For all you D Hall lovers

[44ever]

Originally Posted by irish

Hall's history seems to show that he behaves himself until he signs that big contract then he turns into a different player, the one even terrible Oakland wouldnt put up with. I'm not sure if this will happen with the Skins but I'm not sure he's the kind of guy I'd drop a bunch of money on because history says its a mistake.

I understand youre concern with Hall. I think thats in the back of eveyones mind. But he just turned 25 years old. So at some point he would start thinking about his stamp on the NFL. He has the talent so I dont see him not showing it. I have a feeling he will be all grown up come next season. I hope

[irish]

Originally Posted by 44ever

I understand youre concern with Hall. I think thats in the back of eveyones mind. But he just turned 25 years old. So at some point he would start thinking about his stamp on the NFL. He has the talent so I dont see him not showing it. I have a feeling he will be all grown up come next season. I hope

While I hope he grows I'm not sure if I was running the Skins I would want to be paying him a bunch of $ in the hope of him acting like a professional.

[44ever]

Originally Posted by irish

While I hope he grows I'm not sure if I was running the Skins I would want to be paying him a bunch of $ in the hope of him acting like a professional.

I would think his offeason demeanor is being watched. And he did show himself to be a professional for the time he played with us. As well as a tremendous talent and a will to contribute. Its not like if the Skins dont sign him nobody will. He knows that and so do the Skins.

I think he wants to be part of the Skins org.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by 44ever

I would think his offeason demeanor is being watched. And he did show himself to be a professional for the time he played with us. As well as a tremendous talent and a will to contribute. Its not like if the Skins dont sign him nobody will. He knows that and so do the Skins.

I think he wants to be part of the Skins org.

He's definitely said so... aside from being "home" maybe he's realized a locker room full of veteran leaders is the right environment for him and regardless of a few cuts and FA moves this offseason we'll still have core group of vets who will never let the drama bullsh*t get out of hand.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by irish

Hall's history seems to show that he behaves himself until he signs that big contract then he turns into a different player, the one even terrible Oakland wouldnt put up with. I'm not sure if this will happen with the Skins but I'm not sure he's the kind of guy I'd drop a bunch of money on because history says its a mistake.

Yeah since Oakland is such a model franchise for a "bad" player to change. Actually if you are looking at "history" a terrible Randy Moss in Oakland went to a good locker room in NE and did very well (character-wise). It's funny how people forget that Sean Taylor was headed towards the wrong path, and changed for the better.

Unless Hall is an idiot with half a brain, I think he has learned his lesson after being humiliated by getting cut in Oakland.

[irish]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

Yeah since Oakland is such a model franchise for a "bad" player to change. Actually if you are looking at "history" a terrible Randy Moss in Oakland went to a good locker room in NE and did very well (character-wise). It's funny how people forget that Sean Taylor was headed towards the wrong path, and changed for the better.

Unless Hall is an idiot with half a brain, I think he has learned his lesson after being humiliated by getting cut in Oakland.

Like I mentioned, he only seems to go south once he gets paid. I'm not sure the organization has anything to do with it. The reason Moss cooled it in NE is that NE wins. Winning usually cures all problems. I hesitate to say this about ST because it did look like he was on his way down the good path but the journey had just started when he was killed so its hard to know how it would have turned out. Hall could be an idiot or maybe not. Most of these guys are idiots and I'm not sure he saw his cutting by Oak as a humilitation as I'm sure he believes it had nothing to do with his behavior and everything to do with Oak. All I'm saying is why take the chance with so much money and a questionable guy.

[44ever]

Originally Posted by irish

Like I mentioned, he only seems to go south once he gets paid. I'm not sure the organization has anything to do with it. The reason Moss cooled it in NE is that NE wins. Winning usually cures all problems. I hesitate to say this about ST because it did look like he was on his way down the good path but the journey had just started when he was killed so its hard to know how it would have turned out. Hall could be an idiot or maybe not. Most of these guys are idiots and I'm not sure he saw his cutting by Oak as a humilitation as I'm sure he believes it had nothing to do with his behavior and everything to do with Oak. All I'm saying is why take the chance with so much money and a questionable guy.

You make a great argument Irish. But I think the Skins are willing to take the chance. You could be right. I hope not. This argument could also be made for many FA's as history has shown. So what do we do? I think the Skins are willing to overlook his past in favor of his current talent. That's the only explenation I have. And like stated earlier he has shown maturity lately. If we offered him less than he's statistically worth and he walked would you be ok with that knowing the talent he brings?

[irish]

Originally Posted by 44ever

You make a great argument Irish. But I think the Skins are willing to take the chance. You could be right. I hope not. This argument could also be made for many FA's as history has shown. So what do we do? I think the Skins are willing to overlook his past in favor of his current talent. That's the only explenation I have. And like stated earlier he has shown maturity lately. If we offered him less than he's statistically worth and he walked would you be ok with that knowing the talent he brings?

I guess I think chances are taken with undrafted free agents or late round picks not high $ free agents. I would have a problem if he walked. I think the Skins need to learn to "get over" players. As an example Porter wanted big $ so Pgh wished him well and let Mia pay him. Did he play great for Mia, yes, but the Steelers had another great player waiting in the wings who played just as good (maybe even better) at a cheaper price. I know cheaper isnt what the Skins do (and the fans want "names" as well) but I think the organization would be better off if they adopted that mentality. For once I'd love to see the Skins have a guy out perform his contract.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by irish

Like I mentioned, he only seems to go south once he gets paid. I'm not sure the organization has anything to do with it. The reason Moss cooled it in NE is that NE wins. Winning usually cures all problems. I hesitate to say this about ST because it did look like he was on his way down the good path but the journey had just started when he was killed so its hard to know how it would have turned out. Hall could be an idiot or maybe not. Most of these guys are idiots and I'm not sure he saw his cutting by Oak as a humilitation as I'm sure he believes it had nothing to do with his behavior and everything to do with Oak. All I'm saying is why take the chance with so much money and a questionable guy.

I respect your opinion and thanks for clarifying it. I feel that Hall was in two organizations (Atl and Oak) that were not known for having a good handle on its players. And yes, NE wins, but they also have a strong locker room and good veteran leadership. I don't think Oakland had that, and definitely Atlanta back then didn't have it. I think if Hall had not produced when we got him, then I would not agreed for this re-signing. But he produced, so we should give him a deal. I think given the Redskins attitude towards spending money, I feel that they will not go overboard with Hall. And I hope they are able to keep Rogers too. As I've repeatedly said, the success of both Hall and Rogers is tied to both of them being here in Washington.

Personally, if I were Rogers, I would stay, pad my number next year and hit free agency with the ability to sign for big money for another team. A CB tandem of Rogers and Hall for an entire season would be sick.

[irish]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

I respect your opinion and thanks for clarifying it. I feel that Hall was in two organizations (Atl and Oak) that were not known for having a good handle on its players. And yes, NE wins, but they also have a strong locker room and good veteran leadership. I don't think Oakland had that, and definitely Atlanta back then didn't have it. I think if Hall had not produced when we got him, then I would not agreed for this re-signing. But he produced, so we should give him a deal. I think given the Redskins attitude towards spending money, I feel that they will not go overboard with Hall. And I hope they are able to keep Rogers too. As I've repeatedly said, the success of both Hall and Rogers is tied to both of them being here in Washington.

Personally, if I were Rogers, I would stay, pad my number next year and hit free agency with the ability to sign for big money for another team. A CB tandem of Rogers and Hall for an entire season would be sick.

Hall did perform but only for about a half season and like I mentioned it was in an effort to get a big payday. I'd like to see him perform over a longer period of time before spending big $ on him. Since when do the Redskins not go overboard when spending $? When they want someone they always go overboard. Its the Skins M. O. If Wash is the only place where Hall & Rogers can succeed then its further proof to me that they should not be resigned.

[53Fan]

Between trying to decide if Hall or even Haynesworth are apt to return to their old ways after getting the money, maybe we should sign a shrink or a FBI profiler to the team.

[53Fan]

You make some good points Ruhskins. I wasn't sold on Hall at first, but sometimes under different circumstances people can change.

[GTripp0012]

Hall of course, is only 25, so you could throw out the term "upside" with him, as he has plenty of time to grow.

But I would caution the organization that buys talent for it's future value, as you have quite the history on the guy which suggests that he's a questionable investment. Everyone has a price, but Snyder's been dealing closer to the merchandise revenue (MRP) expectation than how good Hall actually is on the field.

Not that there's anything wrong with that. Any agent worth his salt will float his client's star potential in order to get him paid. But very often, you overpay the talent on the field because you can make a profit off the field, and then your coaches play players not because they are more deserving, but because they feel like they have to let them justify their contract.

And we absolutely have no chance to handle this properly on the coaching end. So Hall is a huge gamble for us because if he doesn't pan out, he's just going to cost us wins for many, many years into the future.

[44ever]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Hall of course, is only 25, so you could throw out the term "upside" with him, as he has plenty of time to grow.

But I would caution the organization that buys talent for it's future value, as you have quite the history on the guy which suggests that he's a questionable investment. Everyone has a price, but Snyder's been dealing closer to the merchandise revenue (MRP) expectation than how good Hall actually is on the field.

Not that there's anything wrong with that. Any agent worth his salt will float his client's star potential in order to get him paid. But very often, you overpay the talent on the field because you can make a profit off the field, and then your coaches play players not because they are more deserving, but because they feel like they have to let them justify their contract.

And we absolutely have no chance to handle this properly on the coaching end. So Hall is a huge gamble for us because if he doesn't pan out, he's just going to cost us wins for many, many years into the future.

Well if that happens then I guess he would make a heck of a $$$ punt returner

[irish]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Hall of course, is only 25, so you could throw out the term "upside" with him, as he has plenty of time to grow.

But I would caution the organization that buys talent for it's future value, as you have quite the history on the guy which suggests that he's a questionable investment. Everyone has a price, but Snyder's been dealing closer to the merchandise revenue (MRP) expectation than how good Hall actually is on the field.

Not that there's anything wrong with that. Any agent worth his salt will float his client's star potential in order to get him paid. But very often, you overpay the talent on the field because you can make a profit off the field, and then your coaches play players not because they are more deserving, but because they feel like they have to let them justify their contract.

And we absolutely have no chance to handle this properly on the coaching end. So Hall is a huge gamble for us because if he doesn't pan out, he's just going to cost us wins for many, many years into the future.

I agree. I'm not sure the risk is worth the reward.