Mascot Issue (AGAIN)

[IrishSkins Fan]

My whole problem with this is the sensitivity of everyone in the world today. Come on, every heritage has been persecuted on some level.

Yes the term can be perceived as derogatory, although most slang terms can be derogatory given the context. I hate to say it, but this is the same argument most politicians use. Everything today must be considered in the context that they are used, but it is the implied intent of the comment that should be analyzed.

For example as mentioned earlier, if someone refers to say "Blackskins" and identifies that moniker with a Zulu Warrior, anyone who is educated should know that this is the contemporary equivalent of respect and admiration for warrior who at the time was considered primitive, and later proved to be a worthy adversary of the most fearsome military in the world. I would say that in this context this was a show of respect and admiration for the warrior spirit inherit to this culture and should be appreciated by it's people. But if they are too ignorant to understand context and it's applications in the world today, then I say ---- them!!!!!!

Irish Skins Fan

[jdlea]

4 results for: redskin

–noun Slang: Often Disparaging and Offensive.
a North American Indian.
[Origin: 1690–1700, Americanism; red1 + skin]

red·skin (rěd'skĭn') Pronunciation Key
n. Offensive Slang
Used as a disparaging term for a Native American.

redskin
"American Indian," 1699. Red as the skin color of Native Americans is from 1587; red man is from 1587.

redskin
noun
offensive terms for Native Americans

Something to consider: these are the only results from dictionary.com. 3 out of 4 say "offensive" and not one references football.

[hooskins]

Originally Posted by jdlea

Something to consider: these are the only results from dictionary.com. 3 out of 4 say "offensive" and not one references football.

Then why did all those native american groups surveyed say the Washington Redskins were not offensive?

[jdlea]

Originally Posted by hooskins

Then why did all those native american groups surveyed say the Washington Redskins were not offensive?

I'm not really saying that they should change the name, I'm just presenting facts. I don't really think it matters what I think, it's gonna change. It doesn't matter how I feel about the situation, I think it's going to happen. I'm concerned about a lot more important things than the name of the football team in Washington.

[SkinEmAll]

Originally Posted by jdlea

I'm not really saying that they should change the name, I'm just presenting facts. I don't really think it matters what I think, it's gonna change. It doesn't matter how I feel about the situation, I think it's going to happen. I'm concerned about a lot more important things than the name of the football team in Washington.

Yes there are many things more important in life than the name of our favorite football team. But some things are worth fighting for. I just cant imagine such a small group who thinks they speak for all Indian nations, oh excuse me, Native frickin americans, winning a battle like this. It is a name of a football team, that what it is associated with. You dont see guys in a bar fight yelling, "im gonna kick yer ass you,you, redskin!!" I think its a waste of time and money and energy.

[jdlea]

Originally Posted by SkinEmAll

You dont see guys in a bar fight yelling, "im gonna kick yer ass you,you, redskin!!"

I might if I ever saw Native Americans. I, personally, have never met one and no frame of reference as to how any of them feel as about the subject. I just don't think this is that big of a deal.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by hooskins

Then why did all those native american groups surveyed say the Washington Redskins were not offensive?

The Native American community has mixed attitudes about it; some hate it, others don't mind it, and still others love it. A close family friend is a Menominee Indian and she cannot stand the name, thinks it's so unbelievably disrespectful, and says that if people knew the history of the term they wouldn't support it. She equates it to calling the team the Washington N----rs.

As I said earlier, I'm not so passionate about the issue and, frankly, I don't understand people who get so worked up about it one way or the other. I don't think the term Redskin is as bad as some other racial epithets, but it's not exactly 100% free of prejudice (at least when you consider the term's history).

It seems to be very similar to a Confederate Flag, only a lot more of us are familiar with the history of the stars and bars than the history of the term "Redskin." There are a lot of people who do not associate the Confederate Flag with racism or slavery, rather they think of the Southern lifestyle and their home states. There are others who are conscious of the flag's history and therefore understandably hate it.

[hooskins]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

The Native American community has mixed attitudes about it; some hate it, others don't mind it, and still others love it. A close family friend is a Menominee Indian and she cannot stand the name, thinks it's so unbelievably disrespectful, and says that if people knew the history of the term they wouldn't support it. She equates it to calling the team the Washington N----rs.

As I said earlier, I'm not so passionate about the issue and, frankly, I don't understand people who get so worked up about it one way or the other. I don't think the term Redskin is as bad as some other racial epithets, but it's not exactly 100% free of prejudice (at least when you consider the term's history).

It seems to be very similar to a Confederate Flag, only a lot more of us are familiar with the history of the stars and bars than the history of the term "Redskin." There are a lot of people who do not associate the Confederate Flag with racism or slavery, rather they think of the Southern lifestyle and their home states. There are others who are conscious of the flag's history and therefore understandably hate it.

Yeah, I want to dig up an article with that survey and it's specifics. But I do see where you are coming from. Either way I think one of the guys brought up a good idea, how about continue with the name Washington Redskins, but change the logo on the helmet or remove it. That way both sides get a bit of what they want.

[SmootSmack]

By the same token a close friend of mine is Cherokee and he has no problem whatsoever with the name, so you have both ends of the spectrum.

But the lawsuit isn't about dropping the name, it's about dropping the trademark protection...which would be great for Summo who can sell his wallpapers worldwide!

[EARTHQUAKE2689]

Or we could leave it the way it is and tell everyone who doesnt like it to go to h*ll

[hooskins]

Originally Posted by EARTHQUAKE2689

Or we could leave it the way it is and tell everyone who doesnt like it to go to h*ll

I agree with that as well.

But if we have no other options I think those are the two best alternatives.

[Redskin]

Freedom of speach, plain and simple. Well if they take Redskins away we can change our name to Black skins and see who we offend there.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by jdlea

I know, I know, we've covered this a million times. However, tonight the Illinois Illini intend to retire their mascot, Chief Illiniwek (a chief in stereotypical Native American garb).

Maybe the U. of Illinois should spend less time concerned about some dude dancing at halftime and more time dealing with things like this

[#56fanatic]

when will someone draw the line on the PC crap. To have a NFL franchise, one of, if not, the richest franchise in all of sports honor your heritage would make me proud. They dont do all the crap Florida state does with the guy riding a horse and throwing a spear and doing the little dance. This stuff is what America is all about. We are able to express ourselves freely. Like it or not, as americans we have that right. Because someone finds it offensive, doesn't make it wrong. We can't even call Christmas, christmas. It is now not PC to say that. Halloween is being cut out of neighborhoods, pledge of alegance... this stuff has gone way too far. its just people trying to get their names in the paper and face on TV. WE as americans are losing our rights to people that move in to our country because things are offensive. Well, if you dont like it, dont watch it, celebrate it, take part in it, what ever. That is what living in America gives you, choices!

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

WE as americans are losing our rights to people that move in to our country because things are offensive.

What does that mean?