Why Brunell is Struggling

[VTSkins897]

that's a good read. i guess we sort of just expected the offense to light it up without even considering that it does take time for the guys to get used to it.

i asked a few months ago when i thought of this about how saunders' offense did went he first came to KC. i believe KC was 6-10 but the offense was still rated high. so i guess that doesn't explain anything...

anyhow i'd still like to see campbell in there if we lose a few more games. yeah it sucks we won't be in the postseason but having regular season games to see what he can do vs. preseason junk would be invaluable.

then we could maybe decide if we do indeed have to go after someone else.

[freddyg12]

this was a good reprt from wp, they also should mention that mb has a long windup & his release is slower w/age. What I don't understand is the disparity between making a quick read & throwing deep. The latter requires more time. If he's holding the ball too long, in theory it would imply nothing is open deep, since he rarely throws deep. Is it just a matter of confidence? It seems as if he's not making any reads sometimes, just going to the rb almost immediately.

[Stacks42]

This is complete BS, Kurt Warner came right out of the grocery store, to the NFL and was able to run this offense, effectively. I am so tired of people making excuses for MB, we are nearly 6 months into this offense, they practiced everyday in the summer and 2-3 times a week during the season, if MB doesnt have the timing down by now, then he never will, bench Grandpa. Also I never thought I would say this, but... I have lost all respect for Joe Gibbs, he continues to stead fastly support MB when everyone knows he blows, thereby costing the skins any chance of a winning season.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by Stacks42

This is complete BS, Kurt Warner came right out of the grocery store, to the NFL and was able to run this offense, effectively. I am so tired of people making excuses for MB, we are nearly 6 months into this offense, they practiced everyday in the summer and 2-3 times a week during the season, if MB doesnt have the timing down by now, then he never will, bench Grandpa. Also I never thought I would say this, but... I have lost all respect for Joe Gibbs, he continues to stead fastly support MB when everyone knows he blows, thereby costing the skins any chance of a winning season.

That was the Martz offense that Warner was running, not the Saunders offense. Martz was the offensive coordinator, Saunders was the receivers coach in 1999.

There are similarities to Martz and Saunders, but Saunders relies a great deal more on timing. Martz ran a lot of play-action involving 7-step drops. Subtle differences, but definitely different species of offense.

EDIT: I, in no way, mean to defend Brunell. I don't buy that it should take one year to fully learn this offense. After a complete offseason, preseason, and seven games, Brunell should have it down IMO.

[Stacks42]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

That was the Martz offense that Warner was running, not the Saunders offense. Martz was the offensive coordinator, Saunders was the receivers coach in 1999.

There are similarities to Martz and Saunders, but Saunders relies a great deal more on timing. Martz ran a lot of play-action involving 7-step drops. Subtle differences, but definitely different species of offense.

EDIT: I, in no way, mean to defend Brunell. I don't buy that it should take one year to fully learn this offense. After a complete offseason, preseason, and seven games, Brunell should have it down IMO.

In Trent Greens first season in this offense he had 51 plays over 20yds and 12 over 40yds, NFL.com doesnt show how many 3yd dump off passes to the rb he had but I am positive that it is nowhere near the amount that MB has. Im MBs favor (it pains me to say this) but TG numbers were not that great his first season in this system but continued to get better season after season.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by Stacks42

In Trent Greens first season in this offense he had 51 plays over 20yds and 12 over 40yds, NFL.com doesnt show how many 3yd dump off passes to the rb he had but I am positive that it is nowhere near the amount that MB has. Im MBs favor (it pains me to say this) but TG numbers were not that great his first season in this system but continued to get better season after season.

Agreed, and as we all know Brunell doesn't have season after season to get better. Campbell does. The switch needs to be made this season or we're going to find ourselves with a QB who has learned the offense but is too old to execute it.

[BDBohnzie]

Originally Posted by Stacks42

In Trent Greens first season in this offense he had 51 plays over 20yds and 12 over 40yds, NFL.com doesnt show how many 3yd dump off passes to the rb he had but I am positive that it is nowhere near the amount that MB has.

In 2000 (Green's first season for the Rams as starter), Marshall Faulk had 81 receptions for 830 yards. 6 of those 81 were 20+, 2 of those were 40+, and he had 42 first downs. Which would lead me to believe that around half of his receptions were less than 10 yards.

(Here are the stats from the 2000 Rams)

As you said, Trent Green's first season in Saunders' offense, he struggled, and I would expect any QB who is going from one system to Saunders to struggle.

However, I think Brunell's struggles stem from the fact that he's honed in on Santana and Cooley moreso than anyone else, and doesn't feel comfortable spreading the ball around.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by BDBohnzie

In 2000 (Green's first season for the Rams as starter), Marshall Faulk had 81 receptions for 830 yards. 6 of those 81 were 20+, 2 of those were 40+, and he had 42 first downs. Which would lead me to believe that around half of his receptions were less than 10 yards.

(Here are the stats from the 2000 Rams)

As you said, Trent Green's first season in Saunders' offense, he struggled, and I would expect any QB who is going from one system to Saunders to struggle.

However, I think Brunell's struggles stem from the fact that he's honed in on Santana and Cooley moreso than anyone else, and doesn't feel comfortable spreading the ball around.

saunder's didn't run the rams offense (WR coach is NOT an OC, and he didn't call the plays). martz did (with help from vermeil, btw). trent green's stats from 2000 are for martz.

[illdefined]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

EDIT: I, in no way, mean to defend Brunell. I don't buy that it should take one year to fully learn this offense. After a complete offseason, preseason, and seven games, Brunell should have it down IMO.

here here.

if there's ANY benefit to being a 36 year old QB in the NFL, it's that's you're smart and have ostensibly seen it all. you're familiar with various offenses, and you're accustomed to being rushed.

Brunell seems to be playing the opposite, he's been overly sensitive to the rush (shellshocked?) and thinks his job is done safely throwing it to his escape valve.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by illdefined

Brunell seems to be playing the opposite, he's been overly sensitive to the rush (shellshocked?) and thinks his job is done safely throwing it to his escape valve.

warner, bledsoe, etc etc. it's not unique among old QBs with lots of experience. that doesn't mean it doesn't suck though.

[illdefined]

Originally Posted by That Guy

warner, bledsoe, etc etc. it's not unique among old QBs with lots of experience. that doesn't mean it doesn't suck though.

yeah, but at least Bledsoe's flaw is holding it too long looking DOWNfield. he's obviously at least willing to take the hit to get it down there. ugh can't believe i just defended that guy. :vomit:

[That Guy]

there was talk of a slow start and adjustment period. i think more shotgun would help brunell get a faster read, since that seems to be were the money was last year... it'd also make the OL look better, since they'd have a bit more buffer room.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by That Guy

there was talk of a slow start and adjustment period. i think more shotgun would help brunell get a faster read, since that seems to be were the money was last year... it'd also make the OL look better, since they'd have a bit more buffer room.

For the third time...bring back Bill Musgrave!! Seriously though the shotgun was great for MB. We need to use that more

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by TAFKAS

For the third time...bring back Bill Musgrave!! Seriously though the shotgun was great for MB. We need to use that more

it does make you wonder... vick's looked better this year too.

[724Skinsfan]

I agree that Mark seemed to be much more comfortable last year from the shotgun position. I hope this doesn't turn Turner-esque in which the attitude "what we do works" is prevalent making the possibility of adapting to the current players skill set unlikely.