Redskins Sign Grossman

[Audi]

Originally Posted by SirClintonPortis

And Drew Brees was also a second rounder. Draft position does not tell the individual player's skill abilities, it just represents how people viewed their likeliness to fail. Good 2nd round QBs probably come around the QB draft class is deep.

Drew Brees was taken #32. Now is he as a second round quarterback the rule or the exception? In the last fifteen years, the only second round quarterbacks to amount to anything close to being a successful starter are Jake Plummer and Drew Brees. And Jake Plummer was a seasoned veteran by the time he started being respectable.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by Audi

Drew Brees was taken #32. Now is he as a second round quarterback the rule or the exception? In the last fifteen years, the only second round quarterbacks to amount to anything close to being a successful starter are Jake Plummer and Drew Brees. And Jake Plummer was a seasoned veteran by the time he started being respectable.

And the Chargers dumped him and went after a first round QB, and well that worked out fine...but not SB fine. Also a 6th rounder by the name of Tom Brady also has done a few things here and there.

Look we get it, first round QBs typically do a good job, I just don't think one is right for the Redskins right now.

[Audi]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

And the Chargers dumped him and went after a first round QB, and well that worked out fine...but not SB fine. Also a 6th rounder by the name of Tom Brady also has done a few things here and there.

Look we get it, first round QBs typically do a good job, I just don't think one is right for the Redskins right now.

And how good was Tom Brady's offensive line? Check out how many times he was sacked in 2001.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by Audi

And how good was Tom Brady's offensive line? Check out how many times he was sacked in 2001.

18 times, which was third for fewest sacks allowed. May you meant 2002...oh wait, they were in the top 10 of fewest sacks allowed.

Yes but you're diverting from your fanatical argument about first round QBs. Hell, wasn't Campbell a first round QB and now you're trying to get rid of him for another first round QB?

Again, I get what you are trying to say, I'm just not as fanatical about drafting a LT as you are about drafting a QB. I just think it makes sense given the success of a few teams that have been in similar situation as we have.

[Audi]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

Yes but you're diverting from your fanatical argument about first round QBs. Hell, wasn't Campbell a first round QB and now you're trying to get rid of him for another first round QB?

Again, I get what you are trying to say, I'm just not as fanatical about drafting a LT as you are about drafting a QB. I just think it makes sense given the success of a few teams that have been in similar situation as we have.

Please name the few teams that have been in similar situation that had success by drafting a LT in the first round and a QB in the second round as you suggested.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by Audi

Please name the few teams that have been in similar situation that had success by drafting a LT in the first round and a QB in the second round as you suggested.

I meant teams in similar situations as us in general. Coming from a losing season, having strong defenses, and trying to rebuild. And by similar I mean similar, not the same situation. Well, the Dolphins are just about the same situation as I'm advocating for, drafting a franchise LT, and then taking a 2nd QB (Henne).

Now Baltimore didn't draft a first round tackle until last year, but they build a good line for Flacco's first year (picking up Gaither, and I believe Birk). I don't think their line was as bad as our when they drafted Flacco.

The Jets build a hell of a line before drafting Sanchez. They have two first-rounders they picked up (Mangold, Ferguson) and acquired Faneca in free agency.

Drafting a LT in the first round is not the only way to build a line, but given the fringe talent in FA (unrestricted) it's a good way to start the rebuilding process.

[luke4twenty]

I think we should take LT with the first rounder. I am not sold on Clausen or Bradford. Take a guy later on, or develop Colt, or let JC play a year under Shanny. Don't forget, maybe we can trade up and get Locker next year...lol.

[Audi]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

I meant teams in similar situations as us in general. Coming from a losing season, having strong defenses, and trying to rebuild. And by similar I mean similar, not the same situation. Well, the Dolphins are just about the same situation as I'm advocating for, drafting a franchise LT, and then taking a 2nd QB (Henne).

Now Baltimore didn't draft a first round tackle until last year, but they build a good line for Flacco's first year (picking up Gaither, and I believe Birk). I don't think their line was as bad as our when they drafted Flacco.

The Jets build a hell of a line before drafting Sanchez. They have two first-rounders they picked up (Mangold, Ferguson) and acquired Faneca in free agency.

Drafting a LT in the first round is not the only way to build a line, but given the fringe talent in FA (unrestricted) it's a good way to start the rebuilding process.

The Dolphins weren't successful with Henne. The Ravens and Jets have all demonstrated the value of a quarterback with multiple first round quarterbacks and both having participated in trading up for a first round quarterback.

[Lotus]

^ One might argue that the QB pickings this year are slim. After Bradford and Clausen, every other QB has serious red flags.

One might also argue that the tackle class this year is fairly deep. That is, one could pick up someone like Ducasse in the second round and turn him into a very reasonable LT, with seasoning time.

If these two arguments are true, then if we are to build a new offense around a new QB and new LT, drafting QB first and T second might be the best choice.

All that said, I'll dance if we come home from the draft with Okung instead of a first round QB.

[over the mountain]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

I meant teams in similar situations as us in general. Coming from a losing season, having strong defenses, and trying to rebuild. And by similar I mean similar, not the same situation. Well, the Dolphins are just about the same situation as I'm advocating for, drafting a franchise LT, and then taking a 2nd QB (Henne).

ruhskins, im sorry to be commenting on so many of your posts today buddy.

a good counter point to the miami scenario are the falcons. who selected matt ryan then sam baker.

who would you rather have? matt ryan and sam baker or chad henne and jake long? imo i dont really look at history or what worked or didnt work for other teams. nothing is the similar enough to warrant giving much weight to comparison analysis imo.

for every manning, there is a leaf. for every chris samuels, there is a mike williams. for every brady, there is a well .... a shit ton of 6th round qbs who didnt make it.

but i think you get my point. what worked or didnt work for the dolphins or falcons in 2008 or 2007 doesnt carry much weight to me when im making my fan opinion of how the skins should proceed.

ps/edit - i thought the qb v lt debate has been one of the more intriguing ones going on the past few months.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Audi

Please name the few teams that have been in similar situation that had success by drafting a LT in the first round and a QB in the second round as you suggested.

2008 Dolphins, but first, why don't you name all the teams that have been in a similar situation who have had success, period.

[SirClintonPortis]

Originally Posted by Audi

Drew Brees was taken #32. Now is he as a second round quarterback the rule or the exception? In the last fifteen years, the only second round quarterbacks to amount to anything close to being a successful starter are Jake Plummer and Drew Brees. And Jake Plummer was a seasoned veteran by the time he started being respectable.

I was hinting at him being the exception. DUHHHHH. Read the whole damn post next time.

[Audi]

Originally Posted by SirClintonPortis

I was hinting at him being the exception. DUHHHHH. Read the whole damn post next time.

It's kind of hard when the rest of your post doesn't make sense in any sort of context.

"And Drew Brees was also a second rounder. Draft position does not tell the individual player's skill abilities, it just represents how people viewed their likeliness to fail. Good 2nd round QBs probably come around the QB draft class is deep. "

Good 2nd round QBs probably come around what? When the QB draft is deep? If the QB draft is deep? Probably? That's the opposite of having an exception.

[SirClintonPortis]

Originally Posted by Audi

It's kind of hard when the rest of your post doesn't make sense in any sort of context.

"And Drew Brees was also a second rounder. Draft position does not tell the individual player's skill abilities, it just represents how people viewed their likeliness to fail. Good 2nd round QBs probably come around the QB draft class is deep. "

Good 2nd round QBs probably come around what? When the QB draft is deep? If the QB draft is deep? Probably? That's the opposite of having an exception.

"When" would be the right word. This is what I get for typing too fast. Not every draft is deep in QBs going in the first round.

And second rounders are obviously expected to fail on a more frequent basis than first rounders, although what actually happens depends on the individual players.

[Audi]

Originally Posted by SirClintonPortis

"When" would be the right word. This is what I get for typing too fast. Not every draft is deep in QBs going in the first round.

And second rounders are obviously expected to fail on a more frequent basis than first rounders, although what actually happens depends on the individual players.

Your post still makes no sense.

The 2001 NFL Draft saw Michael Vick go as the #1 quarterback. Drew Brees was second at #32. The 2001 NFL Draft produced no other meaningful quarterback. How was that draft deep enough at the quarterback position that would lead you to make such a bold statement?

"Good 2nd round QBs probably come around when the QB draft class is deep."

Do you have any evidence of this?