Ron Rivera

[AnonEmouse]

RR seems to me a case of reach exceeding grasp. He's convinced himself he is a good HC (and GM?) but he lacks the perspective and supporting cast to help learn from his mistakes and highlight (and deal with) his weaknesses. He clearly connects with his players, as shown by their testimonials, so he's a great positional coach, even coordinator. But not a HC and not a GM. Can't help thinking this is his last rodeo, if only because he needs to consider his health. I can't see another HC job in his future given his record and the number of young coaches doing through. Maybe he can be a consultant like Fangio? No responsibility but there to impart wisdom. But right now he's a lame duck and unless ownership changes soon I almost actually feel sorry for him being possibly 'trapped' in a job he isn't fit for. OTOH, he doesn't need the money, so he should probably stand down. Got a feeling his pride won't let him.

[SolidSnake84]

Originally Posted by AnonEmouse

RR seems to me a case of reach exceeding grasp. He's convinced himself he is a good HC (and GM?) but he lacks the perspective and supporting cast to help learn from his mistakes and highlight (and deal with) his weaknesses. He clearly connects with his players, as shown by their testimonials, so he's a great positional coach, even coordinator. But not a HC and not a GM. Can't help thinking this is his last rodeo, if only because he needs to consider his health. I can't see another HC job in his future given his record and the number of young coaches doing through. Maybe he can be a consultant like Fangio? No responsibility but there to impart wisdom. But right now he's a lame duck and unless ownership changes soon I almost actually feel sorry for him being possibly 'trapped' in a job he isn't fit for. OTOH, he doesn't need the money, so he should probably stand down. Got a feeling his pride won't let him.

My best friend and I had almost the same conversation a few nights ago.

This is probably Ron's last spin as a HC. I could see him staying in the NFL as a coordinator, but a HC has to have a lot of awareness on a million different things going on at once. Not realizing that your team could be eliminated from the playoffs is a pretty big mistake. Made even worse by the fact that he switched back to Carson Wentz, seemingly oblivious that it was a must-win game.

I think when history settles on the RR tenure here, most of us will agree that he was over matched and in over his head from the very beginning, and the little "success" that he found here was done in spite of having the whole burning trash fire of Jason Wright and Dan Snyder. So I will give credit where credit is due. Ron was not the best hire, he was not even close to being the best, but he was the best of the worst that would agree to come here under Dan Snyder, and we have saw far, far worse tenures than what came under Ron.

[mredskins]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

My best friend and I had almost the same conversation a few nights ago.

This is probably Ron's last spin as a HC. I could see him staying in the NFL as a coordinator, but a HC has to have a lot of awareness on a million different things going on at once. Not realizing that your team could be eliminated from the playoffs is a pretty big mistake. Made even worse by the fact that he switched back to Carson Wentz, seemingly oblivious that it was a must-win game.

I think when history settles on the RR tenure here, most of us will agree that he was over matched and in over his head from the very beginning, and the little "success" that he found here was done in spite of having the whole burning trash fire of Jason Wright and Dan Snyder. So I will give credit where credit is due. Ron was not the best hire, he was not even close to being the best, but he was the best of the worst that would agree to come here under Dan Snyder, and we have saw far, far worse tenures than what came under Ron.

I agree RR is probably done as a HC and GM at this point.

But not knowing the playoff scenario really is not a big deal, honestly its a great life skill not to worry about the things you can't control, he was laser focused on what he could control.

Going to Wentz was not a mistake the mistake was keeping him in the game after the 2nd half; by mid 3rd quarter it was obvious CW was not the answer, i am not a TH fan but he does boost this team up, if he came rolling in mid 3rd he might been the spark we needed.

There was honestly no fix all QB correct decision to make. RR choices were poop, shit and crap. All three stink, maybe Sam is the answer but he is too young now to bring in for a playoff push so RR is down to poop and shit to try to make it to the playoffs.

Even RR said at the beginning of the year when he got in hot water with CW, he said the difference in the NFE East race was the QB play.

In the end this franchise needs a complete refresh, starting with ownership obviously; until that happens complaining about anything else would be equivalent to complaining about the color of the walls in your bathroom as a F5 tornado rips your home from its foundation.

[Chief X_Phackter]

Originally Posted by mredskins

I agree RR is probably done as a HC and GM at this point.

But not knowing the playoff scenario really is not a big deal, honestly its a great life skill not to worry about the things you can't control, he was laser focused on what he could control.

Going to Wentz was not a mistake the mistake was keeping him in the game after the 2nd half; by mid 3rd quarter it was obvious CW was not the answer, i am not a TH fan but he does boost this team up, if he came rolling in mid 3rd he might been the spark we needed.

There was honestly no fix all QB correct decision to make. RR choices were poop, shit and crap. All three stink, maybe Sam is the answer but he is too young now to bring in for a playoff push so RR is down to poop and shit to try to make it to the playoffs.

Even RR said at the beginning of the year when he got in hot water with CW, he said the difference in the NFE East race was the QB play.

In the end this franchise needs a complete refresh, starting with ownership obviously; until that happens complaining about anything else would be equivalent to complaining about the color of the walls in your bathroom as a F5 tornado rips your home from its foundation.

I pretty much agree with you on all of this. I don't really care if RR knew or realized the playoff scenarios. I'd rather him be figuring out the game plan than worrying about things he has no control over.

With the QB choice, you're right, the choices were not good. If Howell was the answer he would have been playing weeks ago. There's no good choice between CW and TH. Perhaps TH could have pulled out that game, and maybe not. Maybe he could have come in after the first half and provided a spark, and maybe not. I wanted CW to start, because I thought he had the most upside. The two at their best, I don't think it's a close race with regard to who is the better QB. Fact is, Heinicke hadn't won a must win game in over a month... What makes anyone think that was going to change on Sunday?

Oh well, another offseason of hopes and dreams... At least it looks like we'll have a new owner at some point. For me that makes up for anything that happened or didn't happen this year. There is some real change to look forward to.

[mredskins]

Originally Posted by Chief X_Phackter

I pretty much agree with you on all of this. I don't really care if RR knew or realized the playoff scenarios. I'd rather him be figuring out the game plan than worrying about things he has no control over.

With the QB choice, you're right, the choices were not good. If Howell was the answer he would have been playing weeks ago. There's no good choice between CW and TH. Perhaps TH could have pulled out that game, and maybe not. Maybe he could have come in after the first half and provided a spark, and maybe not. I wanted CW to start, because I thought he had the most upside. The two at their best, I don't think it's a close race with regard to who is the better QB. Fact is, Heinicke hadn't won a must win game in over a month... What makes anyone think that was going to change on Sunday?

Oh well, another offseason of hopes and dreams... At least it looks like we'll have a new owner at some point. For me that makes up for anything that happened or didn't happen this year. There is some real change to look forward to.

As a QB1 skill wise I 100% agree with you. I loath TH; not the person just the whole fools gold that he is and how he alters decisions on draft day or gives leadership the false sense of security they are set at QB (now hopefully they see it). Even worst then him was Haskins; if we had never drafted him we would have gone Tau or Herbert in the draft over CY.

With that said there is something about TH that fires up the rest of this team they rally behind him; it is a intangible. I believe CW pound for pound skill wise is better then TH but come mid 3rd quarter last Sunday RR should have pulled the TH intangible out and see how the team responded.

Liston to this Robinson interview its very telling:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lH7XgbK-ZD0

He admits they were lacking energy; that is the intangible TH brings!

Its all hindsight at this point but my takeaway was CW as starter was the right call but his leash needed to be much much shorter; what did RR have to lose by pulling CW its not like he is Rogers and you want keep him happy. Keeping CW in too long last Sunday was RR's biggest error of the day maybe the season.

[Chief X_Phackter]

Originally Posted by mredskins

As a QB1 skill wise I 100% agree with you. I loath TH; not the person just the whole fools gold that he is and how he alters decisions on draft day or gives leadership the false sense of security they are set at QB (now hopefully they see it). Even worst then him was Haskins; if we had never drafted him we would have gone Tau or Herbert in the draft over CY.

With that said there is something about TH that fires up the rest of this team they rally behind him; it is a intangible. I believe CW pound for pound skill wise is better then TH but come mid 3rd quarter last Sunday RR should have pulled the TH intangible out and see how the team responded.

Liston to this Robinson interview its very telling:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lH7XgbK-ZD0

He admits they were lacking energy; that is the intangible TH brings!

Its all hindsight at this point but my takeaway was CW as starter was the right call but his leash needed to be much much shorter; what did RR have to lose by pulling CW its not like he is Rogers and you want keep him happy. Keeping CW in too long last Sunday was RR's biggest error of the day maybe the season.

I'm not sure what to make of the fact that they were lacking energy, but you can say that about the first NYG game for sure, and probably the other two games before the Cleveland game. and TH started and played through all those games.

I get it, he's gritty, brings the intangibles...whatever you want to call it, it wasn't working for over a month. I'm not going to fantasize that it was going to be the difference in the Cleveland game down by 10 going into the 4th quarter. It's all speculation at this point.

Coaching, lack of energy, whatever, but we can't let the defense off the hook either. They gave up the following drives in the second half:

6 plays, 63 yards - TD
12 plays 84 yards - TD
9 plays, 75 yards - TD

I'm not sure TH or CW had anything to do with that...

[mredskins]

Originally Posted by Chief X_Phackter

I'm not sure what to make of the fact that they were lacking energy, but you can say that about the first NYG game for sure, and probably the other two games before the Cleveland game. and TH started and played through all those games.

I get it, he's gritty, brings the intangibles...whatever you want to call it, it wasn't working for over a month. I'm not going to fantasize that it was going to be the difference in the Cleveland game down by 10 going into the 4th quarter. It's all speculation at this point.

Coaching, lack of energy, whatever, but we can't let the defense off the hook either. They gave up the following drives in the second half:

6 plays, 63 yards - TD
12 plays 84 yards - TD
9 plays, 75 yards - TD

I'm not sure TH or CW had anything to do with that...

All good points. Its synergy of the points we made that eventually lead to the loss.