Free Agent WRs

[offiss]

Originally Posted by celts32

This is a little harsh. It was not all Greg Williams. Joe Gibbs was never all about X's & O's...he is a leader of men. He gets them to believe and play harder for him than they woluld anyone else. He envigorated the entire organization with a winning attitude. If it was all defense than why didn't spurrier win with the excellent defense that Marvin lewis built for him? Joe Gibbs has turned everything he touches into a winner. Greg Williams in Buffalo was a failure as a head coach even with one of the best defenses in the league. No doubt Greg Williams is a great defensive coach...but it was Gibbs who built the winning foundation and reinstilled the pride in being a Redskin.

Very good reply, I agree that Gibbs organizational skills are probably maybe the best ever, I also agree that had a big part in the turn around of the team.

But I do disagree with the Lewis analogy, our defense under Lewis although ranked in the top 10 stat wise, never really could stop anyone when it counted, Lewis is not in the same league as Williams defensivly, not even close.

[celts32]

Originally Posted by offiss

Very good reply, I agree that Gibbs organizational skills are probably maybe the best ever, I also agree that had a big part in the turn around of the team.

But I do disagree with the Lewis analogy, our defense under Lewis although ranked in the top 10 stat wise, never really could stop anyone when it counted, Lewis is not in the same league as Williams defensivly, not even close.

I agree that Williams is better than Lewis defensively, but if Williams alone meant winning then he would have won in Buffalo. he had a great defense in Buffalo and might even be able to argue that his offense was better there also. Gibbs is just a winner, plain and simple. You can't find statistics to identify the value that Joe Gibbs brings to an organization.

[jdlea]

I'm not trying to start an arguement, but I have to disagree with you guys about Gregg Williams being better than Marvin Lewis on either side of the ball. Marvin Lewis helped win a Super Bowl as a coordinator and lead one of the greatest D's of all time. He was only here for one year, they would have gotten better, IMO, maybe not, cause Gregg Williams's D didn't get better this year, so I don't really know. However, Marvin Lewis is 10 times the head coach that Gregg Williams is and there's no arguing that. Williams took a decent team and they got really bad, Marvin took the laughing stock of the NFL and took em to the playoffs and hasn't had a losing season there.

IMO it's Lewis 10 times out of 10

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by jdlea

I'm not trying to start an arguement, but I have to disagree with you guys about Gregg Williams being better than Marvin Lewis on either side of the ball. Marvin Lewis helped win a Super Bowl as a coordinator and lead one of the greatest D's of all time. He was only here for one year, they would have gotten better, IMO, maybe not, cause Gregg Williams's D didn't get better this year, so I don't really know. However, Marvin Lewis is 10 times the head coach that Gregg Williams is and there's no arguing that. Williams took a decent team and they got really bad, Marvin took the laughing stock of the NFL and took em to the playoffs and hasn't had a losing season there.

IMO it's Lewis 10 times out of 10

That actually makes alot of sense! Look at what Marvin Lewis has done since he became head coach for the Bengals. Gregg Williams couldn't do that when he was in Buffalo. Don't get me wrong, I love Gregg Williams, but if you're going to compare accomplishments, the tide shifts to Lewis.

[celts32]

Originally Posted by jdlea

I'm not trying to start an arguement, but I have to disagree with you guys about Gregg Williams being better than Marvin Lewis on either side of the ball. Marvin Lewis helped win a Super Bowl as a coordinator and lead one of the greatest D's of all time. He was only here for one year, they would have gotten better, IMO, maybe not, cause Gregg Williams's D didn't get better this year, so I don't really know. However, Marvin Lewis is 10 times the head coach that Gregg Williams is and there's no arguing that. Williams took a decent team and they got really bad, Marvin took the laughing stock of the NFL and took em to the playoffs and hasn't had a losing season there.

IMO it's Lewis 10 times out of 10

Marvin Lewis's defenses in Cinci have been pretty bad though. That team has won more with offense. The Baltimore players actually made Mike Nolan look like he can coach. GW built top defenses in Buffalo and Washington. Lewis is a good coach also but you need to look at which guy had more defensive talent to work with at each stop. Lewis had hall of fame players in Baltimore. Lewis has been more successful as a head coach than GW, that I would not argue.

[offiss]

Originally Posted by jdlea

I'm not trying to start an arguement, but I have to disagree with you guys about Gregg Williams being better than Marvin Lewis on either side of the ball. Marvin Lewis helped win a Super Bowl as a coordinator and lead one of the greatest D's of all time. He was only here for one year, they would have gotten better, IMO, maybe not, cause Gregg Williams's D didn't get better this year, so I don't really know. However, Marvin Lewis is 10 times the head coach that Gregg Williams is and there's no arguing that. Williams took a decent team and they got really bad, Marvin took the laughing stock of the NFL and took em to the playoffs and hasn't had a losing season there.

IMO it's Lewis 10 times out of 10

Defiently a good case can be made for that, one thing I will say is this, Williams had the 10 cent brain and million dollar arm at QB in Bledsoe, but that was his own fault, Lewis has done a terrific job so far for Cinnci, but I would take Williams as my D-coordinator any day over Lewis.

[offiss]

Originally Posted by celts32

I agree that Williams is better than Lewis defensively, but if Williams alone meant winning then he would have won in Buffalo. he had a great defense in Buffalo and might even be able to argue that his offense was better there also. Gibbs is just a winner, plain and simple. You can't find statistics to identify the value that Joe Gibbs brings to an organization.

That is a dead on outstanding post Celt, very, very, perceptive!

I do beleive that coupled with Williams has been the difference, I absolutly agree 100%, but that alone isn't enough to win a SB, we have to get going on offense, is it the playcalling? Is it the offensive line? Is it the lack of quality #2,3 WR's? Or is it Brunell? That is the question, something needs fixing if we are to take the big step to SB contender.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by offiss

That is a dead on outstanding post Celt, very, very, perceptive!

I do beleive that coupled with Williams has been the difference, I absolutly agree 100%, but that alone isn't enough to win a SB, we have to get going on offense, is it the playcalling? Is it the offensive line? Is it the lack of quality #2,3 WR's? Or is it Brunell? That is the question, something needs fixing if we are to take the big step to SB contender.

Definitely. Somthing is wrong and it needs fixing. I hope Gibbs has a better idea than we do because it seems none of us agree much. Guess that's why were not coaches.