Taxing the rich - what is the cutoff?

[saden1]

Originally Posted by RIGGO/NYC

You know I was going to join this thread on the discussion of taxes, but when I hear idiots actually defending staying in Iraq because we owe the poor Iraqi people, I just lose all respect for them. We should worry about Americans! Our leaders lied to us and there is absolutely no excuse to keep risking the lives of our troops to make up for the "mistakes" (yeah right) of Bush and Cheaney. The money we are spending on this war could be going to education and healthcare. Instead of feeling bad for Iraqi people, maybe you should think about the 50 million Americans that do not have healthcare. We are the only modern industrialized country that does not have universal healthcare. France is ranked No.1 by the W.H.O. (world healthcare org) and the U.S. is ranked 37th. In France if you are sick a doc will come to your house, here you are thrown in the street if do not have insurance. Anyone who supports Iraq, should not be allowed to speak!!! PERIOD!!!! You are an idiot who really needs to pick up a book and do some research about the ramifications this war has had on our country and for nothing. There is nothing to be gained. We have created more Anti-American sentiment by being there, than there was previously. Iraq was never a threat to us, it was Osama Bin Laden, whom we still have not caught. Thank god the days of the Republicans in Washington are coming to an end!!!!!!!!!! OBAMA says knock you out!!!

Another Marxian propaganda perpetrator in the house. If you like France so much why don't you move there? It seems to me that you'll be much happier there.

[SC Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

Before you call people idiots and suggest they don't read, I would suggest you read the attached links rather than get all your info from the headlines of the NY Times, Washington Post and ABC:

Saddam's Dangerous Friends

The Mother of All Connections

Andrew C. McCarthy on Iraq on National Review Online

How does ABC make the list? Giant corporate owned media outlet that doesn't really provide any worthwhile news (and employs George Will at least one day a week) - no offense to anyone in their employ, hey ESPN still has some good stuff. Could we at least get credit for some decent Trotskyite outlets like The Nation or NPR or even The New Republic?

Originally Posted by saden1

Another Marxian propaganda perpetrator in the house. If you like France so much why don't you move there? It seems to me that you'll be much happier there.

Saden, I think you might have hit upon the best way to respond to this thread ... I might just totally ignore it if not for your wonderful hyperbole.

[jsarno]

I don't really want to get deep into this discussion cause it ends up being a touchy subject for many, but the only true "fair" way to impose taxes is to make it a flat percentage. It's shouldn't matter if you make 1 million a year, or 10k a year, you should have the same percentage taken out of your check. (note, not the same "AMOUNT", but same "PERCENTAGE"). The fact that people that make more money are taxed more even though they worked for the money is beyond me. Punish the rich is not my idea of equality.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by jsarno

I don't really want to get deep into this discussion cause it ends up being a touchy subject for many, but the only true "fair" way to impose taxes is to make it a flat percentage. It's shouldn't matter if you make 1 million a year, or 10k a year, you should have the same percentage taken out of your check. (note, not the same "AMOUNT", but same "PERCENTAGE"). The fact that people that make more money are taxed more even though they worked for the money is beyond me. Punish the rich is not my idea of equality.

I couldn't agree more. If we had a flat tax everything would be great. If you make 10K you should get another job or second job and then you might be able to afford that $4.50 gallon of gas and that $4 gallon of milk and won't have to rely on a tax scheme that fleeces the rich.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by saden1

I couldn't agree more. If we had a flat tax everything would be great. If you make 10K you should get another job or second job and then you might be able to afford that $4.50 gallon of gas and that $4 gallon of milk and won't have to rely on a tax scheme that fleeces the rich.

No...it's righting what is already wrong.
You see the "rich" as people that can afford to pay more, and you're right, they can...but why should they? If you can somehow convince me that is equality, then your sarcasm holds water...until then get off your poor me soapbox and think of someone other than yourself...think of what is "fair".

ps- if you only make 10k a year, you're damn right you need a second job, or a better first...you shouldn't expect others to pay the way for you. (which is what you are suggesting with your sarcasm)

[saden1]

Originally Posted by jsarno

No...it's righting what is already wrong.
You see the "rich" as people that can afford to pay more, and you're right, they can...but why should they? If you can somehow convince me that is equality, then your sarcasm holds water...until then get off your poor me soapbox and think of someone other than yourself...think of what is "fair".

ps- if you only make 10k a year, you're damn right you need a second job, or a better first...you shouldn't expect others to pay the way for you. (which is what you are suggesting with your sarcasm)

Since you feel the rich have no obligations for the welfare of society, would it be fair to say that I am entitled to be unsupported in matters concerning their welfare?

p.s. If the world was fair and everything was equal the word rich would be undefined.

[steveo395]

Originally Posted by saden1

I couldn't agree more. If we had a flat tax everything would be great. If you make 10K you should get another job or second job and then you might be able to afford that $4.50 gallon of gas and that $4 gallon of milk and won't have to rely on a tax scheme that fleeces the rich.

I don't want to turn this into another thread about oil, but this is exactly why we need to drill for oil here. If we were energy independent, gas would be cheap again and the recession would be over.

[onlydarksets]

This wasn't even supposed to be a political thread - I was just wondering what the cutoff for "rich" is these days.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by onlydarksets

This wasn't even supposed to be a political thread - I was just wondering what the cutoff for "rich" is these days.

most people consider it 250k, but i think 500k for a household is a much better figure due to the cost of living around DC.

and, btw (not to onlydarksets, but other wh've mentioned it), i don't think a flat tax is entirely fair, since someone making 25k/year needs that extra 15% a lot more than someone making 20mill/year.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by That Guy

most people consider it 250k, but i think 500k for a household is a much better figure due to the cost of living around DC.

and, btw (not to onlydarksets, but other wh've mentioned it), i don't think a flat tax is entirely fair, since someone making 25k/year needs that extra 15% a lot more than someone making 20mill/year.

It's about being able to put food on the table and having enough to live.

BTW someone making 250K a year makes ~14K a month after taxes (without deduction) in Virginia. Are we subscribing to the Sprewell mantra here?

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by saden1

It's about being able to put food on the table and having enough to live.

BTW someone making 250K a year makes ~14K a month after taxes (without deduction) in Virginia. Are we subscribing to the Sprewell mantra here?

wtf are you talking about? i said someone making 25k a year needs the 15% that a flat tax would charge them to live on, since 25k/year is dick money. I don't see what's so sprewell about someone who'd make $1770/month w/ rent or a condo mortgage running $1100 in NoVa needing the 15% extra that a flat tax would take from him.

please read my posts more carefully :P it's not like this is the first or fourth time.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by That Guy

wtf are you talking about? i said someone making 25k a year needs the 15% that a flat tax would charge them to live on, since 25k/year is dick money. I don't see what's so sprewell about someone who'd make $1770/month w/ rent or a condo mortgage running $1100 in NoVa needing the 15% extra that a flat tax would take from him.

please read my posts more carefully :P it's not like this is the first or fourth time.

Don't have a cow man, I'm not trying to antagonize you, I'm merely elaborating on what you wrote.

The Sprewell reference is in regards to 250K possibly not being enough.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by That Guy

wtf are you talking about? i said someone making 25k a year needs the 15% that a flat tax would charge them to live on, since 25k/year is dick money. I don't see what's so sprewell about someone who'd make $1770/month w/ rent or a condo mortgage running $1100 in NoVa needing the 15% extra that a flat tax would take from him.

please read my posts more carefully :P it's not like this is the first or fourth time.

Under the flat tax plain lower income families would receive a tax credit so low income families would still not pay taxes under the flat tax plan. Some would even receive more credit back then they paid in taxes.

[onlydarksets]

Originally Posted by That Guy

most people consider it 250k, but i think 500k for a household is a much better figure due to the cost of living around DC.

That seems more reasonable to me. Then again, I don't make $500k/year, so it's hard to speak for that type of household.

You're right though - cost of living is a factor.

[RIGGO/NYC]

Dude if you want to ban me go ahead. Unlike some people on this forum, I actually have a life and would lose no sleep over not being able to post, since as you can see from my history I do not post often anyway. Anyway, yeah I might get a little overboard when it comes to political discussions, as I am a political science major and certain subjects are particullarly sensitive to me. Especially when people are speaking about something that is not a debatable subject. There is no justification for this war whatsoever. When I see soldiers on TV without legs (blown off for nothing, but oil) and children that will never know their fathers, it is the people who try to justify this war that I most despise. I wonder if they would give their legs or they're own lives while their wives were pregnant with their baby, so that their child would have never known them. Yeah, but god forbid we cut and run and America looks bad, that is whats really important, America has to show how powerful it is. Maybe America should show it has the ability to admit when it is wrong. Really ask yourself, is this war worth one American life. Answer: NO! Nevertheless, the person whose post I was responding to clearly did not do their research on the Iraq war. There is no debate to be had on the subject. If you support the war, then you clearly have a low IQ and just simply have not weighed the postives versus the negatives. Politicians employ a rhetoric in a time of war that is similar to the appoach they take with the "war on drugs." They try to strike fear in to individuals to gain their support for their approach and those nieve enough to buy this nonsense are just not intellectually worthy of my rebuttle. Therefore, I'd rather just have a little fun with their under-educated minds and insult them. Call it childish, but I act childish when speaking to adults with the intellect of a 7 year-old. No, I do not get my info from the NY Times (the best paper in the world), but I get it from BBC and my classes at school. Go to Europe and see what the citizens in many of the western/central EU countries think of the United States current course in foreign affairs, instead of sitting around your local Irish Pub in D.C. Nooooooo PLEASE DO NOT BANNN MEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! MY LIFE WOULD BE OVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GO REDSKINS!!! (Something we do agree on)
P.S. If any of you knuckle heads really want a debate, then I will gladly accept the challenge. I'll gather the other students on my debate team and we can take this discussion to a public blog. I would love to just humiliate anyone who supports this war.