Life After People (History Channel)

[MTK]

How does anyone believe there is an after life? What are you basing this on exactly? Sorry but that sounds very delusional to me.

I don't believe either way, because I honestly don't know. I haven't been convinced beyond a reasonable doubt either way.

I'm just amazed when people can firmly say yes there is an after life, or no there isn't. How can anyone be 100% sure??

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

How does anyone believe there is an after life? What are you basing this on exactly? Sorry but that sounds very delusional to me.

I don't believe either way, because I honestly don't know. I haven't been convinced beyond a reasonable doubt either way.

I'm just amazed when people can firmly say yes there is an after life, or no there isn't. How can anyone be 100% sure??

You can't be. I didn't say "I was convinced", I said "I / we believe". Just like you don't believe either way.
I also take the stand that it is better to believe (In God) and have the possibility of eternal life, then to not and take my chances. Why take the road that couldn't possibly lead you anywhere?

To ask, what are you basing this on exactly. You seriously don't know? It's the best selling book of all time.

If you are waiting to be "convinced beyond a reasonable doubt" on anything, you will have a long wait my friend. Some things are by faith, and faith alone. Even if I am wrong, tell me, what is the harm in it? But if you are wrong, do you want to know the harm in it?

[MTK]

Originally Posted by jsarno

You can't be. I didn't say "I was convinced", I said "I / we believe". Just like you don't believe either way.
I also take the stand that it is better to believe (In God) and have the possibility of eternal life, then to not and take my chances. Why take the road that couldn't possibly lead you anywhere?

To ask, what are you basing this on exactly. You seriously don't know? It's the best selling book of all time.

If you are waiting to be "convinced beyond a reasonable doubt" on anything, you will have a long wait my friend. Some things are by faith, and faith alone. Even if I am wrong, tell me, what is the harm in it? But if you are wrong, do you want to know the harm in it?

Do you believe everything you read?

Faith can be a dangerous thing.

I don't see any harm in not being sure what to believe when it comes to God. I have a hard time believing that if he does indeed exist, he would think any less of someone questioning his existence since there is no undeniable proof of his existence in the first place.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Do you believe everything you read?

Sarcasm as a rebuttle???

Faith can be a dangerous thing.

I'm not disagreeing, but why do you think so?

I don't see any harm in not being sure what to believe when it comes to God. I have a hard time believing that if he does indeed exist, he would think any less of someone questioning his existence since there is no undeniable proof of his existence in the first place.

There is nothing that says you shouldn't "question" in the bible. In fact, it encourages it to better your faith. I've personally been toying with the notion that we all go to heaven and the bible is used as a guideline to keep us on the straight and narrow. View your relationship with your kids as that of one with you as the child and God as your father...when you do that, how can you send your children to eternal damnation? But you try to set guidelines for your kids to follow by to be better people. Hell, we even lie to our kids about Santa Claus etc because of how we feel it will better them. So if we can do that, how come God can't give us a guideline / handbook to try to live by?
You also need to keep in mind, while we as a species are intelligent, we are not all knowing. To me, undeniable proof of His existance is the fact that we are here. The body is amazingly complex, beyond comprehension even. No soul / existance of a life has ever been found in a body, yet we know it to be there. That's just a human, what about the billions of other organisms on this planet, or the solar system, or beyond?
I think you might mistake anyone that speaks about God / religion as trying to push their views, and some do, I am not though. You can believe what you want. I know there is absolutely nothing I can say that will change your mind, or several others on this site. I am merely stating my belief and you can take it or leave it. It's a pleasure to have conversation sometimes, and the questions posed to each other can and do bring good discussion.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by jsarno

Sarcasm as a rebuttle???



I'm not disagreeing, but why do you think so?



There is nothing that says you shouldn't "question" in the bible. In fact, it encourages it to better your faith. I've personally been toying with the notion that we all go to heaven and the bible is used as a guideline to keep us on the straight and narrow. View your relationship with your kids as that of one with you as the child and God as your father...when you do that, how can you send your children to eternal damnation? But you try to set guidelines for your kids to follow by to be better people. Hell, we even lie to our kids about Santa Claus etc because of how we feel it will better them. So if we can do that, how come God can't give us a guideline / handbook to try to live by?
You also need to keep in mind, while we as a species are intelligent, we are not all knowing. To me, undeniable proof of His existance is the fact that we are here. The body is amazingly complex, beyond comprehension even. No soul / existance of a life has ever been found in a body, yet we know it to be there. That's just a human, what about the billions of other organisms on this planet, or the solar system, or beyond?
I think you might mistake anyone that speaks about God / religion as trying to push their views, and some do, I am not though. You can believe what you want. I know there is absolutely nothing I can say that will change your mind, or several others on this site. I am merely stating my belief and you can take it or leave it. It's a pleasure to have conversation sometimes, and the questions posed to each other can and do bring good discussion.

-No sarcasm it was a genuine question.

-Wars are waged over faith. Faith to any extreme is dangerous.

-I'm just stating my view as well, I'm not trying to be right or wrong. Just looking for good discussion as well.

[Trample the Elderly]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

-No sarcasm it was a genuine question.

-Wars are waged over faith. Faith to any extreme is dangerous.

-I'm just stating my view as well, I'm not trying to be right or wrong. Just looking for good discussion as well.

Most wars are fought over money or land. Faith is just a tool for the leaders to manipulate the populace to fight.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

-No sarcasm it was a genuine question.

Good to know.

-Wars are waged over faith. Faith to any extreme is dangerous.

Respectfully disagree sir. The bible, for instance, is clear about not killing, so wars waged over "alleged faith" is human based, not faith based. God, nor Jesus has ever told us humans to kill in his name. Those that do it, are not following His path. A lot of people use this as an excuse to not look at the bible (not saying you are, just point out it's a common argument) but in actuality wars are waged due to PEOPLE not getting along with other PEOPLE. I can go to war with the USA and blame the Warpath for it...that doesn't make it so.

-I'm just stating my view as well, I'm not trying to be right or wrong. Just looking for good discussion as well.

Sounds good. So far so good. Hope this doesn't take a bad turn. Religion is always touchy.

[Trample the Elderly]

Originally Posted by jsarno

Good to know.



Respectfully disagree sir. The bible, for instance, is clear about not killing, so wars waged over "alleged faith" is human based, not faith based. God, nor Jesus has ever told us humans to kill in his name. Those that do it, are not following His path. A lot of people use this as an excuse to not look at the bible (not saying you are, just point out it's a common argument) but in actuality wars are waged due to PEOPLE not getting along with other PEOPLE. I can go to war with the USA and blame the Warpath for it...that doesn't make it so.



Sounds good. So far so good. Hope this doesn't take a bad turn. Religion is always touchy.

Sorry buddy but the old Testament God and the New Testament God are like night and day, just ask a Jew. The Old Testament God told Joshua to go into Canaan and kill every last person including the women and children. To not kill is a bad King James translation. The original is Thou shall not murder. If killing was a sin then God would be a sinner. He killed people in the Bible himself.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

How does anyone believe there is an after life? What are you basing this on exactly? Sorry but that sounds very delusional to me.

I don't believe either way, because I honestly don't know. I haven't been convinced beyond a reasonable doubt either way.

I'm just amazed when people can firmly say yes there is an after life, or no there isn't. How can anyone be 100% sure??

Not trying to be flip, but honestly the only way is Faith in something other than that which can be seen.

Christianity, for example, exists ONLY if Christ was raised from the dead. Paul himself made the point that Saden often makes, which is, that if Christ was merely a man, and the resurrection a hoax, then Christians are indeed the most pitiful of men. This is the very thing Saden often argues, interesting that the Bible agrees with him. Of course, the next part is that Christ did indeed raise up, and witnesses attested to that fact. Now at this point in history, Every person is given the self awareness to hear this argument and make the choice to believe through faith or not.

Every belief in an afterlife hinges primarily on the faith of something unseen, and by definition untestable (except in FRINGE) and unverifiable to the modern man.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Not trying to be flip, but honestly the only way is Faith in something other than that which can be seen.

Christianity, for example, exists ONLY if Christ was raised from the dead. Paul himself made the point that Saden often makes, which is, that if Christ was merely a man, and the resurrection a hoax, then Christians are indeed the most pitiful of men. This is the very thing Saden often argues, interesting that the Bible agrees with him. Of course, the next part is that Christ did indeed raise up, and witnesses attested to that fact. Now at this point in history, Every person is given the self awareness to hear this argument and make the choice to believe through faith or not.

Every belief in an afterlife hinges primarily on the faith of something unseen, and by definition untestable (except in FRINGE) and unverifiable to the modern man.

Very true. Which again begs the argument, why believe in something that can't possibly bring you any good.

I would argue that if Christ's resurrection was indeed a hoax, we are not pitiful, but lived a good life and we are all worm food anyway so it won't matter.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

How does anyone believe there is an after life? What are you basing this on exactly? Sorry but that sounds very delusional to me.

I don't believe either way, because I honestly don't know. I haven't been convinced beyond a reasonable doubt either way.

I'm just amazed when people can firmly say yes there is an after life, or no there isn't. How can anyone be 100% sure??

This is a post I made a couple of years ago in the Jesus Camp thread:

http://www.thewarpath.net/parking-lo...tml#post308204

It pretty much summarizes the basis of my belief. There was a song by Joan somebody that had a great line: "Would you want to see God if it meant you had to believe in Jesus and alll the Saints?". For me, I took (take) a leap of faith based on my acceptance of/ and experience with God. In accepting the existence of the great "I am", I also accept "with a firm and certain hope" in the existence of some form of an afterlife (the quoted language is from the episcopal prayerbook - I think I have the quote right). Please note, my belief in God is not predicated on the existence of this non-physical existence, but rather on my other experiencse as described in the cited post.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

How does anyone believe there is an after life? What are you basing this on exactly? Sorry but that sounds very delusional to me.

I don't believe either way, because I honestly don't know. I haven't been convinced beyond a reasonable doubt either way.

I'm just amazed when people can firmly say yes there is an after life, or no there isn't. How can anyone be 100% sure??

I believe that the term "afterlife" is misleading, because I think it implies either the existence of the traditional judeo-christian heaven/purgatory/hell, or an eastern philosophy-based state of out of bodyness.

But I think the best evidence for the existence of an afterlife is the obvious absence of anything that could be considered a non-afterlife. I think we could produce a wide range of possibilities for what happens to a body/mind/soul/consciousness after the incredibly observational concept of "death", but simply by even describing the possibility of death, I think we've assumed that there is something after it.

Someone who doesn't believe in any afterlife would have to define death itself as, "the point at which one ceases to." As you can see, this isn't even a complete sentence. But to go any further, it would be to presume the existence of an afterlife in some way, shape or form. Our very basic logical structure implies that an afterlife must be, for life goes on after death.

What the after-life entails is an entirely different animal. Consciousness or not. Ability to perceive, or not. Ability to think, or not. Any of those six concepts would be indicative of an afterlife, but I can not even fathom what that would mean.