Understanding the Issues: Education

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by onlydarksets

But there's no difference between your scenario and someone who grew up without any guidance and made a bad choice, but who now wants help establishing the very environment you and I were lucky enough to have as youths.

My last post was getting more to the heart of the matter. As for the direct response to your point here, you are absolutely right. That's why I've been saying throughout the thread that I'm all for helping kids with after-care (I recognize the thread is long and you may not have read every post).

The kids cannot help the situation they were born into, I'm fine with giving them after-care programs to keep them out of trouble and help guide them. Once they're provided these types of things though, if they're still making bad decisions as adults and showing no signs of learning from it, those are the folks I'd like to see cut loose from the social programs.

[onlydarksets]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

My last post was getting more to the heart of the matter. As for the direct response to your point here, you are absolutely right. That's why I've been saying throughout the thread that I'm all for helping kids with after-care (I recognize the thread is long and you may not have read every post).

The kids cannot help the situation they were born into, I'm fine with giving them after-care programs to keep them out of trouble and help guide them. Once they're provided these types of things though, if they're still making bad decisions as adults and showing no signs of learning from it, those are the folks I'd like to see cut loose from the social programs.

It is long, and I have missed a couple of things along the way (see my earlier post to firstdown), but this one I think I'm tracking.

The difference I am exploring is that we agree on the ends, but not the means. I think the parents deserve the help, while you believe it's the kids who deserve the break. That's what my comments have been geared toward. I do recognize that you are for the proposal, assuming the conditions you stated.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by onlydarksets

It is long, and I have missed a couple of things along the way (see my earlier post to firstdown), but this one I think I'm tracking.

The difference I am exploring is that we agree on the ends, but not the means. I think the parents deserve the help, while you believe it's the kids who deserve the break. That's what my comments have been geared toward. I do recognize that you are for the proposal, assuming the conditions you stated.

So the parents that have shown that they make the bad choices and have the social programs allready need more help? What has the billions of dollars that we have allready spent done to correct the problem? Nothing. Sure you can go out and find examples of how people have used the social programs and bettered their life and then contributed back to the community but there are far more that just keep using the system for every penny they can get. The one good thing about after school programs is that it does go directly to the children and not to the parent. I just feel its a jod that is better delt with on a local level than depended on the fed gov. and having to play by their rules to receive the funding. Also if the money is not just a hand out from the fed gov the local community will do a better job on using the money wisely.

[onlydarksets]

Originally Posted by firstdown

So the parents that have shown that they make the bad choices and have the social programs allready need more help? What has the billions of dollars that we have allready spent done to correct the problem? Nothing. Sure you can go out and find examples of how people have used the social programs and bettered their life and then contributed back to the community but there are far more that just keep using the system for every penny they can get.

We're not talking about other social welfare programs - just the after-school care.

Originally Posted by firstdown

The one good thing about after school programs is that it does go directly to the children and not to the parent. I just feel its a jod that is better delt with on a local level than depended on the fed gov. and having to play by their rules to receive the funding. Also if the money is not just a hand out from the fed gov the local community will do a better job on using the money wisely.

That's what I said. As Schneed said, it's a long post, and you probably haven't read every single post.