Obama Care

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

To me, making the decision to go to war with Iraq with questionable purposes, without an exit strategy, and without an end, is far worst than this Health Care bill.

In terms of immediate loss of U.S. life the Iraq War decision is certainly worse. However how many lives did we save in the process, be they U.S., Iraqi, or possibly other nations that could've been a victim of terrorism sponsored or funded by Saddam or people murdered directly by Saddam and his regime. The Kurds are certainly glad we overthrew Saddam.

In terms of money, this health care bill is likely to be far worse than expenditures on the Iraq War in overall burden to the National Debt.

I agree with you that the country is certainly not going into a revolution or the world stop spinning on it's axis because of this law. However, with this new law we will see a further erosion in personal freedoms/personal choice, further intrusion into the private secor by the federal government, further expansion of the federal government's power over the states, increased taxes and an increase in the National Debt. Providing health coverage for the uninsured, working through the pre-existing conditions issues, and allowing more competition for health coverage could've been done in a different way.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

In terms of immediate loss of U.S. life the Iraq War decision is certainly worse. However how many lives did we save in the process, be they U.S., Iraqi, or possibly other nations that could've been a victim of terrorism sponsored or funded by Saddam or people murdered directly by Saddam and his regime. The Kurds are certainly glad we overthrew Saddam.

In terms of money, this health care bill is likely to be far worse than expenditures on the Iraq War in overall burden to the National Debt.

I agree with you that the country is certainly not going into a revolution or the world stop spinning on it's axis because of this law. However, with this new law we will see a further erosion in personal freedoms/personal choice, further intrusion into the private secor by the federal government, further expansion of the federal government's power over the states, increased taxes and an increase in the National Debt. Providing health coverage for the uninsured, working through the pre-existing conditions issues, and allowing more competition for health coverage could've been done in a different way.

Would you agree that Barack Obama won the presidency chiefly because of voter discontent over the war? There were a number of factors that led to his victory, no doubt. But in my mind, at the top of the list was Iraq. Polls were running heavily against the war by the 2008 election -- and the Republican response? Nominate a man who suggested we might be there "a hundred" more years.

As defiant as conservatives accuse the democrats of being with regard to health care, the GOP was just as defiant in the face of public opinion about the war in Iraq.

Assuming everything comes up roses in Iraq -- and that's an awfully big "if" -- would it be worth it if the price we had to pay was a Marxist in the White House who paved the way for nationalized health care?

[budw38]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Would you agree that Barack Obama won the presidency chiefly because of voter discontent over the war? There were a number of factors that led to his victory, no doubt. But in my mind, at the top of the list was Iraq. Polls were running heavily against the war by the 2008 election -- and the Republican response? Nominate a man who suggested we might be there "a hundred" more years.

As defiant as conservatives accuse the democrats of being with regard to health care, the GOP was just as defiant in the face of public opinion about the war in Iraq.

Assuming everything comes up roses in Iraq -- and that's an awfully big "if" -- would it be worth it if the price we had to pay was a Marxist in the White House who paved the way for nationalized health care?

Where is it written in our Constitution that " we " can not buy health Insurance ? Do any of our states prohibit individuals from buying health ins. ? Most , if not all of the people on this site have stated that they were for reform , just would have liked a smaller , more direct bill . I think much of the concern is that the HC Bill could lead to higher debt , like we have in SS & MC . I think all of us want our elected to make good sound policy on everything from education , health , transportation , safe water , food ect. Hope this HC bill helps everyone that NEEDS help , not reward many who care nothing about / self/counrty ect. Nothing is for free and sometimes , we get what we pay for .

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Would you agree that Barack Obama won the presidency chiefly because of voter discontent over the war? There were a number of factors that led to his victory, no doubt. But in my mind, at the top of the list was Iraq. Polls were running heavily against the war by the 2008 election -- and the Republican response? Nominate a man who suggested we might be there "a hundred" more years.

Agreed here. The GOP and the Bush Admin didn't effectively communicate on Iraq, the American people don't have the patience for a conflict like this, and McCain was certainly a less than stellar candidate.

As defiant as conservatives accuse the democrats of being with regard to health care, the GOP was just as defiant in the face of public opinion about the war in Iraq.

The difference here is that once the decision to go to Iraq was made, it was a requirement to win. No going back until Iraq was stabilized. The GOP had to be defiant and complete the job or it would've been disaster for our foreign policy and the safety of U.S. citizens long-term. Regardless of the politcal consequences.

The Dems hadn't completed the Obaminationcare bill, they could've pulled back, made concessions, etc. I even did the math, in a post earlier in this thread I believe, just giving a tax credit or voucher for the uninusred would've been dramatically more cost effective and kept the fed control out of the system. But to your post below, and I agree 100% this isn't about health care, it's about the left in this country making a larger voting block more dependent on gov't and solidifying themselves as the Politboru

Assuming everything comes up roses in Iraq -- and that's an awfully big "if" -- would it be worth it if the price we had to pay was a Marxist in the White House who paved the way for nationalized health care?

Knowing what we know now, considering the devestating effect this Admin & Congress are having on the National Debt and the economy, considering the long-term damage to our foreign policy, and the erosion of personal liberty & freedoms with the HC law just the beginning (if the GOP doesn't regain control of at least the House or Senate in Nov.) then the answer is absolutely not.

Bush should've made a top priority to rebuild the HUMINT component of our intel services in the Middle East and use covert ops to keep Saddam under wraps until hard evidence of WMDs or nukes was uncovered.