A Playoff question: Campbell or Collins?

[SFREDSKIN]

Originally Posted by PIG#1

You Have To Go With Collins.he Seems Like He Is Very Comfortable In This Offense Right Now More Than Cambell.he Has Played Well And Don't Rush Campell Back.collins Could Be The Man.i See Two Michigan Guys In The Super Bowl At Qb.collins And Brady.joe Gibbs Wins His Fourth Super Bowl With 4 Differnt Qb.thats My Xmas Present.

And gets revenge against "Belicheat" the genius.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

It ain't broke, don't fix it. Collins.

[EternalEnigma21]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

It ain't broke, don't fix it. Collins.

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so... sellers should just stay on the sidelines, too? And hey, why don't we cut rocky, jansen, rogers, too. we're winning without them.

wtf??? am I really the only one who does't see this as an issue. Collin's pass protection played a huge role in his success. I'm watching the game right now and there are several instances where he has over 3 seconds with an 8 man rush to throw the ball... that's freaking amazing... and the cooley touchdown he held it for around 5 seconds...

[MTK]

Originally Posted by canthetuna

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so... sellers should just stay on the sidelines, too? And hey, why don't we cut rocky, jansen, rogers, too. we're winning without them.

wtf??? am I really the only one who does't see this as an issue. Collin's pass protection played a huge role in his success. I'm watching the game right now and there are several instances where he has over 3 seconds with an 8 man rush to throw the ball... that's freaking amazing... and the cooley touchdown he held it for around 5 seconds...

Don't over think it.

Collins is the hot hand and is playing great. Why go back to an inexperienced Campbell who undoubtedly would have some rust after sitting out a few weeks??

I just don't see the benefit in messing with a good thing.

Campbell is still our guy for the future, but Collins' time is right now.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by canthetuna

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so... sellers should just stay on the sidelines, too? And hey, why don't we cut rocky, jansen, rogers, too. we're winning without them.

wtf??? am I really the only one who does't see this as an issue. Collin's pass protection played a huge role in his success. I'm watching the game right now and there are several instances where he has over 3 seconds with an 8 man rush to throw the ball... that's freaking amazing... and the cooley touchdown he held it for around 5 seconds...

I guess you're the only one because from what I have seen of Collins he is on the money with the ball and he hasn't turned the ball over...can't say the same about JC this season (over throws and INTs). Until Collins screws up he deserves the chance to play regardless of how the o-line play has been.

[EternalEnigma21]

Originally Posted by saden1

I guess you're the only one because from what I have seen of Collins he is on the money with the ball and he hasn't turned the ball over...can't say the same about JC this season (over throws and INTs). Until Collins screws up he deserves the chance to play regardless of how the o-line play has been.

okay, so why would you not let collins start next season as well? that's what i don't understand. If you truly feel you have a better qb, start him...

Are you saying that you start collins next year over a healthy JC?


I guess I'm struggling with the whole idea that these games are too important for a healthy JC, but he's our guy... and what kind of message that sends to him, or to Collins for that matter?

[saden1]

Originally Posted by canthetuna

okay, so why would you not let collins start next season as well? that's what i don't understand. If you truly feel you have a better qb, start him...

Are you saying that you start collins next year over a healthy JC?


I guess I'm struggling with the whole idea that these games are too important for a healthy JC, but he's our guy... and what kind of message that sends to him, or to Collins for that matter?

If I'm not mistaken Jason Campbell has to earn the job...if he can't beat out Collins by all means start Collins next year too!

[EternalEnigma21]

Originally Posted by saden1

If I'm not mistaken Jason Campbell has to earn the job...if he can't beat out Collins by all means start Collins next year too!

again, the guy wasn't benched... he got hurt. So next year we re-sign collins and have an open QB competition in camp if Collins finishes stong?

Im just sick of having QB issues in this franchise, and if we're going to stick with Campbell and are counting on him to be the franchise QB, he needs to be in there. You don't bench your healthy starter in the important games, and if we or the team lacks that confidence, why wouldn't we persue a guy like McNabb?

I would take it as a vote of no confidence in JC.... its not like Collins is out there putting up 400 yards and 4tds/game, and yesterday he played against one of the worst pass D's in the league... if you're going to throw out the Giants game because of the wind you have to also consider the opponent yesterday.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by canthetuna

okay, so why would you not let collins start next season as well? that's what i don't understand. If you truly feel you have a better qb, start him...

Are you saying that you start collins next year over a healthy JC?


I guess I'm struggling with the whole idea that these games are too important for a healthy JC, but he's our guy... and what kind of message that sends to him, or to Collins for that matter?

This year has nothing to do with next year. Right now ride the hot hand in Collins and Campbell is unquestionably the starter next year. Hell, it's probably a long shot that Campbell would be healthy enough to return soon anyway, so this whole debate is probably all for nothing.

How about this scenario. Just pure hypothetical of course, what if Collins got the team to the NFC Championship and then Campbell was declared 100% ready to go. Would you still make the switch at that point?

[SFREDSKIN]

This Collins vs. Campbell debate is clearly explained by JLC:

TODD COLLINS - Dude is balling right now. No two ways about it. Jason Campbell is The Future and anyone who even thinks there should be a QB conundrum next season is crazy, to me, but having Collins as Mr. Present ain't bad and Todd has played his way into a hefty payday as a back-up beyond this season. The Skins are going to have to ante up to keep him as an unrestricted free agent.

Save for the fumble on the quick snap to beat that replay challenge, he was excellent. 22-for-29 for 254 with 2 TDs and no picks doesn't leave much to nitpick. Timing was off on some throws, but he has a 107 rating in three games for goodness sake, including that wind-swept night in Hoffa's swamp.

Collins had a pass of 20 yards or longer in each quarter, and the offense did a nice job picking on kid corner Marcus McCauley - who I think is going to be a good one - whether he was lined up on Reche Caldwell (nice game by him, some huge third-down catches) or Santana Moss.. Again, pressed for time before this flight to meet up with my family near Cooperstown takes off (if it does take off), but you guys tell me the last time that's happened around here. The Skins have 7 passes of 30 yards or more in 2-plus games since Collins replaced JC against the Bears. They had 11 such passes in the first 12 games.

[EternalEnigma21]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

How about this scenario. Just pure hypothetical of course, what if Collins got the team to the NFC Championship and then Campbell was declared 100% ready to go. Would you still make the switch at that point?

If I were making the call


at 100%... the only thing that would keep Campbell out of any playoff game or superbowl would be if Collins was throwing for 300+ yards and 3tds in the last couple of games. Campbell was a huge part of getting us this far, and I couldn't forget that. He's done the things the coaches wanted to see him do and everyone says he's worked the hardest of anyone on the team. If I'm coaching I reward that by giving him the chance. He's done what was asked of him and beyond to EARN that starting job already... thats why he's the starter.

If it's my team he doesn't lose it because of an injury. Unless he walks into the game and throws three picks in the first half I'd stay committed to him, too.

I love what Collins is doing right now, and I don't want to take anything away from it and appreciate it to the point where it pains me to detract from his accomplishments through this conversation, but I can't help but be guarded about crowning him our savior just yet... There's got to be a reason he hasn't started in 10 years. If he were that good someone would've seen it before he was 36 and the guy would've landed a starting job somewhere by now.


Let me play devil's advocate.... Its your team Matty, and we're going into the NFC championship game. Lets speculate that Collins hasn't been giong berserk, but playing well and managing the games well.

How do you explain to a perfectly healthy JC that He's not going to play, but not to get discouraged because he's our future QB without having him question your loyalty to him... Why would he go out next year and lay it on the line for you... stand in the pocket and take the hits to deliver the ball.... work so hard in the offseason and take his game to the next level, if once at the pinnacle, you're willing to jerk the rug out from under him...

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

How about this scenario. Just pure hypothetical of course, what if Collins got the team to the NFC Championship and then Campbell was declared 100% ready to go. Would you still make the switch at that point?

If Todd Collins can keep up this level of play for six games, and I mean, if he's the reason we are in the NFC Championship game because the defense has struggled and we won a few shootouts, then I think we could make a case to keep him entrenched as the starter.

The bottom line is that you have to play your best QB. Who's playing well right now can be a mirage: the idea is to play the guy who WILL play the best, not HAS played the best. After three impressive games from Collins, I still have no reason to think he's better than a healthy Campbell.

Do you?

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by canthetuna

so... sellers should just stay on the sidelines, too? And hey, why don't we cut rocky, jansen, rogers, too. we're winning without them.

wtf??? am I really the only one who does't see this as an issue. Collin's pass protection played a huge role in his success. I'm watching the game right now and there are several instances where he has over 3 seconds with an 8 man rush to throw the ball... that's freaking amazing... and the cooley touchdown he held it for around 5 seconds...

Most of the other guys have made all the good points for keeping Collins in, but here's my two cents; First as Matty said, this is all probably a moot discussion. Based on the JLC article Campbell hasn't done ANY running yet, even on a treadmill. Let's say the docs clear him to play (there is no way he is 100% in two weeks when he hasn't even stepped on a treadmill yet), are you going to risk permanent damage to the health of your franchise QB, when you have a back-up QB who is playing very well and the team is winning?

You mention "hurting Campbell's confidence" in a couple of posts, by not playing him. Let's say Campbell plays and his knee gets hurt again and requires 6 - 8 months of rehab, I'm pretty sure that will hurt his confidence and performance a lot worse than not starting a playoff game when his back-up has been winning and improbably lead the team to the playoffs. Again, talking about confidence, what if Campbell comes back in the playoffs, turns the ball over 2-3 times and the Skins go home. Not a great confidence booster either.

What Collins brings right now is confidence to the offense that he can execute and not make critical game-changing mistakes. It also brings confidence to the defense because they can be more aggressive and not be as concerned with possibly giving up a score that we can't respond to because the offense has struggled or is turning the ball over.

You mention the improved pass-pro and Collins having 3+ seconds with an 8-man rush. You still need to make the correct read and make an accurate throw with the heat on. I noticed Collins stayed calm in the pocket under a heavy rush, made good reads and threw accurate passes. He threw slants, outs and curls very well. Campbell has struggled with accuracy on slants and some outs this year, many times throwing low. The TD to Cooley, pass-pro was very good, but Collins also read the D perfectly, saw Cover-2, looked off the Safety to the outside and hit Cooley down the middle. I would like to think Campbell would make this play, but he is still basically a rookie as far as playing time goes and most 1-2nd year QBs probably don't make that play.

As far as cutting the other guys that are out, QB is a unique position and has to be handled differently than any other position on the field. Campbell will get to where Collins is in understanding the system, making the right plays, and eliminating the mistakes and the only way is through playing experience. Campbell is the guy in Week 1 2008 but right now Collins is hot, the team is winning, and Collins should continue to start. Collins is a back-up QB, he understands his role and right now is performing it very well.