F... Wal-Mart

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by itvnetop

Wal-Mart: The High Cost of Low Price

Yeah, because capitalism is bad for the economy.

I don't shop there because I prefer to be waited on in English (or served AT ALL) and I hate the lines and inconveniences like dodging shoes that parents throw at kids and miss...but there is nothing wrong with a business growing and being sucessful.

Actually, the last time I was there, a mother with small kids was screaming "I'll F### you in the mouth!" into a cellphone. I immediately, and loudly asked "how are you supposed to accomplish that? while passing her. Hilarious, yet I feel sorry for her kids. I was also hit with a flying football on that trip.

I only go there when necessary, not because I think they're somehow evil...I just like more personalized service and smaller (more civilized) crowds.

[itvnetop]

Originally Posted by Buster

Yeah, because capitalism is bad for the economy.

dude, have you even seen this documentary? capitalism is not bad for the economy... but being so cutthroat that it eliminates competition completely is directly antithetical to the basic tenets of capitalism. Capitalism is suppose to promote competition, not create overwhelming monopolies that ravage every single small business out there. Capitalism states that if you work hard enough in the system, you will prosper. Now, there's the slightest chance of becoming a successful entrepreneur in the retail convenience market b/c of Wal-Mart. Exactly how is Wal-Mart promoting the best aspects of capitalism? Target is still around, but what's the long term future of mom and pop's? Especially in small towns where mom and pop's have depended on for livelihoods.

did you also think "supersize me" was an infringement on people's choices to eat what they want? both just showed some truths... granted, eating mickey d's three times a day for a month is exaggerated, but you get the point... we're the fattest country in the world.

if you can dispute anything in "the price of low cost," be my guest. I'm not some rabid socialist saying that capitalism is bad, but it's important that people know the resulting consequences of another's success. I've also read "The world is flat" by friedman, so I do understand the business plan of wal-mart.

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by itvnetop

dude, have you even seen this documentary? capitalism is not bad for the economy... but being so cutthroat that it eliminates competition completely is directly antithetical to the basic tenets of capitalism. Capitalism is suppose to promote competition, not create overwhelming monopolies that ravage every single small business out there. Capitalism states that if you work hard enough in the system, you will prosper. Now, there's the slightest chance of becoming a successful entrepreneur in the retail convenience market b/c of Wal-Mart. Exactly how is Wal-Mart promoting the best aspects of capitalism? Target is still around, but what's the long term future of mom and pop's? Especially in small towns where mom and pop's have depended on for livelihoods.

did you also think "supersize me" was an infringement on people's choices to eat what they want? both just showed some truths... granted, eating mickey d's three times a day for a month is exaggerated, but you get the point... we're the fattest country in the world.

if you can dispute anything in "the price of low cost," be my guest. I'm not some rabid socialist saying that capitalism is bad, but it's important that people know the resulting consequences of another's success. I've also read "The world is flat" by friedman, so I do understand the business plan of wal-mart.

No I won't watch those "documentaries" just like I didn't watch that piece of trash that Michael Moore tried to promote as a "documentary".

There's a sector of society who wants to tear down sucessful businesses and make sure no one has to take personal responsibility for their decisions, or lack of them. McDonald's doesn't make you fat...your desire to stuff 1200-calorie, grease-soaked meals down your throat as you're sitting in front of a TV does. WAL*MART doesn't make people poor, they provide goods, services and jobs to those who have less money than others. They also don't make people be lazy or uneducated, the jobless and uneducated people do that to themselves in most cases.

Just because they call it a documentary, doesn't make it true. Even if it's on the news or in a newspaper doesn't make it true.

"Being a cutthroat" is not unfair as long as you're not breaking any laws. Businesses have ALWAYS had to learn to adapt to survive in our capitalist nation. Did they make films about how Henry Ford was being a "cutthroat" by mass-producing cars on an assembly line and making them affordable? Well, maybe those who didn't keep up with him made these wild claims, but ingenuity and innovation are what have made the United States the world's economic superpower. Yes, Sam Walton was innovative. He found a way to provide MORE products in a single building to more people at a lower price. He's not to blame for his success, the consumers who thought it was a great idea and gave him business did.

I find most people who hate WAL*MART to be either selfish or lazy. They want small businesses to suceed but big business to fail. WAL*MART was once a small business. Would you want your sucess to be taken away to help those who haven't found a way to suceed? It's the welfare, entitlement mindset that has ruined America's largest cities. If you want sucess, use your mind and work hard like Sam Walton did...don't expect to be handed money or to tear down those who worked harder than you.

Maybe someday you'll grow up. Getting a job, getting married and having a family and REAL responsibilities will help you, hopefully.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by Buster

No I won't watch those "documentaries" just like I didn't watch that piece of trash that Michael Moore tried to promote as a "documentary".

There's a sector of society who wants to tear down sucessful businesses and make sure no one has to take personal responsibility for their decisions, or lack of them. McDonald's doesn't make you fat...your desire to stuff 1200-calorie, grease-soaked meals down your throat as you're sitting in front of a TV does. WAL*MART doesn't make people poor, they provide goods, services and jobs to those who have less money than others. They also don't make people be lazy or uneducated, the jobless and uneducated people do that to themselves in most cases.

Just because they call it a documentary, doesn't make it true. Even if it's on the news or in a newspaper doesn't make it true.

"Being a cutthroat" is not unfair as long as you're not breaking any laws. Businesses have ALWAYS had to learn to adapt to survive in our capitalist nation. Did they make films about how Henry Ford was being a "cutthroat" by mass-producing cars on an assembly line and making them affordable? Well, maybe those who didn't keep up with him made these wild claims, but ingenuity and innovation are what have made the United States the world's economic superpower. Yes, Sam Walton was innovative. He found a way to provide MORE products in a single building to more people at a lower price. He's not to blame for his success, the consumers who thought it was a great idea and gave him business did.

I find most people who hate WAL*MART to be either selfish or lazy. They want small businesses to suceed but big business to fail. WAL*MART was once a small business. Would you want your sucess to be taken away to help those who haven't found a way to suceed? It's the welfare, entitlement mindset that has ruined America's largest cities. If you want sucess, use your mind and work hard like Sam Walton did...don't expect to be handed money or to tear down those who worked harder than you.

Maybe someday you'll grow up. Getting a job, getting married and having a family and REAL responsibilities will help you, hopefully.

so you're going to bash (a factually accurate) documentary film without ever seeing it? that's not prejudice in any way and is also in no way hypocritical to the arguement you're trying to make here (/sarcasm).

Microsoft has people bashing its PRODUCTS all the time, but no one bashes the company in the way you see with walmart, cause MS doesn't lock its employees in overnight, refuse to pay them for overtime regularly, or advises them to apply for food stamps and housing assistance when they get hired. The gripes about negative social impacts are true. Not so much where I live, but much moreso in more rural settings. Walmart has revolutionized logistics as has dell, but the greed is overpowering.

[itvnetop]

Originally Posted by Buster

No I won't watch those "documentaries" just like I didn't watch that piece of trash that Michael Moore tried to promote as a "documentary".

Just because they call it a documentary, doesn't make it true. Even if it's on the news or in a newspaper doesn't make it true.

I kind of had a feeling you'd associate this documentary with MM... the two aren't even close. If you'd seen it at all, you would have known that and you wouldn't have made this strawman.

Being a cutthroat" is not unfair as long as you're not breaking any laws. Businesses have ALWAYS had to learn to adapt to survive in our capitalist nation. Did they make films about how Henry Ford was being a "cutthroat" by mass-producing cars on an assembly line and making them affordable? Well, maybe those who didn't keep up with him made these wild claims, but ingenuity and innovation are what have made the United States the world's economic superpower. Yes, Sam Walton was innovative. He found a way to provide MORE products in a single building to more people at a lower price.

Um, how many car manufacturers are there now? Are we forced to only buy Ford? Henry Ford did innovate, but it spawned competition for better models, better engines, more speed, better safety, etc. The japanese car industry's business model is now being adapted by American companies because of the trend towards pricing-gas efficiency. I agree that Sam Walton was also innovative, but if you researched Wal-Mart at all, you'd know there was a whole team of people who came up with his business model (IT people included). But to compare his case to Ford's is faulty- Henry Ford's business model didn't single-handedly destroy every other car manufacturer out there.

He's not to blame for his success, the consumers who thought it was a great idea and gave him business did.

Um, the consumers aren't at all concerned about how innovative the Wal-Mart business model is. The general buying market in any country is driven by the bottom line- and that is price.

I find most people who hate WAL*MART to be either selfish or lazy. They want small businesses to suceed but big business to fail. WAL*MART was once a small business.

I find this generalization extremely judgmental, but maybe I'm getting mixed up b/c this is the Internet and intentions are always misconstrued... but regardless, alot of the people I know who hate Wal-mart are not either selfish or lazy. Our problem with Wal-Mart is not so much how they became successful (again you should read how their use of technology played a major part of this), it's what happens to other businesses. Wal-Mart invades a new neighborhood, they create a consumer monopoly by undercutting everyone else's prices by a wide margin, and when competition is eliminated Wal-Mart raises prices back up.

In capitalism, companies always undercut each other to corner a market. But when they do that, rivals find ways to innovate, make products better... but people stay in business. Those that do not bring anything new to the table (or have terrible business plans) inevitably fail. But in the retail convenience market, Wal-Mart isn't innovating any new product... they cut out the middle supplier and they're re-selling from direct sources. They can afford to keep their prices way lower than any of the mom and pop's, as long as it takes to eliminate the competition because they are Wal-Mart.

Would you want your sucess to be taken away to help those who haven't found a way to suceed? It's the welfare, entitlement mindset that has ruined America's largest cities. If you want sucess, use your mind and work hard like Sam Walton did...don't expect to be handed money or to tear down those who worked harder than you.

Nobody's saying that Wal-mart has to give any of their profits to lazy people. But when you say "those who haven't found a way to succeed"- you're talking about people who did find a way to succeed in America... and they did it the ultimate way, doing it themselves. Mom and Pop's are products of entrepreneurial spirits, creativity, hard work, and a lot of risk-taking. They are started by those with similar qualities as CEOs of Fortune 500s. They are not lazy and nobody handed them anything. They've played by the rules, but now Wal-Mart is driving them out of business.

Wal-Mart is basically telling the world that the only way to "adapt" and stay successful in their industry is to become big business. Is that your idea of acceptable adapting? What's wrong with remaining a small business owner? And don't tell me small business owners can remain successful by adapting the Wal-Mart business plan- mom and pop's do not have the luxury of slashing prices to near retail for an indefinite amount of time until competition is erased.

And don't get it twisted, Wal-Mart isn't where they are at b/c they worked harder than other people. You can use the argument that they are more successful b/c of their business plan, but do not use false claims that they somehow put in more hours than everyone else. I'm willing to ante up major bucks that Mom and Pop's work just as hard, if not harder to stay in business nowadays. For the last time, please read how Wal-Mart got to where it is now... then you'll stop trying to use these arguments painting Wal-Mart as the epitome of the American dream and everyone who hates it as lazy, welfare recipients.

Maybe someday you'll grow up. Getting a job, getting married and having a family and REAL responsibilities will help you, hopefully.

Not sure who this is directed at, but you'd better be careful with your Internet etiquette... judging someone you've never met just isn't cool. Basing this statement on my opinion of Wal-Mart isn't representative of maturity, so telling me to "grow up" seems ironic.