Poll: Pick a knucklehead

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

How about this guy?

Donte Stallworth of Cleveland Browns reaches financial agreement with family of victim Mario Reyes - ESPN

Marshall is probably the best of the three, but he'd also cost the most. And we just invested, fairly heavily, on young receivers. We need to get away from the mentality of giving up on young players just to trade more picks to replace those players. We don't know that Thomas and Kelly will be successful for us, but we'll never find out if we don't give them a chance.

Plax, at least, should cost less. But I wouldn't take him either for the same reasons listed above.

Gun to my head, I'll pick up Vick (and take my chances with PETA, Betty White, and Bob Barker), hope he regains some value and use him as trade bait next off-season.

I'm glad the family is being financially taken care of, but only 30 days in jail?? You can get drunk and run a guy over and only spend a month in jail? Wow.

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by GMScud

I'm glad the family is being financially taken care of, but only 30 days in jail?? You can get drunk and run a guy over and only spend a month in jail? Wow.

I won't start a thread over the double standard of the lack of outcry for Stallworth to be banned for life from football when he took a human's life vs. the Vick outcry, but yeah I was stunned to see 30 days in jail, plus 2 years house arrest (in which he can still play football, of course) and probation.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

I won't start a thread over the double standard of the lack of outcry for Stallworth to be banned for life from football when he took a human's life vs. the Vick outcry, but yeah I was stunned to see 30 days in jail, plus 2 years house arrest (in which he can still play football, of course) and probation.

Seriously. Kill some dogs, get 2 years in federal prison. Kill a man, get 30 days in the state lockup. That's a joke.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Seriously. Kill some dogs, get 2 years in federal prison. Kill a man, get 30 days in the state lockup. That's a joke.

I think the biggest difference, is the immediate remorse. Remember, Vick was basically dragged kicking and screaming into court, denying and delaying as long as possible. Seems to me like Stallworth "man upped" and accepted responsibility. In the courts eyes that often times makes a huge difference in sentencing.

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Seriously. Kill some dogs, get 2 years in federal prison. Kill a man, get 30 days in the state lockup. That's a joke.

It was acknowleged that the Vick situation was a witchunt. If he wasn't a famous person he probably wouldn't have served a day.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Pocket$ $traight

It was acknowleged that the Vick situation was a witchunt. If he wasn't a famous person he probably wouldn't have served a day.

What? People go to to prison for dogfighting, famous or not.

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

What? People go to to prison for dogfighting, famous or not.

I vividly remember experts talking on sports radio about how the severity of Vick's sentence was unusual, especially given his lack of prior convictions.

Most people don't have PETA outside their courthouse when they show up for trial.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Pocket$ $traight

I vividly remember experts talking on sports radio about how the severity of Vick's sentence was unusual, especially given his lack of prior convictions.

Most people don't have PETA outside their courthouse when they show up for trial.

The "experts" on whatever show you were listening to didn't know WTF they were talking about. Vick's sentence was mid-range of the sentencing guidelines. Considering he was the leader of a dogfighting organization, he probably got off with a light sentence.

In VA Dogfighting is a Class 6 Felony with a max sentence of 5 years and $ 2,500 fine.

Dogfighting Laws - washingtonpost.com

Ranking of State Dogfighting Laws | The Humane Society of the United States

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

I won't start a thread over the double standard of the lack of outcry for Stallworth to be banned for life from football when he took a human's life vs. the Vick outcry, but yeah I was stunned to see 30 days in jail, plus 2 years house arrest (in which he can still play football, of course) and probation.

Without completely hijacking the thread, what Stallworth did was unintentional. When the accident happened he stopped, took full responsibility and cooperated with police. Goodell hasn't metted out any punishment yet, but I would like to see some sort of suspension for a significant time. 30 days in jail for DUI manslaughter sounds like a very light sentence.

What Vick did was completely intentional, cold-hearted and sick and happened over a period of years. He lied to the Falcons and NFL about it. It's not like Vick got drunk and ran into a dog pound accidently.

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

Without completely hijacking the thread, what Stallworth did was unintentional. When the accident happened he stopped, took full responsibility and cooperated with police. Goodell hasn't metted out any punishment yet, but I would like to see some sort of suspension for a significant time. 30 days in jail for DUI manslaughter sounds like a very light sentence.

What Vick did was completely intentional, cold-hearted and sick and happened over a period of years. He lied to the Falcons and NFL about it. It's not like Vick got drunk and ran into a dog pound accidently.

Intent or no intent, IMO people>animals. I am a dog owner and pet lover but the comparison is absurd.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

Intent or no intent, IMO people>animals. I am a dog owner and pet lover but the comparison is absurd.

Agreed 100% people > animals. If there is any outrage it should be focused on the lack of sentence in FL for the DUI manslaughter, rather than Vick's 23 months. If someone killed a loved one of mine in a DUI I'd sure expect a sentence tougher than 30 days.

The NFL punishment is a separate issue. Should Stallworth be banned from the NFL for lack of judgement on one night that resulted in an accidental death. He fully cooperated with the police, accepted responsibility, and reached an out-of-court financial settlement with the family. What damage to the NFL would occur if he was only suspended for a year and allowed to return. I don't think any.

Should the NFL ban Vick for the damage he did to the league and for willfully carrying on this venture for many years in direct violation of his NFL contract, then lying to his team and the NFL about it? I believe reinstating Vick would cause a PR backlash and result in some financial loss of ad revenue or corporate sponsorships. In the grand scheme of things the financial impact would probably be minor to the NFL. The willful disregard for the NFL's rules and policies needs to be considered as well. The NFL is a business entity, and as such it needs at look at the damage each incident caused to its business and how the disciplinary actions to each player effect its future business. If you look at the result of each players actions only to determine the correct punishment by the NFL, rather than the surrounding circumstances it would be a mistake.

On a moral scale; have you ever driven after a few beers/drinks? I hate to admit it, but I have made that mistake in the past. I thank God I didn't hurt anyone, but it's possible I could have. Have you ever trained dogs for dog-fighting, attended many dog-fights and watch them bite and tear each other apart, have you killed dogs who didn't "perform well" by electrocution, slamming them on the ground, drowing etc. I'm sure you haven't. Could you do those things? I'm sure you couldn't. The heartlessness and inhumanity in what Vick did is sickening to most people. What Stallworth did is an accident that could've happened to many people.

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

Agreed 100% people > animals. If there is any outrage it should be focused on the lack of sentence in FL for the DUI manslaughter, rather than Vick's 23 months. If someone killed a loved one of mine in a DUI I'd sure expect a sentence tougher than 30 days.

The NFL punishment is a separate issue. Should Stallworth be banned from the NFL for lack of judgement on one night that resulted in an accidental death. He fully cooperated with the police, accepted responsibility, and reached an out-of-court financial settlement with the family. What damage to the NFL would occur if he was only suspended for a year and allowed to return. I don't think any.

Should the NFL ban Vick for the damage he did to the league and for willfully carrying on this venture for many years in direct violation of his NFL contract, then lying to his team and the NFL about it? I believe reinstating Vick would cause a PR backlash and result in some financial loss of ad revenue or corporate sponsorships. In the grand scheme of things the financial impact would probably be minor to the NFL. The willful disregard for the NFL's rules and policies needs to be considered as well. The NFL is a business entity, and as such it needs at look at the damage each incident caused to its business and how the disciplinary actions to each player effect its future business. If you look at the result of each players actions only to determine the correct punishment by the NFL, rather than the surrounding circumstances it would be a mistake.

On a moral scale; have you ever driven after a few beers/drinks? I hate to admit it, but I have made that mistake in the past. I thank God I didn't hurt anyone, but it's possible I could have. Have you ever trained dogs for dog-fighting, attended many dog-fights and watch them bite and tear each other apart, have you killed dogs who didn't "perform well" by electrocution, slamming them on the ground, drowing etc. I'm sure you haven't. Could you do those things? I'm sure you couldn't. The heartlessness and inhumanity in what Vick did is sickening to most people. What Stallworth did is an accident that could've happened to many people.

I guess I see it as both of them used poor judgment. Both knew what they were doing was wrong when they did it. Both made a conscious choice that drove (no pun intended) their actions. Both faced consequences and are subject to punishment thru the legal system. Both are killers. One will get a virtual pass among fans because 'it could/has happened to all of us' even though he killed another human. I just don't really get that I guess.

[redskinsgirl]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

I guess I see it as both of them used poor judgment. Both knew what they were doing was wrong when they did it. Both made a conscious choice that drove (no pun intended) their actions. Both faced consequences and are subject to punishment thru the legal system. Both are killers. One will get a virtual pass among fans because 'it could/has happened to all of us' even though he killed another human. I just don't really get that I guess.

I agree I don't get that logic either.

[tryfuhl]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

Intent or no intent, IMO people>animals. I am a dog owner and pet lover but the comparison is absurd.

What if it was a dog that ran out in front of the car?

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by tryfuhl

What if it was a dog that ran out in front of the car?

Then you feel bad and keep on driving.