Eight Long Years: Where Is Osama Bin Laden?

budw38 · 10-07-2009, 06:34 PM

Trample i agree with most of your points . Of course we are not fighting an Army in Afganistan < like we did in WW2 > . We could destroy the Taliban/ al qaeda if we destroyed the country , massive bombing , which would result in mass civilian deaths . I think that is the main reason they have not been put out of commision . We are not at war with a country , but a movement < ideology > , where the enemy is global . Not disputing what you said . I guess I look at the Oil part this way , if we wanted to , we could have taken it from Kuwait and Iraq in 91 if . Isreal , I'm just making a point , if we had stopped supporting Isreal ... say in 1972 , the Arab nations that make up OPEC would have no reason to hate us , thus making them willing to trade /sell oil at lower levels . I would almost be in favor of hitting the middle east with nukes like we did Japan , but I would rather not . As far as Nat. Gas , we have plenty , and I think Russia supplies Europe Nat. Gas , as Russia has a vast suppy . If you and some of the others are correct , Brazil better become our friends or they might be at war with us next ...http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/19/wo...braziloil.html as they have ... maybe larger oil fields than Saudia Arabia Petrobras' Tupi Oil Field May Hold 8 Billion Barrels (Update6) - Bloomberg.com

djnemo65 · 10-07-2009, 08:04 PM

Afghanistan has no significant oil, or any natural resources other than smack, and our presence over there is not related to procuring oil or anything else. Had they not attacked us on 9/11 we would not have invaded (as opposed to Iraq, the plans for the occupation of which go back to the Clinton administration). Although FRPLG is partly right when he says that we made a commitment to staying there upon the firing of the first shot. That is not necessarily true, but if we are to see the mission through to its conclusion - which at this point I understand to be the emergence of a stable functioning democracy - it will take several years (decades even) and several hundred thousand more troops. Indeed, current counterinsurgency theory suggests that 1 soldier is needed for every 50 civilians in order to successfully pacify a population, which would put our troop requirement there at well north of 500 thousand. Given that the political will doesn’t exist for that kind of commitment, a much more protracted, and probably ineffective American presence there is likely.

But let's talk about what this war is really about. It's certainly not about oil. We'd get about as much oil invading the Bahamas, and I don't buy the leftist conspiracy theories that the war is about protecting pipelines either. That makes no sense. You don't spend billions and billions in resources to preserve what amounts to a drop in the bucket of the global oil supply. But it's not about Bin Laden either, who as 12th pointed out, probably isn't even in the country any more, and at this point is nothing more than a figurehead within Al Qaeda.

It's about that nuclear armed behemoth to the south, whose crippled government is hanging by a thread with an internal insurgency miles from the capital and ready to step on its throat. Were Afghanistan to destabilize, or were its radical Islamist forces left without anyone to fight, they would be sure to further destabilize Pakistan in turn. We can't have this. Moreover, by building a permanent American military presence over there, as we are currently doing, we give ourselves access to Pakistan should things take a turn for the worse.

I have to believe everything else is peripheral at this point. So in answer to the question, who cares. Killing Obama would be a huge story in America's dumbed down sound bite culture, but it wouldn't amount to a damn thing.

saden1 · 10-07-2009, 08:23 PM

The shortest distance between two points is a straight line and having control of those lines. Don't be fooled, Afghanistan is a major player in oil and gas transport.

Trample the Elderly · 10-07-2009, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saden1

The shortest distance between two points is a straight line and having control of those lines. Don't be fooled, Afghanistan is a major player in oil and gas transport.

Thank you Saden. You may be arrogant but at least you're not stupid.

saden1 · 10-07-2009, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trample the Elderly

Thank you Saden. You may be arrogant but at least you're not stupid.

Nah, I just don't believe in humility especially when it isn't aligned with my self-interest.

budw38 · 10-07-2009, 08:42 PM

Nice post DJ65 . Not sure about dumbed down culture . We all know that just killing one man is not the end of a war /movement or jihad . Truth is Bin laden is a recuiter , hero and god to many in the middle east , I do hope we kill him , and wouldn't lose sleep in we took Chavez , Akmandingleberryzahd < Iran > out in the middle of the night .

budw38 · 10-08-2009, 09:24 AM

I have thought about the living conditions bin-laden and his band of goons are living under . However , I would love to bring his ass back to the good ol USA and show all of his worshippers that he is not god like . Great thread , nice not to see blaming and bickering .

SmootSmack · 10-09-2009, 07:32 AM

Isn't Bin Laden a Whitney fan? He must be pissed he can't get her new album out in the caves

CRedskinsRule · 10-09-2009, 07:41 AM

And he probably doesn't get to see her videos either cuz we all know that Beyonce has the best videos of all time.

edit:

Smoot, I thought you said Beyonce

12thMan · 10-09-2009, 07:56 AM

And the fun begins

10-07-2009, 06:34 PM	#1
budw38 Playmaker Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Northern,Va. Posts: 2,706	Re: Eight Long Years: Where Is Osama Bin Laden? Trample i agree with most of your points . Of course we are not fighting an Army in Afganistan < like we did in WW2 > . We could destroy the Taliban/ al qaeda if we destroyed the country , massive bombing , which would result in mass civilian deaths . I think that is the main reason they have not been put out of commision . We are not at war with a country , but a movement < ideology > , where the enemy is global . Not disputing what you said . I guess I look at the Oil part this way , if we wanted to , we could have taken it from Kuwait and Iraq in 91 if . Isreal , I'm just making a point , if we had stopped supporting Isreal ... say in 1972 , the Arab nations that make up OPEC would have no reason to hate us , thus making them willing to trade /sell oil at lower levels . I would almost be in favor of hitting the middle east with nukes like we did Japan , but I would rather not . As far as Nat. Gas , we have plenty , and I think Russia supplies Europe Nat. Gas , as Russia has a vast suppy . If you and some of the others are correct , Brazil better become our friends or they might be at war with us next ...http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/19/wo...braziloil.html as they have ... maybe larger oil fields than Saudia Arabia Petrobras' Tupi Oil Field May Hold 8 Billion Barrels (Update6) - Bloomberg.com

10-07-2009, 08:04 PM	#2
djnemo65 Playmaker Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,836	Re: Eight Long Years: Where Is Osama Bin Laden? Afghanistan has no significant oil, or any natural resources other than smack, and our presence over there is not related to procuring oil or anything else. Had they not attacked us on 9/11 we would not have invaded (as opposed to Iraq, the plans for the occupation of which go back to the Clinton administration). Although FRPLG is partly right when he says that we made a commitment to staying there upon the firing of the first shot. That is not necessarily true, but if we are to see the mission through to its conclusion - which at this point I understand to be the emergence of a stable functioning democracy - it will take several years (decades even) and several hundred thousand more troops. Indeed, current counterinsurgency theory suggests that 1 soldier is needed for every 50 civilians in order to successfully pacify a population, which would put our troop requirement there at well north of 500 thousand. Given that the political will doesn’t exist for that kind of commitment, a much more protracted, and probably ineffective American presence there is likely. But let's talk about what this war is really about. It's certainly not about oil. We'd get about as much oil invading the Bahamas, and I don't buy the leftist conspiracy theories that the war is about protecting pipelines either. That makes no sense. You don't spend billions and billions in resources to preserve what amounts to a drop in the bucket of the global oil supply. But it's not about Bin Laden either, who as 12th pointed out, probably isn't even in the country any more, and at this point is nothing more than a figurehead within Al Qaeda. It's about that nuclear armed behemoth to the south, whose crippled government is hanging by a thread with an internal insurgency miles from the capital and ready to step on its throat. Were Afghanistan to destabilize, or were its radical Islamist forces left without anyone to fight, they would be sure to further destabilize Pakistan in turn. We can't have this. Moreover, by building a permanent American military presence over there, as we are currently doing, we give ourselves access to Pakistan should things take a turn for the worse. I have to believe everything else is peripheral at this point. So in answer to the question, who cares. Killing Obama would be a huge story in America's dumbed down sound bite culture, but it wouldn't amount to a damn thing.

10-07-2009, 08:23 PM	#3
saden1 MVP Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Seattle Age: 47 Posts: 10,069	Re: Eight Long Years: Where Is Osama Bin Laden? The shortest distance between two points is a straight line and having control of those lines. Don't be fooled, Afghanistan is a major player in oil and gas transport. __________________ "The Redskins have always suffered from chronic organizational deformities under Snyder." -Jenkins

10-07-2009, 08:42 PM	#6
budw38 Playmaker Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Northern,Va. Posts: 2,706	Re: Eight Long Years: Where Is Osama Bin Laden? Nice post DJ65 . Not sure about dumbed down culture . We all know that just killing one man is not the end of a war /movement or jihad . Truth is Bin laden is a recuiter , hero and god to many in the middle east , I do hope we kill him , and wouldn't lose sleep in we took Chavez , Akmandingleberryzahd < Iran > out in the middle of the night .

10-08-2009, 09:24 AM	#7
budw38 Playmaker Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Northern,Va. Posts: 2,706	Re: Eight Long Years: Where Is Osama Bin Laden? I have thought about the living conditions bin-laden and his band of goons are living under . However , I would love to bring his ass back to the good ol USA and show all of his worshippers that he is not god like . Great thread , nice not to see blaming and bickering .

10-09-2009, 07:32 AM	#8
SmootSmack Uncle Phil Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 45,256	Re: Eight Long Years: Where Is Osama Bin Laden? Isn't Bin Laden a Whitney fan? He must be pissed he can't get her new album out in the caves __________________ You're So Vain...You Probably Think This Sig Is About You

10-09-2009, 07:41 AM	#9
CRedskinsRule Living Legend Join Date: Aug 2008 Age: 59 Posts: 21,745	Re: Eight Long Years: Where Is Osama Bin Laden? And he probably doesn't get to see her videos either cuz we all know that Beyonce has the best videos of all time. edit: Smoot, I thought you said Beyonce Last edited by CRedskinsRule; 10-09-2009 at 09:43 AM.

10-09-2009, 07:56 AM	#10
12thMan MVP Join Date: May 2005 Location: washington, D.C. Posts: 11,460	Re: Eight Long Years: Where Is Osama Bin Laden? And the fun begins

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Eight Long Years: Where Is Osama Bin Laden?

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