Will Jason Campbell return?

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Paintrain, what age and draft position is the player you speak of?

He was 26 at the time and is a QB. EDIT-And is not Eli Manning.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Monksdown

Someone with deceptively poor statistics at the beginning of their career that turned out to be a stud???

Eli Manning? If you want to call him a stud.

[Monksdown]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Eli Manning? If you want to call him a stud.

I don't really want to. But damn, that ring is shiny.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Monksdown

I don't really want to. But damn, that ring is shiny.

I don't actually know that it's Manning, but that's who I thought of when I saw Paintrain's numbers.

I don't know if I like a E. Manning example because he's probably not as good a QB as Campbell, just playing the odds. His play was a big reason why the Giants won the SB two years ago. But whose to say that if our defense could have gotten Jason into the playoffs at 10-6 by not imploding down the stretch, and staying in the top quadrant of defenses, he wouldn't have surprised everyone and led Zorn to a super bowl in his first year as HC?

I mean, yeah, pie in the sky scenario. But no less realistic than calling a Giants championship in 2007 or a Cardinals championship this year (which didn't happen, but you know, no fault to the QB position).

[DBUCHANON101]

its the league we play in.. its all on the QB

the pats D slowed the greatest show on turf. Adam V kicked the winning fg and all the cred goes to Brady.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by DBUCHANON101

its the league we play in.. its all on the QB

the pats D slowed the greatest show on turf. Adam V kicked the winning fg and all the cred goes to Brady.

That's the problem with typical fans, they place all the blame on the QB. That ain't how football works. True, a Brady/Manning type can take over a game, but he still needs protection and receivers who can make plays. Manning struggled early last year when his OL struggled, Brady struggled in the SB against the Giants becuase his OL was getting handled.

Campbell struggled in the 2nd half last year because of poor OL play and some very good D's we faced, not becuase he just magically started to suck. He's gotten better every year and his QB rating shows that.

I can't wait until mid-season to call you guys out, of course just like early last season all the JC haters came out after the Giants game and then disappeared until he struggled later in the season.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

That's the problem with typical fans, they place all the blame on the QB. That ain't how football works. True, a Brady/Manning type can take over a game, but he still needs protection and receivers who can make plays. Manning struggled early last year when his OL struggled, Brady struggled in the SB against the Giants becuase his OL was getting handled.

Campbell struggled in the 2nd half last year because of poor OL play and some very good D's we faced, not becuase he just magically started to suck. He's gotten better every year and his QB rating shows that.

I can't wait until mid-season to call you guys out, of course just like early last season all the JC haters came out after the Giants game and then disappeared until he struggled later in the season.

Ain't that the truth. Kinda like Cowgirl fans who talk a lot of crap before the season, and then once we kick their ass, they disappear.

[Monksdown]

Don't misunderstand our angle. I think we all want him to do well. We just don't feel based on the numbers we have on him, and on our limited ability to analyze his skills, that he's going to take a huge step forward this year.

That is honestly how i feel. And i can back it up with 36 starts, just over 2 years of hard numbers. Granted, i probably put too much stock in cold hard touchdowns.

The argument that he's finally able to be in the same system 2 years in a row does hold some water. But i can't quantify that potential success with any hard numbers. You could bring up the 'Matt Hasselback developed at this pace argument'. But that argument sucks too, there are too many variables for an apple to apple comparison.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Monksdown

Don't misunderstand our angle. I think we all want him to do well. We just don't feel based on the numbers we have on him, and on our limited ability to analyze his skills, that he's going to take a huge step forward this year.

What if I told you that he already took that huge step forward last year (in my opinion), sometime between weeks 2-5, or possibly weeks 11-13, but that it was masked by the fact that every one else on offense was so terrible.

Then, as my logic follows, if the offense around Campbell is just a little less horriffic, he should pick up right where he left off, at a pro bowl level.

Here's a tip, if you have to point to a single (one) season as evidence that a player can't get it done, you're likely seeing too many other variables to know. You see his improvements as "super-slow", in the data, but the rest of us just see them as "there," and need more information to see if a breakout is coming/has already come.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by DBUCHANON101

its the league we play in.. its all on the QB

the pats D slowed the greatest show on turf. Adam V kicked the winning fg and all the cred goes to Brady.

Do you consider Snyder a good businessman? Why would a good businessman go out and spend 100 million dollars, 41 million guarenteed, on a player who doesn't matter because he's not a Quarterback. Seems like the gaffe of the century and you should be outraged!

[53Fan]

Is their anyone on this board who honestly believes that if Peyton, Tom, or Ben changed systems as much as the Redskins have in the last 4-5 years, it wouldn't affect their play? Or more to the point, the teams play? Doe's anyone really believe they would win as much if they changed offensive systems every year? Let's not forget the QB is not the only one who has to learn a new system. The receiver we just signed, Roydell or whatever his name is, is pretty lost right now and he's not a rookie. He's just new to this system. JC has frustrated the hell out of me at times, but I'm waiting to pass judgement on him after he's been given a chance to completely learn and play in a system for more than 1 year. To say changing systems is just an excuse is pure BS and shows a lack of football related knowledge IMO. If Jason doesn't progress this year or continues to make the same mistakes, then he needs to go. But to completely dismiss constantly changing offensive systems as a variable in a QB's progression or for a teams lack of offensive output is crazy.

[Monksdown]

Originally Posted by 53Fan

Is their anyone on this board who honestly believes that if Peyton, Tom, or Ben changed systems as much as the Redskins have in the last 4-5 years, it wouldn't affect their play? Or more to the point, the teams play? Doe's anyone really believe they would win as much if they changed offensive systems every year? Let's not forget the QB is not the only one who has to learn a new system. The receiver we just signed, Roydell or whatever his name is, is pretty lost right now and he's not a rookie. He's just new to this system. JC has frustrated the hell out of me at times, but I'm waiting to pass judgement on him after he's been given a chance to completely learn and play in a system for more than 1 year. To say changing systems is just an excuse is pure BS and shows a lack of football related knowledge IMO. If Jason doesn't progress this year or continues to make the same mistakes, then he needs to go. But to completely dismiss constantly changing offensive systems as a variable in a QB's progression or for a teams lack of offensive output is crazy.

It's not being completely dismissive. And it is a variable in a QB's development. Just not alone a very good excuse for not leaping forward. Your final analysis is accurate though...should he not perform, goodbye.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by Monksdown

It's not being completely dismissive. And it is a variable in a QB's development. Just not alone a very good excuse for not leaping forward. Your final analysis is accurate though...should he not perform, goodbye.

I guess this is the year we find out. Of course if he does well, the credit will be given to the receivers and/or the o-line for stepping up, which is fine. Because, of course, it's not all on the QB.

[CRedskinsRule]

Uh oh, Tripps getting arrogant again

[GTripp0012]

I think you could make an argument right now that the two best QBs in football (or two of the three best if you aren't worried about Peyton's age) are Brees and Rivers. So, as crazy as the decision to draft Rivers was, given the lack of help Brees had over the first three years of his career (but he had a pro bowl RB!), I actually agree with their decision to let him walk.