Observation on Campbell

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by 30gut

What makes you say this?

One of the things Zorn and others (Jaws, Aikman) praise Jason for is that he does go through his progressions.

Campbell Is Earning Zorn's Trust - washingtonpost.com

The tendency was something Zorn knew he would have to address with Campbell, but the former Seahawks quarterback smiled as he analyzed the young signal caller's performance during his news conference later in the day.

"Remember, at the beginning of the season I couldn't get him off that receiver and now he is off him, you know, five yards down the field. Boy, he's looking for number two and number three," the first-year head coach said, chuckling. "So we'll get him back on track. I think he's playing well, though."

I don't know bro, this is like a direct contradiction of what you're saying huh?

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But it doesn't change the fact that Jason was at one point being considered for league MVP.

Here's a question for you and BeastsoftheNFCeast and BigHairedAristocrat

If Jason was being considered for MVP can you admit that Jason was at least playing well in the 1st half of the season?

Here are some more quotes you might like:
With tough love from Zorn, Campbell now among elite QBs - USATODAY.com

Former Pittsburgh Steelers head coach Bill Cowher considers Campbell a leading candidate for mid-season league MVP.

"Jason Campbell has played as well as anybody has in the NFL at his position," Cowher, now a CBS analyst, says. "He's thrown for good numbers. He's got no turnovers. He's big, strong and able to move out of the pocket and make throws down the field.

"He's brought his team back when they've been down. I've been very impressed with Jason Campbell's play."
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Fox Sports lead NFL analyst Troy Aikman says"With all the coaching changes, I didn't know how it would play out with Jim Zorn becoming a first-time head coach and play-caller and losing defensive coordinator Gregg Williams and Jason Campbell having to learn a new system again."
"The reason they're closing people out is the way Jim Zorn is calling games.
"He's going for it on fourth down and throwing on first down in the fourth quarter because Jason understands about taking care of the ball."

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"I thought Jason would eventually play well under Jim Zorn," ESPN Monday Night Football analyst Ron Jaworski says. "I didn't think he'd play this well, this early.
"I've seen his game ascending. He can make every throw a quarterback has to have, the tough stick throw, the deep out, the seam route. He has great anticipation. I thought he'd become a rock-solid quarterback.
"That it's happened this quickly really is a tribute to Jim Zorn."

Just stop trying 30gut. Reason and expert analysis falls on deaf ears with the Campbell haters around here. You can point out concrete analysis from experts left and right, and not only won't any of the haters acknowledge it, they'll still preach on like they know what they're talking about.

Not to mention the fact that there are probably at least half a dozen threads dedicated to how "bad" of a qb JC is, yet these new threads keep popping up.

Yours is an honorable effort, but some people just don't really like to listen to reason.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Just stop trying 30gut. Reason and expert analysis falls on deaf ears with the Campbell haters around here. You can point out concrete analysis from experts left and right, and not only won't any of the haters acknowledge it, they'll still preach on like they know what they're talking about.

Not to mention the fact that there are probably at least half a dozen threads dedicated to how "bad" of a qb JC is, yet these new threads keep popping up.

Yours is an honorable effort, but some people just don't really like to listen to reason.

Well, hey, reason is directly contradicting what they want to think, so I mean, doesn't it have to be wrong?

I mean, a lot of the criticisms against JC in this thread are being totally 100% made up. Then there are other criticisms that are there: long release, from the south, not Matt Ryan, that are true, but are being used improperly to support conclusions that they don't actually support.

And that's inclusive of all the anti-Campbell arguments. Made up evidence. Misused evidence. You'd think if the guy was really not the future of the team, someone could make a stronger argument than "I'm not sold on him", but that was firstdowns argument, and it was the best non-pro-Campbell argument in this entire 6 page thread.

Sadly.

[irish]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Just stop trying 30gut. Reason and expert analysis falls on deaf ears with the Campbell haters around here. You can point out concrete analysis from experts left and right, and not only won't any of the haters acknowledge it, they'll still preach on like they know what they're talking about.

Not to mention the fact that there are probably at least half a dozen threads dedicated to how "bad" of a qb JC is, yet these new threads keep popping up.

Yours is an honorable effort, but some people just don't really like to listen to reason.

He did go thru progressions good but like Sonny said, you can train any lineman to go thru progressions its what happens after the snap that counts as much or more than progressions and Sonny said he hasnt seen anything from JC after the snap that gets him excited about JCs future.

[tryfuhl]

Originally Posted by 30gut

What makes you say this?

One of the things Zorn and others (Jaws, Aikman) praise Jason for is that he does go through his progressions.

Campbell Is Earning Zorn's Trust - washingtonpost.com

The tendency was something Zorn knew he would have to address with Campbell, but the former Seahawks quarterback smiled as he analyzed the young signal caller's performance during his news conference later in the day.

"Remember, at the beginning of the season I couldn't get him off that receiver and now he is off him, you know, five yards down the field. Boy, he's looking for number two and number three," the first-year head coach said, chuckling. "So we'll get him back on track. I think he's playing well, though."

I don't know bro, this is like a direct contradiction of what you're saying huh?

-----------------------------------------------------------------------



But it doesn't change the fact that Jason was at one point being considered for league MVP.

Here's a question for you and BeastsoftheNFCeast and BigHairedAristocrat

If Jason was being considered for MVP can you admit that Jason was at least playing well in the 1st half of the season?

Here are some more quotes you might like:
With tough love from Zorn, Campbell now among elite QBs - USATODAY.com

Former Pittsburgh Steelers head coach Bill Cowher considers Campbell a leading candidate for mid-season league MVP.

"Jason Campbell has played as well as anybody has in the NFL at his position," Cowher, now a CBS analyst, says. "He's thrown for good numbers. He's got no turnovers. He's big, strong and able to move out of the pocket and make throws down the field.

"He's brought his team back when they've been down. I've been very impressed with Jason Campbell's play."
-------------------------------------------------------
Fox Sports lead NFL analyst Troy Aikman says"With all the coaching changes, I didn't know how it would play out with Jim Zorn becoming a first-time head coach and play-caller and losing defensive coordinator Gregg Williams and Jason Campbell having to learn a new system again."
"The reason they're closing people out is the way Jim Zorn is calling games.
"He's going for it on fourth down and throwing on first down in the fourth quarter because Jason understands about taking care of the ball."

-------------------------------------------------------------
"I thought Jason would eventually play well under Jim Zorn," ESPN Monday Night Football analyst Ron Jaworski says. "I didn't think he'd play this well, this early.
"I've seen his game ascending. He can make every throw a quarterback has to have, the tough stick throw, the deep out, the seam route. He has great anticipation. I thought he'd become a rock-solid quarterback.
"That it's happened this quickly really is a tribute to Jim Zorn."

He had a bit more time to where he COULD do that. Are you not saying that (and plenty of this has to do with the o-line play) he held on longer than he probably should've on many plays as well?

I point out one part of the game that a QB new to this system is not 100% on and all of a sudden I'm a Campbell hater, you guys are incredible.

[SBXVII]

^ Are the Mason threads still open? LOL.

[SirClintonPortis]

Seems like he was getting rid of the ball in less than 3 seconds on a few critical passes in the first half of the Eagles game, i.e the very first play of that game. If he were in a stupor at the time, he should've been sacked since he didn't get his 6 seconds.

[SOUL-SKINS]

Guys, barring an injury Campbell will start next year. There are alot of "what ifs".
Is it the OL, is it the lack of a running game, does he make slow reads, blah, blah ,blah.
WHO KNOWS WHAT THE F'ING PROBLEM IS!!!!! I CAN'T TAKE THIS SHIT ANYMORE!!!!
I JUST WANT TO WIN!!!................sorry...i fliped out. Anyway, lets start with the OL then go from there.
We have two very promising rookie wideouts. Your offense is only as good as your offensive line.. PERIOD!

[bedlamVR]

I know 99% of the fans have made their minds up on Campbell regardless of what is played out on the field .

I have read their arguments and the though out counter arguments and seen Campbell play every game this year ... and yes he has had bad plays along with good plays . Along with a bunch of other players ...

and to be honest, after looking at everything. I can come up with just one conculsion and it is not said lightly ..its not Campbell it maybe something wrong with some of the fans ... .. I just cannot help but think if Campbell was white ... then we would not be looking for his replacement ...I know they would not be calling for some guy drafted in the 6th round who has shown nothing in an NFL game ... comments about him being dumb and his attitude because he is from the south just sound I don't know like some of you are posting on here with pointy white hats and burning crosses ...

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by bedlamVR

I know 99% of the fans have made their minds up on Campbell regardless of what is played out on the field .

I have read their arguments and the though out counter arguments and seen Campbell play every game this year ... and yes he has had bad plays along with good plays . Along with a bunch of other players ...

and to be honest, after looking at everything. I can come up with just one conculsion and it is not said lightly ..its not Campbell it maybe something wrong with some of the fans ... .. I just cannot help but think if Campbell was white ... then we would not be looking for his replacement ...I know they would not be calling for some guy drafted in the 6th round who has shown nothing in an NFL game ... comments about him being dumb and his attitude because he is from the south just sound I don't know like some of you are posting on here with pointy white hats and burning crosses ...

#1. I never said anything about him being black.
#2. I said "he has that laid back Southern attitude."
#3. I used Favre as an example. Which means I compared JC to Favre. I would think that is a good thing....whether black or white or anyother color.
#4. I'll tell you what pisses me off and that's people like you who wear their pointy black hats always trying to turn everything into a racial issue cause you have nothing better to do in your life but to try and stir animosity.

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by bedlamVR

I know 99% of the fans have made their minds up on Campbell regardless of what is played out on the field .

I have read their arguments and the though out counter arguments and seen Campbell play every game this year ... and yes he has had bad plays along with good plays . Along with a bunch of other players ...

and to be honest, after looking at everything. I can come up with just one conculsion and it is not said lightly ..its not Campbell it maybe something wrong with some of the fans ... .. I just cannot help but think if Campbell was white ... then we would not be looking for his replacement ...I know they would not be calling for some guy drafted in the 6th round who has shown nothing in an NFL game ... comments about him being dumb and his attitude because he is from the south just sound I don't know like some of you are posting on here with pointy white hats and burning crosses ...

Well, I think it's naive to say that there is no element of this with some fans, it'd be hard to paint with too broad of a brush.

There is a certain undertone with comments from some folks that is consistent with the historical "criticisms" of black QB (too slow, can't read defenses, not smart enough to pick up the offense, can't adjust to defenses, etc) I think most of us want to see a winner and a leader under center regardless of what he looks like.

That being said, to firmly entrench oneself in either camp of he definitely is or definitely isn't being scrutinized based largely on skin color is equally ignorant.

[tryfuhl]

Originally Posted by bedlamVR

I know 99% of the fans have made their minds up on Campbell regardless of what is played out on the field .

I have read their arguments and the though out counter arguments and seen Campbell play every game this year ... and yes he has had bad plays along with good plays . Along with a bunch of other players ...

and to be honest, after looking at everything. I can come up with just one conculsion and it is not said lightly ..its not Campbell it maybe something wrong with some of the fans ... .. I just cannot help but think if Campbell was white ... then we would not be looking for his replacement ...I know they would not be calling for some guy drafted in the 6th round who has shown nothing in an NFL game ... comments about him being dumb and his attitude because he is from the south just sound I don't know like some of you are posting on here with pointy white hats and burning crosses ...

you're making a non-issue into an issue

the south "laid back style" transcends color man

[bedlamVR]

Okay I am sorry about the last post but it needed to be said .. I do think some of the attitude towards 17 is because of the colour of his skin .

I am just fustrated with every single message board and Redskins blog being filled with the same drivel . He holds the ball too long he locks onto one reciever etc etc

I have heard some very compelling evidence on both sides of the arguments but so many of the anti Campbell posters would rather be right so perpetuate the myth rather than actually look at what is happening .

Give the team time ... Give Campbell time and we will see who is right .

And btw I think you can track the teams woes on offense back to when Samuels knee really started to bother him (Steelers game I think ) just a thought

[GusFrerotte]

Originally Posted by bedlamVR

Okay I am sorry about the last post but it needed to be said .. I do think some of the attitude towards 17 is because of the colour of his skin .

I am just fustrated with every single message board and Redskins blog being filled with the same drivel . He holds the ball too long he locks onto one reciever etc etc

I have heard some very compelling evidence on both sides of the arguments but so many of the anti Campbell posters would rather be right so perpetuate the myth rather than actually look at what is happening .

Give the team time ... Give Campbell time and we will see who is right .

And btw I think you can track the teams woes on offense back to when Samuels knee really started to bother him (Steelers game I think ) just a thought

When the hell did race become a factor? God damn man. People ripped Gus, Ramsey, and Brunell to shreds in any Skins forum when they were around and not getting the job done. Face it dude, we all want a true franchise QB ala the Mannings, Brees, Brady, you name it, and JC is just an average QB. Do you think him being black means he shouldn't be under any criticism for any shortcomings? He will get his chance next season to prove his critics wrong, and if he doesn't step it up, we simply won't resign him ala Frerotte. You obviously haven't been a Skins blogger for that long, but every QB we have had since the dawning of the net has been ripped on and dissected on his foibles. JC is just the current guy on the list. Skins fans are looking for their next Sammy, Sonny, or even Joe T. It is simple as that.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by bedlamVR

Okay I am sorry about the last post but it needed to be said .. I do think some of the attitude towards 17 is because of the colour of his skin .

No, it didn't need to be said. The fans on this site deserve more than a simplistic race card slap. We all bleed Burgundy and Gold, and love the players that we see as winners. JC is the qb and is going to get a larger accolade when we win, and a larger blame when we lose. That was a dumb sad comment. (ok for polity i will add - IMO)

[tryfuhl]

Originally Posted by bedlamVR

Okay I am sorry about the last post but it needed to be said .. I do think some of the attitude towards 17 is because of the colour of his skin .

I am just fustrated with every single message board and Redskins blog being filled with the same drivel . He holds the ball too long he locks onto one reciever etc etc

I have heard some very compelling evidence on both sides of the arguments but so many of the anti Campbell posters would rather be right so perpetuate the myth rather than actually look at what is happening .

Give the team time ... Give Campbell time and we will see who is right .

And btw I think you can track the teams woes on offense back to when Samuels knee really started to bother him (Steelers game I think ) just a thought

but yes, he definitely locks in too much.. telegraphs every throw and if he doesn't have cooley or someone to drop it off to, he's lost... a lot of qb's only look at one side of the field and it seems like he looks at even less

regardless, I think that he'll get into the system and I believe that he's good enough to not be a liability to the team and program, but we have to grow in other areas to allow this