I knew the Pats were cheaters...

[djnemo65]

I can't remember a time in my lifetime when a professional team has been forced to forfeit a game ex post facto. Can anyone else?

[skinsguy]

Wow, I remember the days when the Patriots were the team to make fun of. Then, suddenly, they're the best team in the league this decade. And...it could all be because they cheat to win.

[Emmanuel]

Suddenly, Bill Belicheck's "defensive genius" seems so obvious...

(Wild Speculation: Bill Parcells could only win a Superbowl when Belicheck was his Defensive Coordinator. Hmm.......)

[Monkeydad]

Sorry, I wasn't making it personal, I just meant...they HAVE to be getting an advantage from it if they've been doing it for a while or even once at all. Why would they go through all of the effort if they gained nothing?

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Buster

Sorry, I wasn't making it personal, I just meant...they HAVE to be getting an advantage from it if they've been doing it for a while or even once at all. Why would they go through all of the effort if they gained nothing?

Like I said, too much has to happen in a short period of time in order for it to really work. Let's say the Jets call a 4-3 defense with a stunt and two blitzers. The Jets coach does his signal, then someone from the Pats has to pick that signal up from acorss the sideline, then relay the defense to Josh McDaniels since he is the playcaller. Then McDaniels has to call a play and a pass protection to off set that defense. All that has to happen in 40 seconds. Can it happen? Of course it can. But it's highly unlikely that it causes the outcome of a game. Let's put it this way. If they were doing this for a few years does it mean that if they didn't do it they would not have won 3 SB's? No way.

If you are the Jets and you are playing NE, they should have two guys doing dummy signals anyway just cause Eric M. use to coach there. Common sense right?

Personally, I think Bill B. is a cheating, not personality prick. He looks like a pure 100% dickhead. But I'm not going to sit here and say just cause they try and pick signals is the reason they are good. That is ridicules.

[70Chip]

Eric Mangini exposes Bill Belichick's spy games

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by 70Chip

Eric Mangini exposes Bill Belichick's spy games

Thanks for the link. I've always said that Belichick is overrated and this just adds to my reasons for thinking as much.

Here's some food for thought - Belichick was just 42-58 before Brady started. That means he lost about 60% of the time. Belichick's Patriots went just 5-13 before Brady started in the early part of the 2001 season. Brady-less Belichick-coached teams have posted losing records 5 times and winning records just once. Take away Brady and judge Belichick the head coach according to his wins and losses, and he isn't even mediocre.

[dgack]

skinsfan, the article I read suggested they were "decoding" the audibles, not the playcalls to the line. So in theory the defense would know what the shifts and hot routes were when the Jets audibled.

That said, it would not surprise me if Belichick was trying to figure out some way to intercept incoming playcalls, because the guy just seems like such a win-at-any-cost, jagoff.

[mooby]

If Roger Goodell suspended a quarterbacks coach for 5 games and fined him 100 grand because he tried HGH twice to improve his quality of life because he suffered from a really bad case of diabetes, I expect to see a much tougher punishment on Belichick. The guy was caught cheating, and he's an arrogant sob who wouldn't stop even though the Commish warned him before the season started.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by mooby

If Roger Goodell suspended a quarterbacks coach for 5 games and fined him 100 grand because he tried HGH twice to improve his quality of life because he suffered from a really bad case of diabetes, I expect to see a much tougher punishment on Belichick. The guy was caught cheating, and he's an arrogant sob who wouldn't stop even though the Commish warned him before the season started.

I agree, but I am not sure Goodell will punish him harder than Wilson. He SHOULD, but I don't think he will. I am expecting a draft pick, maybe two including a late rounder which is just a slap on the wrist.

[dmek25]

SGG, finally someone that agrees with me about Belichick. Bledsoe doesn't get hurt, and how many super bowls do they win? I'm not saying he wouldn't have eventually pulled him. but how long until they got to that point? highly over rated in my opinion

[mheisig]

I think everyone can just forget the idea of Goodell making them forfeit a game after the fact. As far as I know that's completely unprecedented in professional sports, besides the fact that even if the Patriots were stealing signals you can't prove they wouldn't have won the game anyway without stealing them. Regardless, a forfeit isn't happening.

Personally I think taking away draft picks is a slap on the wrist. Like someone else mentioned, the Patriots stock their picks anyway, and taking away picks punishes the entire organization by default for the sins of (potentially) a few. Taking away draft picks also doesn't necessarily hurt. Maybe they lose a good pick, maybe they don't, you'll never know. A massive fine and a lot of time of for a suspension will definitely hurt and definitely send a message, whereas taking draft picks just MIGHT hurt.

The individuals who had a hand in authorizing and directing this should be identified and punished individually, just as they would with steroids or gambling or personal misconduct. The coaching staff responsible should face some substantial fines and substantial suspension periods. By substantial I mean that if Goodell can identify that Belichick authorized or promoted this, he should be suspended for a year or more. That, to me, is the only equitable way send a message.

[mooby]

I hope Belichick gets suspended, it might be 4 games, but I'm hoping it will be 8 because then we wouldn't have to face him when we play them in week 8.

If Goodell only takes away a couple of their draft picks, including a late rounder, it will show that only the players will be held truly accountable for their actions. That would be alienating the players imo, and that's not a good thing. Coaches/front office personal should be held just as accountable as the players for their actions.

I just realized something. Back in the Patriots golden days, I would keep hearing about how Belichick was something like 13-0 when he played a team for the second time in a season and he lost the first time. What if he was recording the signals the first game and then used that videotape to prepare for the second game? Of course he would have a much easier time against that team.

As for the whole radio deal, if he was using that to his advantage to then he deserves to be punished even more. I will be completely disgusted with him if that is true, he clearly knows no bounds.


And on a different note...

Patriots Planet - New England Patriots Forums - I'm Glad We Got Caught

street cred? Gridiron Gangsters?

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by mooby

I just realized something. Back in the Patriots golden days, I would keep hearing about how Belichick was something like 13-0 when he played a team for the second time in a season and he lost the first time.

WOW. That could be huge.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by mooby

I hope Belichick gets suspended, it might be 4 games, but I'm hoping it will be 8 because then we wouldn't have to face him when we play them in week 8.

If Goodell only takes away a couple of their draft picks, including a late rounder, it will show that only the players will be held truly accountable for their actions. That would be alienating the players imo, and that's not a good thing. Coaches/front office personal should be held just as accountable as the players for their actions.

I just realized something. Back in the Patriots golden days, I would keep hearing about how Belichick was something like 13-0 when he played a team for the second time in a season and he lost the first time. What if he was recording the signals the first game and then used that videotape to prepare for the second game? Of course he would have a much easier time against that team.

As for the whole radio deal, if he was using that to his advantage to then he deserves to be punished even more. I will be completely disgusted with him if that is true, he clearly knows no bounds.


And on a different note...

Patriots Planet - New England Patriots Forums - I'm Glad We Got Caught

street cred? Gridiron Gangsters?

See, that's why I think the ENTIRE TEAM needs to be punished. You take away their 1st pick, you take away that win and give it to the Jets, and you suspend Belichek for a couple games.