Don Imus

[SmootSmack]

Imus will be on XM or Sirius within a month, I'm sure.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Imus will be on XM or Sirius within a month, I'm sure.

No doubt. He won't be off the air for long, once this cools off satellite will snatch him up.

[Duffman003]

i always saw this statement as a lot more sexist than racist

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Duffman003

i always saw this statement as a lot more sexist than racist

Yeah it's interesting how many people overlook the Ho part of it

[hooskins]

Ok so instead of bitching at each other about stupid little points, how about discussing the big issue? Racism is still present in America, how should we deal with it? Honestly how much have accomplished by arguing about the stupid filter.

Perhaps Imus should have lost his job, but he lost it for all the wrong reasons. He lost it because of money and image, rather than people consciously trying to deal with the issue.

Obviously quite a bit of Americans are uneducated and do not have resources to understand the issues, so I personally think we need to do more to educate people all over the US, so there will be less "bigots". To me the alarming thing is people who are racist but have money and are educated. You would think going through education people will not develop racist views, but that isn't true.

Another point that TMC brought up, and that I would like to ask some of the black members at this forum, and that is do you think Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson are good leaders of the black community? I know they give back a lot and that is a positive, but as some members mentioned they seem to segregate the community rather than integrate. Personally I feel Bill Cosby would be a better one because he realized that we cannot just keep on self-segregating and the responsibility falls on BOTH sides, white and black.

Any thoughts? And please only response to my post if you want to have a civil discussion.

[wolfeskins]

Originally Posted by hooskins

Ok so instead of bitching at each other about stupid little points, how about discussing the big issue?

Racism is still present in America, how should we deal with it? Honestly how much have accomplished by arguing about the stupid filter.

Perhaps Imus should have lost his job, but he lost it for all the wrong reasons. He lost it because of money and image, rather than people consciously trying to deal with the issue.


Obviously quite a bit of Americans are uneducated and do not have resources to understand the issues, so I personally think we need to do more to educate people all over the US, so there will be less "bigots". To me the alarming thing is people who are racist but have money and are educated. You would think going through education people will not develop racist views, but that isn't true.

Another point that TMC brought up, and that I would like to ask some of the black members at this forum, and that is do you think Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson are good leaders of the black community? I know they give back a lot and that is a positive, but as some members mentioned they seem to segregate the community rather than integrate.


Any thoughts? And please only response to my post if you want to have a civil discussion.

i agree with you. i feel though that racism will always exist simply because
blacks and whites naturaly segregate themselves from the other. look into a cafateria in a elementary school you'll see kids of all races sitting together , now look at kids in jr high and high school and you'll see most whites sit with whites and most blacks sit with blacks, now look at people out of school whites hang out with whites and blacks hang out with blacks. i know there are exceptions but for the most part thats the way it is. when a controversial issue arises people tend to side with their own race.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by hooskins

Ok so instead of bitching at each other about stupid little points, how about discussing the big issue? Racism is still present in America, how should we deal with it? Honestly how much have accomplished by arguing about the stupid filter.

Perhaps Imus should have lost his job, but he lost it for all the wrong reasons. He lost it because of money and image, rather than people consciously trying to deal with the issue.

Obviously quite a bit of Americans are uneducated and do not have resources to understand the issues, so I personally think we need to do more to educate people all over the US, so there will be less "bigots". To me the alarming thing is people who are racist but have money and are educated. You would think going through education people will not develop racist views, but that isn't true.

Another point that TMC brought up, and that I would like to ask some of the black members at this forum, and that is do you think Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson are good leaders of the black community? I know they give back a lot and that is a positive, but as some members mentioned they seem to segregate the community rather than integrate. Personally I feel Bill Cosby would be a better one because he realized that we cannot just keep on self-segregating and the responsibility falls on BOTH sides, white and black.

Any thoughts? And please only response to my post if you want to have a civil discussion.

I guess I am pessimist when it comes to race relations. Going back through the history of the world it is rather apparent that there will always be some degree of self-segregation. I think as long as there is segegation then raciscm will always exist. It may get better or more may get worse but it is never going to totally go away. That's why I think leaders in all communities need to look for ways to foster relations rather than segregate. It sems perfectly fine if African Americans want to self segregate. Hell they segregate within their own community depedning on tone of skin. But if whites do the same THEN it is racist. Problem is it is racist in both cases.

As for Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton. I have two rather distinct feelings about each of these men and neither is positive.

Al Sharpton- I think Al Sharpton actually believes he is looking out for and leading the black community. I believe his intentions at the heart are pretty noble. But I think he is at his heart a dishonest man and he may even be a racist man. He seems to think it is fine to attack people of other races without impunity and never offer apologies. His treatment of the Duke players is a good example. All the political and racial trappings aside we can probably all agree that had the situation been reversed. Say 3 black Georgetown basketball players had been accused by a white stripper there would be no way have been out front leading the public cruxifiction. In fact I think we could imagine him out front wondering about the alleged victim's character and yelling about all dubious evidence and such. In fact he would be livid and he would be right to be. But once the story started to shift and it became clearer and clearer that these guys were getting railed did he ever come out and say "Hey wait a minute. Maybe we should back off a little?" Did he come out yesterday and say "You know I was too quick to judge and I am sorry" No he has just moved on and forgot all about it. That was a chance to lead. That was a chance to say "Many in the black community, led by me, made a quick judgement of a couple white guys and we were wrong. I am sorry." That kind of statement fosters better relations. That kind of statement leads the black community in a positive way.

Jesse Jackson- As much as I don't like Sharpton I hate Jackson. He is a dishonest and divisive man. He has done more to hurt the African American race than anyone since the 60's. He is a self righteous, self centered, loatheful person who's only real goal is to improve his bank account to the deteriment of the very people he purportedly is trying to help. He makes more money as long as African Americans continue to struggle so he makes sure they continue to. I hate him. I don't hate many people. He is one.

[hooskins]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

I guess I am pessimist when it comes to race relations. Going back through the history of the world it is rather apparent that there will always be some degree of self-segregation. I think as long as there is segegation then raciscm will always exist. It may get better or more may get worse but it is never going to totally go away. That's why I think leaders in all communities need to look for ways to foster relations rather than segregate. It sems perfectly fine if African Americans want to self segregate. Hell they segregate within their own community depedning on tone of skin. But if whites do the same THEN it is racist. Problem is it is racist in both cases.

As for Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton. I have two rather distinct feelings about each of these men and neither is positive.

Al Sharpton- I think Al Sharpton actually believes he is looking out for and leading the black community. I believe his intentions at the heart are pretty noble. But I think he is at his heart a dishonest man and he may even be a racist man. He seems to think it is fine to attack people of other races without impunity and never offer apologies. His treatment of the Duke players is a good example. All the political and racial trappings aside we can probably all agree that had the situation been reversed. Say 3 black Georgetown basketball players had been accused by a white stripper there would be no way have been out front leading the public cruxifiction. In fact I think we could imagine him out front wondering about the alleged victim's character and yelling about all dubious evidence and such. In fact he would be livid and he would be right to be. But once the story started to shift and it became clearer and clearer that these guys were getting railed did he ever come out and say "Hey wait a minute. Maybe we should back off a little?" Did he come out yesterday and say "You know I was too quick to judge and I am sorry" No he has just moved on and forgot all about it. That was a chance to lead. That was a chance to say "Many in the black community, led by me, made a quick judgement of a couple white guys and we were wrong. I am sorry." That kind of statement fosters better relations. That kind of statement leads the black community in a positive way.

Jesse Jackson- As much as I don't like Sharpton I hate Jackson. He is a dishonest and divisive man. He has done more to hurt the African American race than anyone since the 60's. He is a self righteous, self centered, loatheful person who's only real goal is to improve his bank account to the deteriment of the very people he purportedly is trying to help. He makes more money as long as African Americans continue to struggle so he makes sure they continue to. I hate him. I don't hate many people. He is one.

What about Bill Cosby? I think he is a better leader for the black community because he is equally hard on both sides(some may think he is actually tougher on blacks). He realizes both sides have work to do.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by hooskins

What about Bill Cosby? I think he is a better leader for the black community because he is equally hard on both sides(some may think he is actually tougher on blacks). He realizes both sides have work to do.

I'm not totally sure (so I could be speaking out of my ass), but it seems like there is a generational gap with regard to Cosby. People 50 and older tend to agree with Cosby and people under 50 tend to think he is a jerk.

[hooskins]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

I'm not totally sure (so I could be speaking out of my ass), but it seems like there is a generational gap with regard to Cosby. People 50 and older tend to agree with Cosby and people under 50 tend to think he is a jerk.

Why because he is a leader that is harsh on his own community too? I mean sometimes he might push it, but I think it is good that he makes blacks accountable too. There are two races in this issues not just whites. Both sides have work to do IMO.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by hooskins

Racism is still present in America, how should we deal with it?

To some extent, I believe it will always be present. Not everyone is or will be a well-adjusted,educated person who can accept people different from them in appearance and culture as an equal. Rather, there will likely always be some element of society that views those of a different race as inherently "worse" than themselves and the cultural group they themselves belong to. By doing so, these people will have both a scapegoat and built in "feel good" factor (i.e. - no matter how crappy things are at least I'm not a half-puerto rican/half indian mutt).

How do we deal with continued rascism? Time. I firmly believe that eventually, in maybe 4-5 generations, racism will be looked on as an anachronism. I think that, in general, it IS being dealt with. Continued condemnation of overt racism creates an atmosphere where children are exposed, at least publicly, to the notion that racism is wrong and that all people are entitled to respect. Generations of ingrained racism are not going to change in 20 or 30 years. The strides we, as a country, have made since the 1960's are significant. Overt racism is simply not permitted in public settings or by any governmental or other public institution.

Originally Posted by hooskins

Perhaps Imus should have lost his job, but he lost it for all the wrong reasons. He lost it because of money and image, rather than people consciously trying to deal with the issue..

To say he lost it b/c of money and image is similar to saying that the Civil War was about "states' rights" and not slavery. Yes - sponsers dropped out and cost his employers money and the sponsers dropped out b/c they did not want to be associated with the "image" Imus now carried b/c that would cost them money. BUT underlying the sponser's actions was the understanding that the public would not want to purchase products from companies that condoned the racist remarks.

Make no mistake about it - the ultimate reason for Imus cancellation was the public recognition that racism is wrong.

Originally Posted by hooskins

Obviously quite a bit of Americans are uneducated and do not have resources to understand the issues, so I personally think we need to do more to educate people all over the US, so there will be less "bigots". To me the alarming thing is people who are racist but have money and are educated. You would think going through education people will not develop racist views, but that isn't true.

Many of the "educated" people who are running our board rooms and businesses spent there first 20 or so years (say pre-1965ish) in a country that not only permitted racism but in a country where racism was the law of the land. Sure, they had to adapt to changing times, but on a very basic level some of these people were insulated from the popular tide that recognized the inherent unfairness and ultimate wrongness of racism.

In my opinion, it was only in the later 1980's and 90's that overt racism became truly unacceptable in the public forum. As the grandchildren and great grand children of these boomers grow up, fewer and fewer will be taught that racism, in any form is acceptable.

[100% PURE WHOOP ASS]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

To some extent, I believe it will always be present. Not everyone is or will be a well-adjusted,educated person who can accept people different from them in appearance and culture as an equal. Rather, there will likely always be some element of society that views those of a different race as inherently "worse" than themselves and the cultural group they themselves belong to. By doing so, these people will have both a scapegoat and built in "feel good" factor (i.e. - no matter how crappy things are at least I'm not a half-puerto rican/half indian mutt).

How do we deal with continued rascism? Time. I firmly believe that eventually, in maybe 4-5 generations, racism will be looked on as an anachronism. I think that, in general, it IS being dealt with. Continued condemnation of overt racism creates an atmosphere where children are exposed, at least publicly, to the notion that racism is wrong and that all people are entitled to respect. Generations of ingrained racism are not going to change in 20 or 30 years. The strides we, as a country, have made since the 1960's are significant. Overt racism is simply not permitted in public settings or by any governmental or other public institution.



To say he lost it b/c of money and image is similar to saying that the Civil War was about "states' rights" and not slavery. Yes - sponsers dropped out and cost his employers money and the sponsers dropped out b/c they did not want to be associated with the "image" Imus now carried b/c that would cost them money. BUT underlying the sponser's actions was the understanding that the public would not want to purchase products from companies that condoned the racist remarks.

Make no mistake about it - the ultimate reason for Imus cancellation was the public recognition that racism is wrong.



Many of the "educated" people who are running our board rooms and businesses spent there first 20 or so years (say pre-1965ish) in a country that not only permitted racism but in a country where racism was the law of the land. Sure, they had to adapt to changing times, but on a very basic level some of these people were insulated from the popular tide that recognized the inherent unfairness and ultimate wrongness of racism.

In my opinion, it was only in the later 1980's and 90's that overt racism became truly unacceptable in the public forum. As the grandchildren and great grand children of these boomers grow up, fewer and fewer will be taught that racism, in any form is acceptable.

Let me say this and I'm be done with this stupid ass subject, if anyone of a different race make a comment around me or my wife or kids, I will stomp the **** out of them, and wouldnt think twice about doing............NO BLACK PERSON SHOULD HAVE TO HEAR ANY OF THAT RACIST BULLSHIT FROM ANYONE, and if they do, they deserve an ass whoppin, but I tell you what, I'll PAY ANYONE TO SAY THAT SHIT IN MY FACE, THAT WHY IMUS, PUNK ASS TALKS BEHIND A RADIO, LIKE I SEE MOST PEOPLE TALK BIG SHIT BEHIND THERE COMPUTER,........but that gotdam stateman was not related to (white girls) and if you think so............your no better that that biget

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by 100% PURE WHOOP ASS

Let me say this and I'm be done with this stupid ass subject, if anyone of a different race make a comment around me or my wife or kids, I will stomp the **** out of them, and wouldnt think twice about doing............NO BLACK PERSON SHOULD HAVE TO HEAR ANY OF THAT RACIST BULLSHIT FROM ANYONE, and if they do, they deserve an ass whoppin, but I tell you what, I'll PAY ANYONE TO SAY THAT SHIT IN MY FACE, THAT WHY IMUS, PUNK ASS TALKS BEHIND A RADIO, LIKE I SEE MOST PEOPLE TALK BIG SHIT BEHIND THERE COMPUTER,........but that gotdam stateman was not related to (white girls) and if you think so............your no better that that biget

I have absolutely no clue as to what your point is and how it relates to the post you quoted. Are you disagreeing with me and asserting racism will eventually vanish? Are you agreeing with me that overt racism is not tolerated in public and governmental settings? At what point did I assert the remark in question was anything other than a racist/sexist remark? Are you saying I'm a bigot?

[hooskins]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

To some extent, I believe it will always be present. Not everyone is or will be a well-adjusted,educated person who can accept people different from them in appearance and culture as an equal. Rather, there will likely always be some element of society that views those of a different race as inherently "worse" than themselves and the cultural group they themselves belong to. By doing so, these people will have both a scapegoat and built in "feel good" factor (i.e. - no matter how crappy things are at least I'm not a half-puerto rican/half indian mutt).

How do we deal with continued rascism? Time. I firmly believe that eventually, in maybe 4-5 generations, racism will be looked on as an anachronism. I think that, in general, it IS being dealt with. Continued condemnation of overt racism creates an atmosphere where children are exposed, at least publicly, to the notion that racism is wrong and that all people are entitled to respect. Generations of ingrained racism are not going to change in 20 or 30 years. The strides we, as a country, have made since the 1960's are significant. Overt racism is simply not permitted in public settings or by any governmental or other public institution.



To say he lost it b/c of money and image is similar to saying that the Civil War was about "states' rights" and not slavery. Yes - sponsers dropped out and cost his employers money and the sponsers dropped out b/c they did not want to be associated with the "image" Imus now carried b/c that would cost them money. BUT underlying the sponser's actions was the understanding that the public would not want to purchase products from companies that condoned the racist remarks.

Make no mistake about it - the ultimate reason for Imus cancellation was the public recognition that racism is wrong.



Many of the "educated" people who are running our board rooms and businesses spent there first 20 or so years (say pre-1965ish) in a country that not only permitted racism but in a country where racism was the law of the land. Sure, they had to adapt to changing times, but on a very basic level some of these people were insulated from the popular tide that recognized the inherent unfairness and ultimate wrongness of racism.

In my opinion, it was only in the later 1980's and 90's that overt racism became truly unacceptable in the public forum. As the grandchildren and great grand children of these boomers grow up, fewer and fewer will be taught that racism, in any form is acceptable.

That is a good point because those in power might have grown up in environments of open racism. Perhaps time is the key factor.

But we can't just sit and watch the years go by and expect change because those same old people could be raising their kids with the same views. To me the challenge is for those kids to go against their parents, and realize what they are teaching them may be wrong. I think that is really hard, and I have had to do that in the past. My parents are good people and amazing parents, but they also have some views that stereotypical that I have had to challenge because I knew they were wrong.

And now think of the new rise of racism against those who are muslim/middle eastern or even brown skinned. Our generation is growing up dealing with that, and it our responsibility to make sure we dont raise our kids so they are racism in their future.