both sides moved on.

[Chief X_Phackter]

Originally Posted by sdskinsfan2001

I don't want them to negotiate anymore. Unless somehow Scherff decides he will take way less than 18 million, which why would he, any contract he signs is gonna be absurd for a G.

I wish they made their best offer and left it on the table thru today, and if Scherff didn't want it, both sides moved on.

I would still try to negotiate a 3-4 year deal. It may not happen, but locking up the first WFT First Team All-Pro since 1996 isn't the worse thing this team could do.

Also, I keep hearing that not having the QB position settled could hurt their chances of landing a good WR without overpaying, but not having the O-line solidified could prevent a decent QB from wanting to come here as well.

Guards may be a dime a dozen, but not Guards of his caliber.

[nonniey]

Originally Posted by sdskinsfan2001

I don't want them to negotiate anymore. Unless somehow Scherff decides he will take way less than 18 million, which why would he, any contract he signs is gonna be absurd for a G.

I wish they made their best offer and left it on the table thru today, and if Scherff didn't want it, both sides moved on.

Oh I think the Redskins are being smart on this. I think they are playing the comp pick game right for once. If Scherff left and they spend big on FAs this year (and I think that is their plan) they'd get nothing for him. Now if he leaves next year (hopefully not of course) and we don't spend big next year we get a 3rd (in 2023). Timing what you do, and how you do it, can really help the team long term.

[Scalper]

Originally Posted by nonniey

Oh I think the Redskins are being smart on this. I think they are playing the comp pick game right for once. If Scherff left and they spend big on FAs this year (and I think that is their plan) they'd get nothing for him. Now if he leaves next year (hopefully not of course) and we don't spend big next year we get a 3rd (in 2023). Timing what you do, and how you do it, can really help the team long term.

I hope you are right. We have never been that smart under this owner. Not once. It would be a refreshing change.

[sevier2]

Keim said the team is still working with Scherff on a longterm deal. Does everybody just assume this isn't going to happen? I thought the tag seemed relatively unsurprising as it buys more time to negotiate?

"For other key Washington free agents: as of Sunday, there was nothing going on with Ryan Kerrigan, per source; the team is still trying to get deals done with Ronald Darby and Dustin Hopkins; Ryan Anderson is ready to move on, get back to playing as a 3-4 outside linebacker. They'll also continue to work on a long-term deal with guard Brandon Scherff."

[sdskinsfan2001]

Originally Posted by sevier2

Keim said the team is still working with Scherff on a longterm deal. Does everybody just assume this isn't going to happen? I thought the tag seemed relatively unsurprising as it buys more time to negotiate?

"For other key Washington free agents: as of Sunday, there was nothing going on with Ryan Kerrigan, per source; the team is still trying to get deals done with Ronald Darby and Dustin Hopkins; Ryan Anderson is ready to move on, get back to playing as a 3-4 outside linebacker. They'll also continue to work on a long-term deal with guard Brandon Scherff."

The issue is that Scherff has all the power. This FT just guaranteed him a humongous raise. We were talking about a max of 15 or 16 million, and if that was even reasonable. This tag sets the floor at 18 million AAV. This tag puts him in charge. And if nothing else, he makes 18 million and enters into FA again next year.

I don't think the FT should ever be used more than once. The fact that you ever have to use it means negotiations aren't going well. Giving the player even more money just can't help the team. It moves the goalpost in the players favor.

This tag ensures we never sign him long term, unless it's like 3 years and 55 million. No thanks.

[Scalper]

Originally Posted by sdskinsfan2001

The issue is that Scherff has all the power. This FT just guaranteed him a humongous raise. We were talking about a max of 15 or 16 million, and if that was even reasonable. This tag sets the floor at 18 million AAV. This tag puts him in charge. And if nothing else, he makes 18 million and enters into FA again next year.

I don't think the FT should ever be used more than once. The fact that you ever have to use it means negotiations aren't going well. Giving the player even more money just can't help the team. It moves the goalpost in the players favor.

This tag ensures we never sign him long term, unless it's like 3 years and 55 million. No thanks.

Tag more than once: certainly not on a RG!!!!

[FrenchSkin]

Originally Posted by sevier2

Keim said the team is still working with Scherff on a longterm deal. Does everybody just assume this isn't going to happen? I thought the tag seemed relatively unsurprising as it buys more time to negotiate?

"For other key Washington free agents: as of Sunday, there was nothing going on with Ryan Kerrigan, per source; the team is still trying to get deals done with Ronald Darby and Dustin Hopkins; Ryan Anderson is ready to move on, get back to playing as a 3-4 outside linebacker. They'll also continue to work on a long-term deal with guard Brandon Scherff."

Does it buy more time or does it annihilate any incentive to sign a LTD for Scherff ?

[AnonEmouse]

Originally Posted by FrenchSkin

Does it buy more time or does it annihilate any incentive to sign a LTD for Scherff ?

His incentive is to sign a long term deal in case of injury, especially with guarantees. $30M+ over the next 4 years say, would be better than $18M this year and, worst case, nothing more. Teams incentive is less clear, unless they just feel they can't replace his play and his leadership (never to be underrated) in the draft or via FA, either with a straight swap or 2-3 new guys improving the OL overall. I'd suggest if they had confidence in the likes of Martin, Schweitzer etc. they would have let Scherff walk.

[FrenchSkin]

Originally Posted by nonniey

Oh I think the Redskins are being smart on this. I think they are playing the comp pick game right for once. If Scherff left and they spend big on FAs this year (and I think that is their plan) they'd get nothing for him. Now if he leaves next year (hopefully not of course) and we don't spend big next year we get a 3rd (in 2023). Timing what you do, and how you do it, can really help the team long term.

Is a 3rd round comp worth 18M of cap ?

My issue is unused cap space rolls over to the next season, so why wouldn't you try and use it when it really matters ?

I'll withhold judgement on this and leave them a chance to make a big splash in FA... but I'm not sure it's in line with the 3 to 5 years culture change process... which I have zero issue with... but then why tag BS ?

[BaltimoreSkins]

Originally Posted by FrenchSkin

Is a 3rd round comp worth 18M of cap ?

My issue is unused cap space rolls over to the next season, so why wouldn't you try and use it when it really matters ?

I'll withhold judgement on this and leave them a chance to make a big splash in FA... but I'm not sure it's in line with the 3 to 5 years culture change process... which I have zero issue with... but then why tag BS ?

My assumption is they feel they have the cap space for the hit. This year so lets keep stability and it lets them focus on draft capital elsewhere. I would prefer to use that 18 mil for a LT. On a side note: I am hearing in Baltimore the Ravens are shopping Orlando Brown Jr to Jacksonville and asking for a 2nd and 4th. We'll see if that deal goes through.

[Scalper]

Originally Posted by FrenchSkin

Is a 3rd round comp worth 18M of cap ?

My issue is unused cap space rolls over to the next season, so why wouldn't you try and use it when it really matters ?

I'll withhold judgement on this and leave them a chance to make a big splash in FA... but I'm not sure it's in line with the 3 to 5 years culture change process... which I have zero issue with... but then why tag BS ?

I doubt they are thinking exclusively about the comp, but it might factor into thinking as one of variables. You would hope. I think the problem is that without Scherff, Moses immediately looks way more average, and so does our C. Then you have needs at lots of other positions, including QB obviously. So maybe, and this is obviously total speculation, you say, we're going to more or less stand pat on the OL this year barring some huge value presenting itself in draft, and try and draft some LBs, CBs, a QB, WR, etc. In that case, you can't let your only truly elite OL go. Maybe they also still have hope of a long term deal. Maybe they plan to be active FA this year and next so want to trade him because they won't get a comp. Lot of ifs. We have no idea what money Scherff is actually lookin for, and given his injury history, guaranteed money might be a sticking point. If he's been this beat up in his 20s, hate to see what his 30s will look like. In the end, it wouldn't surprise me if they resign him just because he is our ONLY elite player on O. Anything longer than a 3 year deal would make me nervous.

One thing I thought about is what if they went D with most of the early picks. A shutdown CB, two LBs. Sign Boston, a true roving cover FS, etc. You would conceivably end up with a DOMINANT D. They may also be planning on a rookie QB or Heinecke, and want to give them every chance to develop and not get them killed. If you drafted a T and QB one two, and have Scherff, then the line looks much, much better

Who knows.

The other thing is it isn't like we're drowning in talent. They may feel like they can resign Scherff and Allen etc. and fill some positions draft or low-priced FA.

[nonniey]

Originally Posted by FrenchSkin

Is a 3rd round comp worth 18M of cap ?

My issue is unused cap space rolls over to the next season, so why wouldn't you try and use it when it really matters ?

I'll withhold judgement on this and leave them a chance to make a big splash in FA... but I'm not sure it's in line with the 3 to 5 years culture change process... which I have zero issue with... but then why tag BS ?

Is it 18m of cap? We were already paying him 15m. So the right question is 2-3 million of extra cap worth a 3rd round comp pick.

[FrenchSkin]

Originally Posted by nonniey

Is it 18m of cap? We were already paying him 15m. So the right question is 2-3 million of extra cap worth a 3rd round comp pick.

Well, he wasn't under contract anymore, so if you compare this second tag to letting him walk, which is what I would've done (and rightfully blaming BA for losing yet another crazy talented player), it is indeed 18M of cap...